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Attention: All Single Ply Hinoki Club Members |
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Chairman Meow 
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Joined: 10/04/2016 Location: Hell, Michigan Status: Offline Points: 290 |
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 Topic: Attention: All Single Ply Hinoki Club MembersPosted: 05/27/2020 at 3:10pm |
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I haven't played with Rakza 7, so I can't speak from experience. However, it will assuredly feel quite different than how it felt on a carbon blade. If you have any used sheets of rubber you know well lying around (an old Fastarc maybe), you could glue one on the one-ply and see how it plays. That could help you extrapolate the behavior of the blade to Rakza 7, since Fastarc is similar in hardness and 'type'. Every one-ply is different and every person's preferences and playstyle are different, so you really should give it a try with a rubber you are familiar with to isolate how the single ply changes the characteristics.
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-1 ply Cypress 11.5mm "The Castigator"
-H3 Prov. Blue Sponge 2.2mm 41 deg. -H3 Prov. Orange Sponge 2.1mm 37 deg |
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21saves
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Joined: 05/27/2020 Location: Singapore Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Posted: 05/27/2020 at 1:01pm |
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Chairman Meow - yes, this is precise my concern that max Rakza7 could be too fast and bouncy on a single-ply hinoki.
The alternative for me is to stick to my all time favorite rubber Fastarc G1, black 2.0mm, that has a good balance of power and control. It is just that a few month ago, I tried Rakza7 using my friend's carbon blade and was surprised that it enabled me to play a much more aggressive and attacking game. Maybe Rakza7 max would pair better on a carbon blade and not so good on one-ply hinoki? What do you think?
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Chairman Meow
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Joined: 10/04/2016 Location: Hell, Michigan Status: Offline Points: 290 |
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Posted: 05/27/2020 at 11:55am |
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It's really personal preference but Rakza 7 is a somewhat fast and bouncy rubber, so it could be difficult to control. You can glue the rubber on without cutting and bounce it around a few times to make sure it's something you can play with.
On another note, I'm really jealous of that Darker single ply. Unfortunately I can't bring myself to spend more than $100 on a blade (and 10mm shakehand is harder to find), so I have to resort to making my own with nowhere near the skills of some of the professionals on this forum.
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-1 ply Cypress 11.5mm "The Castigator"
-H3 Prov. Blue Sponge 2.2mm 41 deg. -H3 Prov. Orange Sponge 2.1mm 37 deg |
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21saves
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Joined: 05/27/2020 Location: Singapore Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Posted: 05/27/2020 at 10:08am |
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Wow, yours is the very high quality one - Imperial Hinoki, must have cost you a bomb :)
I bought the normal JPen Speed 90 version as it's my first 1-ply hinoki. I also bought the Kase grip version of Apex21, to try and train my RPB.
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Magic_M
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Joined: 05/31/2012 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 2220 |
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Posted: 05/27/2020 at 9:48am |
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I also bought a nice Kiso-Hinoki 1-ply a few days ago
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21saves
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Joined: 05/27/2020 Location: Singapore Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Posted: 05/27/2020 at 8:53am |
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Hi Wappak, looks like this club is somewhat inactive in the last few years.
Anyway, I have also recently bought a few hinoki blades - Darker90, and Armstrong Apex21, after hearing so much good stuff about 1-ply hinoki. I plan to put my newly bought Rakza7 max (FH) on Darker90. Just want to ask for advise whether is it ok to put a max thickness rubber on 1-ply hinkoi? |
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wappak
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Joined: 05/05/2019 Location: rising sun Status: Offline Points: 62 |
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Posted: 08/07/2019 at 11:05am |
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can i join this club? heres mine pp taiwan yellow cypress 8mm, this hinoki blade is hard compared to other hinoki but still has that hinoki feel on it.
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onehander
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Joined: 07/17/2015 Location: CA Status: Offline Points: 71 |
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Posted: 06/15/2017 at 12:56pm |
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This is from Butterfly North America website. Apparently it's not enough, so they created the hologram dot.
