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American Hinoki 1-ply review (AW-8) |
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Posted: 03/10/2008 at 2:31pm |
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Just got the blade from ahinoki (http://www.badeola.com/ahtest/). Sealed it lightly. Review will follow. Here is a couple of pics (before the rubbers)
http://img238.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ttahaw8aki6.jpg http://img219.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ttahaw8bno9.jpg Weight 80 g Thickness 8.5 mm Handle: let's call it pseudo-anatomic Name: AHAW-8 or AW-8 |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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tiehwen
Premier Member Joined: 11/22/2006 Location: Bukan Bumiputra Status: Offline Points: 6434 |
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the An. handle looks/is pretty "Raw" but can be sanded to suit ur liking. Not even an issue here as per my "sanding" experience...
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Yes, I did it a tiny bit already to smooth some edges. The balsa handle is extremely soft... I have put the rubbers on - two Hurricane 3 Provincials. Perhaps they are a bit too heavy for this blade, it feels a bit head heavy with them, but we will see... if they don't fit, I have a couple of other rubbers to use. |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Here is part 1 of my review. And it begins with...
I am a bit scared now (ta-dah!)... Here is why. I liked how the blade plays... however I certainly should try other rubbers on it, Hurricane are still too thick. Not enough control, not enough feeling. No vibration from the blade though, which is great in my book! The 1-ply Hinoki is famous for the softness of touch and, man, they are not kidding. Softness is there, blocking is superb, and at the same time you could attack as well. One thing I noticed though is when I hit from far away and miss the sweet spot, the sound is strange... as if the blade (or the ball) is cracked... Now why I am scared. Here is why: if i play more with better suited rubbers and like it even more, and start playing better... then this really feels like crossing over. Using a custom blade in this case means that to go back to regular blades is very very hard. Why? In the middle of the practice I decided to switch back to my 729 RITC V-6, and let me tell you, that was really tough. As I mentioned before on V-6 thread, switching to it after my carbon T-4 was a breeze, took me less than a minute. However, when you go back to it after soft, thick, one-ply Hinoki... whole different ballgame, my friends. Took me perhaps half-hour to get finally reacquainted with V-6. So this is why I am scared - as seasterl said before, there is no going back after a good one-ply Hinoki blade... and what if I will want to go back or if I break the blade at the tourney or smth else... Well... I'll tell you more in the next installment. I think I will pull the rubbers off and put on something thinner and better - I have brand new Sriver EL and Mark V 30 to try. |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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holda
Gold Member Joined: 11/17/2007 Location: Russia Status: Offline Points: 1933 |
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that i s pretty much what i have wanted to say,too.
i,however,don't know which rubbers (what type) to use with these blades.medium,medium hard type i have a feeling should do well
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Thanks for the encouragement, buddy! How are you managing those feelings of indecision? I decided to pull the rubbers off my spare T-4 and put them on AW-8. They will be 729 Cream MRS FH + LKT Torrent BH. I will add another installment on Wednesday after the practice. |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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holda
Gold Member Joined: 11/17/2007 Location: Russia Status: Offline Points: 1933 |
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now i have 2 hinoki blades.one ply and 7 ply.both are excellent,and with 7 ply blade i have one hammond pro@ sheet and another joola tango.works fine.totally don't know how it is going to work,but i just ordered joola gp with the intention of putting them to 1 ply blade.i ordered in 2.0 thichkness.
as far as trying something esle...i don't want to buy any more blades,but ..at least for now...
or yeah,may be i can try joola gp with my acoustic,too.i don't know anyone in the club who would own acoustic.i could at least try another setup(acoustic+whatever rubbers)i don't like acoustic +tensor rubbers.too fast a combo
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GenomicsKnight
Gold Member Joined: 05/27/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1962 |
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Wait till you try a real Japanese Hinoki... |
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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I did! I played Darker Tanpan - but with different rubbers. I should say that the overall feeling is pretty darn close... |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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holda
Gold Member Joined: 11/17/2007 Location: Russia Status: Offline Points: 1933 |
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darker and Juic just raised their prices..juic,especially.used to be the cheapest one ply hinoki blade you could get
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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That's why I thought I'd try this one...
