Renanos Hold review.

dragon kid wrote: BMonkey wrote: dragon kid wrote: Anybody try it on the BH?  I finally wore out the sheet I've had on my backhand. Just ordered another So how does it play there? have you tried with Andro Hexer by any chance? how do the two compare?

Well I tried Hexer out a couple of times and as I recall it was similar to Baracuda but faster (I've used Baracuda alot more). I feel that in the attack, both rubbers, Renanos Hold and Hexer, have very similar offensive capabilities but I think Renanos Hold is a touch harder so its performance ceiling is higher. I don't remember the spin well enough to tell you which one is spinnier but I can tell you both can hit beautiful shots. I think the lack of bounciness and linearity is particularly helpful on the backhand because the backhand is used more in a defensive role than the forehand, and the backhand has a smaller window for a correct stroke so it is easier to get "caught" out of position and you have to execute an improvised stroke and with a predictable rubber it is easier to improvise with success.

beeray1 wrote: ohhgourami wrote: peter79 wrote: Anton, Have you tried H3 National tuned with Parafin Oil? It's totally different from Provincial, more speed, more spin too. Not sure he has but I have with a much more powerful tuner than paraffin oil  Definitely much much more spin and speed   If your tuner is more powerful than Paraffin Oil, I'd hate to use a racket like yours haha. PO adds soooooo much speed. I go LIGHT on it, and keep glue buildup ON. I know people who do 3 layers on a bare sponge.   I don't know how people can handle it.   Anton, have you ever used Hammond X?   Best looper at my club always used it on his FH, switched to Beta, hated it, now goes back to Hammond X. Can you compare it to that speed/spin wise? (if you have used it)   I'm also 100% for Linear rubbers. Catapult is unnecccessary at our level. Even when Counter-looping. I feel like that's why I actually end up counter-looping in matches and not just in practice, because I pick equipment I can actually handle and I'm confident about doing shots. On my RPB, I'm using 729-3OEM, a 7 dollar rubber. I stuffed that loopers shots over and over again with my RPB. I Counter Looped his openings with my RPB. I don't even play penhold, it was the first time doing it in a long time. But I had control and predictability- 7 dollar rubber. Works for me

I didn't know you tooled around with Cpen. Cool! I just picked it up again due to this innovation. It makes it much easier. I think Cpen has a lot more options so I've always preferred to play that style but the difficulty of learning it initially kept me going back to shakehand. But with that grip I find it much easier.

Anyway, to answer your question: No, I haven't tried Hammond X. One of my training partners uses Hammond Pro Alpha on his RPB and loves it. But I can't make any comparisons between all the Hammonds, sorry.

i don't understand how you guys at decent level can play shake hand and penhold at different times. 

beeray1 wrote: I've always liked cpen because of that aso- it has more options. I feel like it's easier to be creative. That's why I like Xu Xin so much- he's a creative player.   Also, as far as the stroke itself, my RPB is actually better than my Shakehand BH when it comes to being an attacking tool. I will always stroke the ball with RPB automatically. Usually this looper will get a lot of BH blocks back along with some punches/hits... never counter loops from me when I play shake. But RPB makes my wrist angle almost automatic for just unwinding into the ball. I also like how free I feel over the table to do more things. The wrist is key here too. I'm actually giving it a serious go fora little bit I think.   I don't need the SueprCpen though, I like regular handles. I like using Traditional BH for blocking and punching too, but I'm more like 80% RPB. Really, what got me using Cpen this time was just the fact that as a blade, I think the Yasaka Extra is my favorite of all time, and I have my friends cpen one. I don't like it in shakehand... I've had it. Maybe its just this cut of wood, but this blade is just the most wonderful thing ever.

I totally agree regarding the YE. I haven't ever tried it shakehand, but the Cpen YE truly is "the most wonderful thing ever", for sure.

Anton Chigurh wrote: peter79 wrote: Anton Chigurh wrote: Oops... you said "speed". I didn't see that at first and wrote a long comparison of both. In terms of speed alone, I'd say that Renanos Hold is potentially faster but you have to work a little harder for it. Not like with the harder tacky rubbers, by any means... it's certainly easier to produce speed than Neo H3, for example. But there is also no Tenergy catapult there to "help" you. In the middle gears the Omegas feel faster because they don't require as much effort due to the catapult. But when I'm allowed to let a winner rip at full force, the Renanos Hold is faster. Anton, Have you tried H3 National tuned with Parafin Oil? It's totally different from Provincial, more speed, more spin too. I haven't tried it. I don't want to deal with the hassle of locating a "national" sheet, pay the (usually) ridiculous price, all the while wondering if it's legitimate. Then, I don't want to have to boost, worry about the proper amount, replicating it precisely each time I have to do it so I don't feel like I'm playing with a different rubber, and ultimately have my rubbers wear out faster. I had Renanos Hold on my forehand on my shakehand blade, but I'm going to try it out on my backhand on my SuperCpen blade. As far as hard tacky rubbers go, I've found Thor's to be my favorite. In fact, I'm playing with Thor's on my SuperCpen blade right now (on my forehand) and it does everything I ask of it... all without having to boost it. I've cheated on Thor's here and there but I keep coming back to it, which says something to me.