CLUES FOR BLADESCareful, fake products are sometimes more difficult to identify as such when it comes to blades. Counterfeit blades are often of lesser craftsmanship and value – but it can take a keen eye to find the clues. Fakes become rather obvious though at the table – Butterfly blades have unique playing characteristics that no counterfeit products can match.  The Coloring In the picture above we see an original blade (right) and a fake Zhang Jike FL blade (left). The fake blade is lighter (due to inexpensive veneers) with a less even and darker shade of blue on the grip and the print. The print itself is minutely slanted.  Fake lens on the left – Original on the rightThe Bottom Lens The picture above serves as an example of lesser workmanship. The lens of the fake blade (left) is less intricate plate and glued on the bottom of the blade. The original lens (right) is made from brushed aluminum and integrated firmly into the handle. Only obvious in use: Playing characteristics Sometimes counterfeits can be more difficult to spot. The next example shows a Zhang Jike Super ZLC blade sent back by a customer disappointed by the performance of this product. Fake blade may look good, but they always feel “liveless” compared to genuine Butterfly blades. Butterfly blades consist of hand-selected wooden veneers that are specifically designed to work in combination with each other to create a certain feel and character of every blade. A fake blade will never match these characteristics.  Fake Blade – no such serial numberThe Serial Number Imprinted on all Japanese blades is a serial code. This code entails information on the production dates and parameters. Any certified Butterfly partner or retailer will be able to provide you with information regarding the authenticity of a serial number. The serial number in the left picture is plain faked – it does not exist.  Fake Blade – no such serial numberPrint or Sticker? Watch for the graphic design Above we see a counterfeit Zhang Jike Super ZLC blade, bought at a fraction of the price for the original blade. Needless to say, the customer was disappointed and showed this blade to us, which we could quickly identify as a fake. Note the structure of the lens on the handle compared to the original on the right. The print looks like a sticker and is mirror inverted and slightly slanted. The coloring is close, but not the same as on the original.  Original Zhang Jike Super ZLCOften with fakes, we notice the print on the blade to be visibly just a sticker (which may be slanted – just like here). On genuine blades, the logo and graphics are printed onto the blade. |
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soung1234
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Joined: 06/12/2017 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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Posted: 06/14/2017 at 11:49pm |
I see... Is there any way of verifying it's a genuine blade if it doesn't have the dot? |
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onehander
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Posted: 06/14/2017 at 7:44pm |
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The one with a dot is the later version. The dot is an anti-counterfeiting hologram. When Butterfly stopped sponsoring Ryu Seung Min, the very latest version is Cypress G-Max.
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soung1234
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Posted: 06/14/2017 at 6:47pm |
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I was looking at the RSM Max/G-Max, looks like there are two versions of each. Some have different logos, and some have a dot on the handle... What's the difference?
I found this link, if anyone can translate Chinese... http://www.butterfly-china.com/cn/?p=42&a=view&r=185 |
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tiehwen
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Joined: 11/22/2006 Location: Bukan Bumiputra Status: Offline Points: 6434 |
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Posted: 06/11/2017 at 3:15pm |
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kakapo is LOADED.
He isn't even a Jpen-er. Damn... Edited by tiehwen - 06/11/2017 at 3:17pm |
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photino
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Joined: 06/17/2012 Location: US Status: Offline Points: 179 |
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Posted: 06/11/2017 at 3:14pm |
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great collection, i have four of them....
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EJ-turned blade collector
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kakapo
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Joined: 02/24/2013 Location: Mordor Status: Offline Points: 3430 |
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Posted: 06/11/2017 at 2:24pm |
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Some 1 ply Hinoki BTY JPen blades.
 Edited by kakapo - 06/11/2017 at 2:34pm |
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Def play grey grip 94gr, Venus 2 blue 2,2, Neubauer KO extreme 1,3mm
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DLC1325
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Joined: 02/15/2016 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 723 |
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Posted: 05/19/2017 at 3:58pm |
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I got a 1-ply Bamboo blade from Kevin and it is quite awesome! I know it isn't hinoki, but it is 1-ply from American Hinoki.
 I'm actually putting it up for sale on the forum only because I fell in love with my Waldner JO shape. |
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Tinykin
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Joined: 10/30/2003 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 2337 |
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Posted: 03/31/2017 at 8:50pm |
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Same thing happened to my Ahinoki WRC. My wood turner friend glued it back together. It had no effect on the playing characteristics that I could discern.