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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ahinoki
Member Joined: 02/23/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 65 |
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Hi guys ,
Just wanted to let you know I am getting my real site up and running at www.americanHinoki.com. I have added a FAQ section and a wood comparsion section. Will have more info and pictures up shortly. and JimT, I am glad that you like the blade for the most part and thanks for the purchase. ahinoki |
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Kevin, many thanks for the service - the blade is very good, even if not exactly my bag of chips... but who knows, maybe it is. I am putting new rubbers on it right now and will try it again on Wednesday. By the way, it could be just my prototype, but you lost about 5 mm of the blade's face height - as a result, when I put the pre-cut rubbers (from my spare T-4) on AW-8, they overhang by 5-6 mm and I had to cut them again. The handle length is proper - 100 mm, but it seems that the overall length of the blade is a bit less than usual. Was that intentional? |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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ahinoki
Member Joined: 02/23/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 65 |
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JimT
I only have one template for my shakehand blades and it is approx 156 mm from top of handle to tip of blade and about 147mm wide. And approx 257mm in total length. Close to butterflies Michael Maze blade (157x149) Is a t-4 an oversized blade ? I will put dimension info on my site. ahinoki |
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Hmm... no T-4 is certainly not an oversize... just a regular one. When I put it next to AW-8 they had the same dimensions. But the distance from the top of the handle (basically the lower edge of the rubber) to the top of the blade is less than on T-4. Not that it matters much - one can always leave a few mms of free space when gluing the rubbers on. |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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ahinoki
Member Joined: 02/23/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 65 |
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JimT
After you get done playing with the blade for a bit. Aside from posting the blade dimensions, let me know how I could better describe the playing characteristics. You have the first official AW-8 so any feedback will help as I don't want to misrepresent the blades. I did just get an order for 2 AW-8 from my prototype tester. But every player is different. How would you describe your playing style ? ahinoki |
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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It's kinda mixed. I used to play allround game with some elements of defense and occasional attack when opportunity presented itself. Now I am trying for more aggression - quick blocking, counter-drive, control looping close to the table. I try to attack more often - mostly from a couple of steps back from the table. Loop/attack from FH is not my strong suit but again, I am working on that. My current USATT rating is around 1800 (a long long time ago when I was young and spry, it was around 2000-2100). I play from mid-zone (2-6 feet away) quite often by control looping or by counter-attack. Unfortunately, when some energy is gone (which often happens midway thru a tourney or by the end of a practice session) I often find myself slipping into the old allround/defensive habits (20 years of doing the same thing make themselves known); I become more rigid, stop attacking, and start pushing/chopping/defending waiting for a mistake from the opponent which quite often doesn't come before mine. So control in the short game is very important to me - that's why I cannot use all-offensive rubbers with less control or fast and heavy uncontrollable blades. |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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ahinoki
Member Joined: 02/23/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 65 |
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JimT
When you said: " Unfortunately, when some energy is gone (which often happens midway thru a tourney or by the end of a practice session) I often find myself slipping into the old allround/defensive habits (20 years of doing the same thing make themselves known); I become more rigid, stop attacking, and start pushing/chopping/defending waiting for a mistake from the opponent which quite often doesn't come before mine. So control in the short game is very important to me - that's why I cannot use all-offensive rubbers with less control or fast and heavy uncontrollable blades. " I would swear you are describing my tournament game style. Funny I have learned to stay far away from fast rubbers. In fact I really like the slow sticky chinese rubber. And I have experimented with making the "slowest" possible blade. Even made one with cork as one outer ply with the other outer ply being balsa. It was almost too slow even for me |
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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OK, installment # 2:
I truly don't know what to do with this blade. As I
promised, I put Cream MRS Red 2.2 on the FH, and LKT Torrent 2.0 Black on BH,
and went to my regular practice [small weekly league tourney] at
the club.
I was really really sick (got an excuse!) but I
persevered. I began with winning a game from a 2100 player whom I would
always dutifully lose 0:3. Then I lost some more... then I won a few... then
lost again. Overall, the tournament performance was smth to be expected. Not
to mention that the lighting in that gym is horrible... many a point I lost
simply because I couldn't properly see the ball up in the air.