Believe me, H3 National is as fast as Thor even when the tuned effect is gone. But it produced much more spin.
First I use H3 National then switch to Thor because of great review in this forum.
Thor sometimes can produce not spinny loops and horrible when counter looping as most of them goes to net.
With H3 National I can do all kind of loops with same amount of spin, fast loop or slow loops.

Try it and you'll find the joyful of looping.

peter79 wrote: Believe me, H3 National is as fast as Thor even when the tuned effect is gone. .....

debraj wrote: peter79 wrote: Believe me, H3 National is as fast as Thor even when the tuned effect is gone. ..... HMM... can't!

Probably I'm used to H3, no other rubber which is more predictable and convincing to hit.
I thought Thor is the answer, chinese sticky tensor.
Producing as much spin as chinese tacky rubber, but faster.
Yes it's faster but not much, I would say my loop is very easily block compared to H3.
So I think I will never get a faster H3 subtitute from other brand, stop dreaming

Anton Chigurh wrote: debraj wrote: i don't understand how you guys at decent level can play shake hand and penhold at different times.  i can change rubbers or blades or anyhing, but can't think of changing my grip, and be considered a serious player still. for me a player makes that choice only once, when they start the game.  I wouldn't consider myself at a "decent" level. I have started beating some 1700+ players recently (but only while playing shakehand), but I still don't consider that to be very good. So I just try to have fun by trying a lot of different things. I've actually learned a lot about the game in this way. Although I'm "competitive" when I play (i.e., I like winning more than losing and try to do it whenever possible), I don't actually compete in tournaments. My main reason for getting better is simply that the better I get the more fun this game becomes. So basically, I do whatever is fun (while still trying to improve). And Cpen is a lot of fun.

peter79 wrote: ohhgourami wrote: peter79 wrote: Anton, Have you tried H3 National tuned with Parafin Oil? It's totally different from Provincial, more speed, more spin too. Not sure he has but I have with a much more powerful tuner than paraffin oil  Definitely much much more spin and speed Is it this thing? I'm just guessing http://www.ttshop.cn/product.asp?id=2241 It cost 450 yuan for 1 bottle, very expensive!!!!

Not sure since I don't tune the stuff myself nor have I seen the tuning process.

I'm a lil tight on cash right now since I just dropped a ton of money on audio gear.  But later I might just buy a bottle to see whats up.  Plus, need money for the new HK III   So broke

dragon kid wrote: Anton Chigurh wrote: dragon kid wrote: Anybody try it on the BH?  I took it off the forehand of my shakehand blade and put it on the backhand of my SuperCpen blade (which has Thor's on the forehand). I will try it out tomorrow and let you know what I think. I imagine it will function quite well there. Hoping for some good news

I tried it on the backhand of both my SuperCpen blade and my shakehand blade. If you were hoping for some good news, then I can give you some.

It's a great backhand rubber.

However, coming from a Tensor you may not like it as much immediately. Again, this rubber has plenty of potential speed, but no catapult effect. So it feels different and if you're extremely accustomed to that catapult effect then a rubber like this may feel funny at first.

But it has very good spin, very good speed, and very nice control.

It is slightly more susceptible to incoming spin than the O-IV Pro I was using, but it's also more capable of generating spin. There's always a trade off, I guess.




Edited by Anton Chigurh - 02/21/2011 at 1:57pm

dragon kid wrote: I kinda like the catapult effect.. it make it easier to block, though need better touch :) I might still try it, but the option so many now , I don't know what I will end up buying Renanos, Adidas P5, Calibra LT, or another Hexer

Only 4 rubbers? Buy them all! Duh

Anton Chigurh wrote: I tried it on the backhand of both my SuperCpen blade and my shakehand blade. If you were hoping for some good news, then I can give you some. It's a great backhand rubber.

What sponge thickness are you using for your Cpen? I'm seriously considering it for rpb.

not to dig threads, but that means that this stuff is comppletely not tacky, right? If it's at all like Bryce speed that is.

I loved how the rubber played when I first got it.  It starts out with a the slightest bit of tack, and the sponge seems a bit more dead than your average Jap/Euro rubber.  However, it is still much much faster than a Chinese rubber. 

But after a few sessions the sponge comes to life, and soon after the tack goes away and the rubber turns into a slightly more controlled version of Joola Phenix in my opinion. 

This is not to say anything bad about the rubber.  It will do what it is supposed to and it can produce good amounts of speed and spin.  Its just not as amazing as it was when it was brand new.

 Currently, it is my favorite FH rubber that maintains a sub $45 price tag....But i just hit it on the table in a tournament last weekend so I will use this opportunity to EJ some more  :)

so it doesn't sound like an H3 replacement... yeah?