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Blade:
Darker Speed90 Rubber Fh and Bh DHS Hurricane 3, 39/38deg Delusion is an asset |
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DLC1325
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Joined: 02/15/2016 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 723 |
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Posted: 03/31/2017 at 8:35pm |
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I only have condolences to offer, shinshiro!
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Chairman Meow
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Joined: 10/04/2016 Location: Hell, Michigan Status: Offline Points: 290 |
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Posted: 03/31/2017 at 3:11pm |
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You can use a thin layer of epoxy to put it back together- make sure you use something like a vise to hold it in place and with constant pressure. If excess epoxy comes out of the crack, you can gently sand it off. You also have to make sure to keep the larger splinters that may come off to preserve the continuity and evenness of the blade.
To prevent future splits, you can put edge tape on your paddle and then some foam mounting tape on that. This only adds 1-3 grams. I have even seen people use RTV silicone, although this is heavier. I personally use the foam mounting tape method, and add an eighth-inch thick layer of industrial shock absorbing rubber on top. It's pretty much bulletproof, but very heavy. Edited by Chairman Meow - 03/31/2017 at 3:12pm |
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-1 ply Cypress 11.5mm "The Castigator"
-H3 Prov. Blue Sponge 2.2mm 41 deg. -H3 Prov. Orange Sponge 2.1mm 37 deg |
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shinshiro
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Joined: 09/21/2016 Location: Brazil Status: Offline Points: 243 |
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Posted: 03/31/2017 at 12:01pm |
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Only an update here:
The worst nightmare for a 1 ply hinoki user has hapenned to me... Yes...I split my blade in two...and only on my 3th training... Between one exercise and another, I accidentally dropped my blade from a little above the table level, and it split. Even with rubbers on both sides and expoy on edges, it has split...  (I put some force into the blade to show where it split. Without force, the split is discrete) If there is someone who already had the same experience, I'm open to suggestions to how to repair it. I also e-mailed Kevin to see if he can give me some advices. Sorry to detour a little from the thread...
Edited by shinshiro - 03/31/2017 at 12:02pm |
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DLC1325
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Posted: 03/27/2017 at 3:37pm |
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It looks very nice!
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shinshiro
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Joined: 09/21/2016 Location: Brazil Status: Offline Points: 243 |
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Posted: 03/27/2017 at 3:26pm |
I think just a few of them noticed that I was with a backhand rubber (I started using this blade only last week because I was waiting for the rubbers to arrive). My training partner said that I was getting used quite quick with RBP (I have never done this before), but I told him some weeks before that I was planing on trying this, so he was not surprised. But I'm almost sure that when I get to play with more experienced people, they will get a little suprised with Jpen RPB  Here is a new pic of my blade, now with rubbers, but I want to show the edges of the blade. I have put some layers of epoxy resin to protect the wood (suggested by Kevin from American Hinoki), since I've heard that Hinoki is very fragile and I don't want to split it in half if I hit the table....  I think the result is prety nice since I had no experience working with any kind of resin before. Of course there are some defects (I could not make the resin to be 100% uniform, as you can see some salience near "WRC" for example), but for my total amateur skills I'm very satisfied with the result
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DLC1325
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Posted: 03/26/2017 at 2:22am |
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Very nice, shinshiro. This looks a lot like the first Jpen I had (Yinhe 989) where I sanded the index finger shoulder really deep like this. Very nice for RPB and so comfortable. I think I like 9mm the best as you can tell from the two Miyabis in my signature, and I've been considering contacting Kevin to talk about designs.
Do a lot of people question you about doing RPB on a 9mm Jpen blade? I get it all the time as if its physically impossible. I just have to show them the power after their doubting.
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shinshiro
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Joined: 09/21/2016 Location: Brazil Status: Offline Points: 243 |
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Posted: 03/09/2017 at 5:30pm |
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My new (and probably last) blade just arrived!