Now about the blade. As I mentioned before, it's
really good. The real downside for me is that fully switching to it will
require some considerable investment of time as well as encouraging my inner
daredevil.
To begin with I will need to change my BH game rather substantially. The bounce of the ball during BH game was often unexpected - mostly when attacking or looping. Then again it might be the rubber - Torrent has a catapult effect so... Short game, pushing, slicing, looping not too far
from the table are perfect. If you want to do some chopping, that works
terrific too. BH blocking - not as great... this is one of the things that
need to be adjusted rather substantially and relearned if you start playing
with any one-ply Hinoki, I presume. Don't get me wrong, the block itself is a
beaut, but the proper placement is often a bit off since you are playing with
a very different racket here.
Also, the handle is made of balsa which is a really
cool wood but it never slides in your hand as I expect from my other blades'
handles when I do smth like BH loop - balsa is just too unfinished and too
non-slippery for that. Which helps sometimes,.. but sometimes it hurts
too.
From far away, I haven't got a proper feeling for
it yet. Sometimes when you hit the ball so that the rubber bottoms out you
get this strange cracking sound as if the ball is broken... I must be the
hitting in the "off-sweetspot" zone.
Also when executing BH smash I do not get the
proper smash feeling, if you know what I mean. Softness of the blade kinda
steals that from me. As a result, quite a few misses from there - perhaps I
need a litle more heft in this blade or it's again a matter of
adjustment.
A lot of adjustment, though. So I am
perplexed...
Here is what I intend to do a) turn the racket over and play with Cream on BH... see if that helps.. who knows perhaps it is all because of Torrent; b) try and borrow my friend's Tanpan. Maybe having a smoother/sliperyier handle will solve some problems, Then I will need to make a hard decision. Please feel free to comment - I will be grateful for advice! |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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sbd1
Super Member Joined: 08/14/2006 Status: Offline Points: 137 |
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JimT,
Any time one blade was replaced with the new one there is a udjustment to be made.You have to get used to it and that will not come in a week time.Some elements of your game will work fine others may not. Just give it some time to get used to it .Cracking sound is normal thing with the 1 ply blades. Good Luck with the new blade Borko&Son ***Power is Nothing Without Control*** |
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Borko, I agree with you wholeheartedly. The question is this: there are hundreds of blades (thousands really) - you cannot simply try and play with even a fraction of them, then make a decision and stick with it for some protracted period of time. Life is, alas, too short. Also, I don't want to spend months of my life doing even a small portion of that (and in a few years I might not be able to play TT as well as I do now because time is running out and I am not getting any younger). Therefore I have a decision to make and relatively quick, too. Do I try and break my habits (some of them rather deeply immersed), adjust my technique and my overall style to suit the new blade? It will take some time and it will probably mean never reverting back to my other blades - as I mentioned before, making that switch is pretty difficult. The fact that I am not immediately returning back to my previous setup already speaks volumes about quality of the AW-8. It is a very very good blade, and I enjoyed playing with it tremendously. Perhaps it is not 100% suited to my game at the moment, but then again what is? Thanks for the cracking sound clarification - some of the guys I played thought the ball was cracked but I was pretty sure that it was the blade making that sound. ahinoki graciously tells me that he is quite willing to replace it or even reimburse me (that would be not fair considering his time and expenses, so I won't go for that). I am not even sure now that it's the right thing to do - I definitely want to play with it some more! I want to see if I can improve my offensive game; defense is already much better with it than with any of my previous setups. So I will invest another full practice session on Friday, and I will be back with installment #3. That's a promise! |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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I think I know why the older rubbers overhang a bit. Here are the dimensions of AW-8 and of two other blades blade - overall length/handle lentgh AW-8 257/103 T-4 260/101 V-6 260/102 So the difference for the length of the blade's face is about 4 mm. It's next to nothing, and it's of no consequence whatsoever - I just wanted to post the dimensions. |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Okey-dokey, here comes installment #3:
I blame society, I blame TV, and I blame the vast government conspiracy... ok, I am kidding, I only blame my flu and LKT Torrent with its unpredictable catapult effect. Torrent is off now and I have just replaced it with Sriver EL 2.1 (after the practice, though). Anyway, I am keeping this blade! It plays superbly and it is growing on me faster than mold on NYC subway walls... I am just a fountain of metaphors today, aren't I... well, I blame my parents and I blame society... oh not again. I have adjusted my game and almost everything works now. Perhaps the quick attack topspin on the forehand lacks a bit of speed but that could be just me, I was never a fast topspin guy... The only problem that I need advice with (perhaps ahinoki himself will help me here) is the fragility of the cork handle. Every single time I bump the bottom of the blade into the table (and that happens roughly once every 1-2 hours) a little piece of cork chips off. Perhaps I should buy a sheet of thin cork in a crafts & arts store, cut a little piece out of it and glue it at on the bottom of the handle - so that the next time I hit the table, that extra "buffer" piece will protect the original handle... does that sound reasonable? I wonder which glue I should use? Please let me know what you guys think. Perhaps Borko himself will also weigh in on this issue. |
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ahinoki
Member Joined: 02/23/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 65 |
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JimT
First off I am glad that you have gotten used to the blade. A couple things you can try on the cork handle. 1. To repair existing gouges, go to home depot and get some elmers "golden oak" wood filler. And use it to fix existing gouges. If you want a really good color match you have to get some "natural" color wood filler and mix with the golden oak until you get the best color match. 2. To protect the bottom after fixing also at Home Depot or crafts stores get some cork sheeting either adhesive backed or not. Cut out a section that fits the butt of the handle and glue it on using 5min epoxy or any wood glue or even super glue. If the cork sheet is adhesive backed you might not need to glue it but probably will, try no glue first and see what happens. ahinoki |
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seasterl
Super Member Joined: 12/27/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 286 |
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JimT: I learned that it might take trying a few different rubbers to find the perfect match. I have used LKT on my one-plies, too, and it's not the idea rubber. The topsheet is not bad, but the sponge is far from the best. Sriver-EL should start to work out better for you. Most of my favorite rubbers have worked well on my blade, but not all. This is the way it is with most blades, IMO. Anyway, continue to experiment with other rubbers on it as you get the chance. The super-soft feel can masquarade as being slow at first, but the more you play it, the more power you should find in it. It's incredible value in this day when some one-ply blades cost much more. But then again, one-ply blades is not always suitable for all players and all styles of play, either.
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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Thank you guys! I will go to Home Depot today to get the filler and the cork. I plan to do some more practicing on Monday if I am still alive then - this time with Sriver EL on my backhand.
Also: one of the players got interested in my blade and we played together about 5-10 minutes - he was playing AW-8 and I was playing my V-6... I didn't have such a hard time switching back to V-6. Perhaps only a couple of first minutes were bad and then I was back in the game. So it's getting better on that front as well! |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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I went to Home Depot and bought a small can of Minwax "golden oak" Plastic Wood filler (about $3). They didn't have any cork however, so I drove another mile to the arts&crafts store (A.C.Moore) and got myself some corkboard (not the real cork but more like the pressed cork particle board) about 3-4 mm thick ($3 more).
It worked pretty well - I used my regular X-acto knife to cut out a rough approximation of a buffer piece, then cut it some more, then glued it on, sanded it down, and then filled the cracks with the filler. Looks great! Let's hope it holds well during the actual games! |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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ahinoki
Member Joined: 02/23/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 65 |
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JimT
If you find the fix not durable enough, instead of cork sheeting get some rubber sheeting from a hardware store. I used to ding the edges of my blades quite a bit and tried everything from edge tape, epoxy to hard rubber, and the rubber worked the best. But remember you are adding weight. ahinoki |
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JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
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what exactly is this rubber sheeting - kind of a rubberized tape? |
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Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
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ahinoki
Member Joined: 02/23/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 65 |
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Jimt
Check out ace hardware: http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1272768 It usually comes in black but this is redish color ahinoki |
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