    This is a customized 1 ply that I ordered from Kevin (American Hinoki, or AHinoki as he is known here). I asked him to make an asymmetrical blade shape near the handle because I want to do RBP with a Jpen (please note that I'm left handed). With a normal shape Jpen RBP is very unconfortable because you can't angle the blade very much since the index finger blocks it. I also asked him to make a very light blade, under 70g. And he did it at 64g!! Super light for a 1 ply!! Due to low weight, he rated this blade as ALL (wich is perfect for me since I'm a beginner) Unfortunately I can't test it because my rubbers haven't arrived yet, it will probably take some weeks  .This was my first customized blade and I'm very happy with the result (tough haven't played yet). I recommend Kevin!
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ChichoFicho
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Joined: 06/24/2009 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 2118 |
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Posted: 03/05/2017 at 4:39pm |
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I have seen Cypress Max/RSM with worse grains than that KKT D50.
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Darker Speed 70
Hammond FA Speed Tyotokusen |
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DLC1325
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Posted: 03/02/2017 at 11:41am |
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I got mine from TT11 and it's still on sale right now:
http://www.tabletennis11.com/other_eng/nittaku-miyabi |
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Kolev
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Joined: 10/04/2004 Location: Belgium Status: Offline Points: 1529 |
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Posted: 03/02/2017 at 4:56am |
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Damn, I should have.....
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Hallmark Carbon Extreme (x3)
FH: D05/G1/RX BH: Z2/D64/Ω7Pro |
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DLC1325
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Posted: 03/02/2017 at 2:41am |
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The Miyabi is 80g, 9mm and the SOU is 79g, just under 8mm. Miyabi's handle is extremely comfortable especially for my larger hands.
Edited by DLC1325 - 03/02/2017 at 2:43am |
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Kolev
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Posted: 03/02/2017 at 2:23am |
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Congrats.Ive always had an eye on the Miyabi and can't forgive myself that I forgot to ask about it while visiting an official distributor shop in Kuala Lumpur few weeks ago, What is the weight of yours?
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Hallmark Carbon Extreme (x3)
FH: D05/G1/RX BH: Z2/D64/Ω7Pro |
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DLC1325
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Posted: 03/01/2017 at 2:54am |
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My official petition to the club:
  I play both Jpen and Shakehand, apparently equally well. H8s are on the SOU for now but TG2 Neos are on the way for a bit lighter setup. The SOU is stiffer than the Miyabi I guess due to the shape of the head, but it still doesn't make sense to me why that is. I cannot get enough of the feel of both blades. It makes playing very enjoyable. Lovely Hinoki!
Edited by DLC1325 - 03/01/2017 at 5:33pm |
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shinshiro
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Joined: 09/21/2016 Location: Brazil Status: Offline Points: 243 |
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Posted: 02/03/2017 at 9:04am |
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an update here
Yesterday I played for the first time with a single ply hinoki blade, a Kokutaku D-50 (previously I was using Galaxy 985). I was very curious to know how it would be, because hinoki wood is so praised by some people that it seems to have some "mystic" aura on it haha I will write some simpressions about the blade compraing with 985. It's important to say that I'm a beginner, so I don't have a very stable mechanics nor much feel for the ball and etc. It is just a beginner's point of view, so be aware that can be very imprecise / wrong.... Previous setup: Galaxy 985, 91g, about 8mm thickness, with Rasant Grip rubber Current setup: Kokutaku No.1 D-50, 83g, 9 mm thickness, with Rasant Grip rubber The first thing I noticed is how much different is the sound produced between the two. 985 has always a "TÁK" sound, and D-50 is more like "TÓF". It only "TÁKs" on faster strokes. I don't know if I was influenced by the sound, but I felt that D-50 was much softer than 985. D-50 seemed to have more dwell time. When I played with 985, it seemed that I was playing with an iron blade haha. But I don't know if I actually produced more spin with D-50. About speed, I got the impression that 985 is faster than D-50. On another hand, D-50 looks to have more gears - it seems to be slower on slow strokes, but produces good speed com faster strokes. 985 appears to be fast all the time. Since I'm not capable of doing a more detailed review, I will stop here, that's the only thing I can write =( But I hope it can be of some help (even if it's little) for other beginners that are curious to see how a hinoki blade is compared to a "regular" blade. |
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onehander wrote: