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Butterfly ZJK Review

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sa01 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/26/2012 at 10:18pm
Originally posted by CY930 CY930 wrote:

Yes, I agree, BTY is good in marketing, this is one of their strategy to attract buyer. However Stiga, Nittaku, and others are seldom name their blade after players.
 
Besides, I collected TB ALC and TB Spirit composition information for comaprison as below:
TB ALC: Koto-ALC-Ayous-Candlenut - Ayous - ALC - Koto (Source: unknown)
TBS :Koto-ALC-Limba-Kiri-Limba-ALC-Koto (Source from this forum)
According to the composition, TB ALC and TBS are different. Correct me if my information is not right.
 


where did you get this?
unless the source of your info is reliable you are just adding to the general confusion.....
as for people's comments about trying this or that blade and "feeling different", you can't draw any conclussions from there.
try 10 timo boll spirit blades, one after the other.
they will all feel different.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Snakefish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 12:12am
[/QUOTE]

where did you get this?
unless the source of your info is reliable you are just adding to the general confusion.....
as for people's comments about trying this or that blade and "feeling different", you can't draw any conclussions from there.
try 10 timo boll spirit blades, one after the other.
they will all feel different.
[/QUOTE]
 
 
What you're saying is people should only provide their comments if they demo 10 blades of same name ?  You wanna supply us with 10 each ?  What you're saying is 95% of people feedback's are useless because they don't try 10 blades ? Get real!!!  Everyone here just wanna share their experiences with each other & try to be helpful. 
Xiom Zetro Quad, fl
FH: Xiom Vega Pro 2.0
BH: Xiom OmegaV Euro 2.0

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CY930 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 12:58am
Originally posted by Mickael Mickael wrote:

What is the composition of viscaria , zjk blades?
 
Butterfly Viscaria: koto-ALC-balsa-ALC-koto (only show 5 ply, two plies are missing here)
For Zhang Jike, I dont' have information, any body know the blade composition of ZJK?
Timo Boll ALC (ST)
Nittaku Fastarc G1 (FH)
Nittaku Fastarc S1 (BH)

Nittaku Adelie ST
Sriver G3
Xiom Vega Pro
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sa01 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 1:09am
Originally posted by Snakefish Snakefish wrote:

[/QUOTE]<


where did you get this?
unless the source of your info is reliable you are just adding to the general confusion.....
as for people's comments about trying this or that blade and "feeling different", you can't draw any conclussions from there.
try 10 timo boll spirit blades, one after the other.
they will all feel different.
[/QUOTE]
 
 
What you're saying is people should only provide their comments if they demo 10 blades of same name ?  You wanna supply us with 10 each ?  What you're saying is 95% of people feedback's are useless because they don't try 10 blades ? Get real!!!  Everyone here just wanna share their experiences with each other & try to be helpful. 
[/QUOTE]

well it depends.
if you are comparing different models it's easy to establish differences.
when you are comparing blades that arguably could be identified as the same blade it becomes almost pointless to try to establish differences.
read the post from peter79 above where he says the 3 or 4 viscarias he bought all feel different.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ejmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 1:33am
sa01, ...:
 
* a tb alc is different blade from a tbs.
 
* a viscaria is different blade from a zjk.
 
* and a pg7 is different blade from a clipper.
 
* Besides there can be some differences between same model.
 
And i can say this because i had many blades to test the differences. And yes peter is telling that there were differences between viscarias but also he can recognize that viscaria is different blade from the zjk.
 
long time ago i told high_arc that a good viscaria (need to have several sometimes) feels and has better control than a zjk. peter gets the same conclusion.
 
 


Edited by ejmaster - 04/27/2012 at 1:52am
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MM T05(fh)/Srvfx(bh); InfVps,LSW,Viscaria,RwV,TBAlc,PG7,yextsc,yeo. EJmaster wood.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote peter79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 12:22pm
I've found the greatest setup since I play table tennis in 2005.
Viscaria+H3 National 40 deg+ Tin Arc 37 2.1 with latex water base glue.

H3 is very spinny and powerful on Viscaria, smash is very powerful too.
On All wood only spinny but not powerful enough to smash against a lobber.
I boost 3 times with dianchi, and now I let the tune effect gone, but still powerful enough for me.

I try Tenergy 64, too soft and bouncy, not sure why ZJK likes it perhaps his Tenergy is diff with commerical.
Roxon 500 is a bit soft and not good for control.

Then I try Tin Arc, first I try 2.0 then 2.1 mm, I found 2.1 mm is better, more spinny and has more kick.
Tin arc is not a fast rubber, it's not as spinny as Tenergy 05.
But the strength of this rubber is the control, speed spin ratio, confident playing with it.
You can open loop, fast loop, blocking, smashing with the certainty that it will goes in, and it's not sensitive from incoming spin, I prefer this rubber over Tenergy 05 and roxon 500, also calibra LT. I've tried My friend's Calibra LT on HKing, it's very fast rubber, and difficult to control.


W968 94 gr
H3 National blue sponge 2.2 untuned
T64 2.1
186 gr
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 12:34pm
Originally posted by Snakefish Snakefish wrote:

[/QUOTE]<


where did you get this?
unless the source of your info is reliable you are just adding to the general confusion.....
as for people's comments about trying this or that blade and "feeling different", you can't draw any conclussions from there.
try 10 timo boll spirit blades, one after the other.
they will all feel different.
[/QUOTE]
 
 
What you're saying is people should only provide their comments if they demo 10 blades of same name ?  You wanna supply us with 10 each ?  What you're saying is 95% of people feedback's are useless because they don't try 10 blades ? Get real!!!  Everyone here just wanna share their experiences with each other & try to be helpful. 
[/QUOTE]

Well, yes, people certainly try to be helpful, but then we also have heated discussions about whether Viscaria is faster than TBS or TB ALC or ZJK.  These heated discussions are often pretty useless because nobody is actually wrong as far as I can tell, even when they don't always agree!  The fact is, these particular blades are very very similar, and they all have variability depending on which one you get.  The handles are a little different from model to model which gives them a slightly different feel, and maybe they are using different lots of the same wood, or possibly they glue them a little differently.  In the end, if I take away someone's ZJK and make them play with a Viscaria instead -- or vice versa -- after a week or two (and probably more like an hour or two) they will be playing exactly the same way.  I have two Viscarias right now.  They are the same weight, and for some reason I prefer one over the other.  But I play pretty much exactly the same way with each of them.  On the other hand, Bttfly has a commercial interest in repackaging essentially the same blade with a new name and increasing the price.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High_Arc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 12:53pm
Originally posted by ejmaster ejmaster wrote:



long time ago i told high_arc that a good viscaria (need to have several sometimes) feels and has better control than a zjk. peter gets the same conclusion.
 


Wacko

there may be differences.

the differences may be that small that the distributions of the characteristics overlap.

some prefer this, others that.

better or worse is bullsh*t.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ejmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 1:34pm
yeah everything in life is relative. but it's better to learn something. 

having worse control with a sc is bullsh*t?. yes if one is trained all his life with a sc may be is bullsh*t but one can learn from it.

to tell that a zjk blade is the same blade as a viscaria blade, this is bulls*t.

not because the painting or the handle, because it is different blade with similar building.

why pros keep on using viscaria if the zjk is the same blade.

This long thread shows the difference between an ejmaster and ejamateurs. lol.

It seems that the zjk wasn't so good because you move to yeo high_arc. no more comments. 
EJ Club.

MM T05(fh)/Srvfx(bh); InfVps,LSW,Viscaria,RwV,TBAlc,PG7,yextsc,yeo. EJmaster wood.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 1:49pm
long time ago I played with tbs + h3neo tuned fh.
it is a monster for fh play.
it almost felt too easy, like I was cheating LOL
people would loop me and I'd be like "wtf?? are you trying to loop me?? boom!!!! counter loop/smash".
counterlooping rallies were won most times.
people would make an opening fh loop like trying to give it a lot of spin.
I wouldn't even block, I'd just counterloopfull power and many times the ball wouldn't even come back.
the only problem was control on bh shots, specially blocks.
the little dwell time doesn't help with this.

the problem is I play with all guys who don't tune so you kind of have a big advantage with this setup, so I wasn't able to measure my real capabilities.
now that I play untuned rubbers the game is much more even and I don't feel like my fh is unbeatable.

Originally posted by peter79 peter79 wrote:

I've found the greatest setup since I play table tennis in 2005.
Viscaria+H3 National 40 deg+ Tin Arc 37 2.1 with latex water base glue.

H3 is very spinny and powerful on Viscaria, smash is very powerful too.
On All wood only spinny but not powerful enough to smash against a lobber.
I boost 3 times with dianchi, and now I let the tune effect gone, but still powerful enough for me.

I try Tenergy 64, too soft and bouncy, not sure why ZJK likes it perhaps his Tenergy is diff with commerical.
Roxon 500 is a bit soft and not good for control.

Then I try Tin Arc, first I try 2.0 then 2.1 mm, I found 2.1 mm is better, more spinny and has more kick.
Tin arc is not a fast rubber, it's not as spinny as Tenergy 05.
But the strength of this rubber is the control, speed spin ratio, confident playing with it.
You can open loop, fast loop, blocking, smashing with the certainty that it will goes in, and it's not sensitive from incoming spin, I prefer this rubber over Tenergy 05 and roxon 500, also calibra LT. I've tried My friend's Calibra LT on HKing, it's very fast rubber, and difficult to control.




Edited by sa01 - 04/27/2012 at 1:56pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High_Arc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 2:01pm
Originally posted by ejmaster ejmaster wrote:

yeah everything in life is relative. but it's better to learn something. 

having worse control with a sc is bullsh*t?. yes if one is trained all his life with a sc may be is bullsh*t but one can learn from it.

to tell that a zjk blade is the same blade as a viscaria blade, this is bulls*t.

not because the painting or the handle, because it is different blade with similar building.

why pros keep on using viscaria if the zjk is the same blade.

This long thread shows the difference between an ejmaster and ejamateurs. lol.

It seems that the zjk wasn't so good because you move to yeo high_arc. no more comments. 


I never said the zjk and the Viscaria are the same.

Some continue to use the Viscaria. Some use the zjk. Zhang Yike himself continues to use Viscaria.

Because the blades are different in average one may prefer one over the other. The fact that you prefer a (good) Viscaria over a zjk doesn't automatically make the Viscaria the better blade.

It's better for you (and many others), fair enough. But this doesn't imply that it's better for everyone, right? Or does the fact that I use the YEO since some time make it the best blade in the world?





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ejmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 2:04pm
this is a good point sa01.
 
a/c btfy blades now are so succesful because they balance the loss about gluing or tuning.
 
btwy i have seen that now the price of a zjk is the same as a tb alc so i guess sa01 is going to be the captain of the bargain chasers.
do not chase bargain but chase the real deal. 
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MM T05(fh)/Srvfx(bh); InfVps,LSW,Viscaria,RwV,TBAlc,PG7,yextsc,yeo. EJmaster wood.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 2:32pm
Originally posted by ejmaster ejmaster wrote:

this is a good point sa01.
 
a/c btfy blades now are so succesful because they balance the loss about gluing or tuning.
 
btwy i have seen that now the price of a zjk is the same as a tb alc so i guess sa01 is going to be the captain of the bargain chasers.
do not chase bargain but chase the real deal. 


I bought my zjk for 134$.
here they sell it for 200$ so if I sell it I could actually make some money or not lose.
I don't live in europe or US, here we have to be careful with our money or we run out of it LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2012 at 5:23pm
Yep, now about the same price as Viscaria used to be.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yuna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/04/2012 at 10:24pm
Nice review, Peter ! Wink

my No:1 blade is a Viscaria wz T-05 FH. i get more complaints from frens compare to other blades / setup.
(should be quite similar to ZJK blade)

hahahaha   LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/04/2012 at 10:50pm
Turns out that the ZJK plays surprisingly differently from the Viscaria, faster, a more hollow feeling, much less control and less sense of dwell.  This is based on hitting with three different ZJK blades, one of which I owned (briefly).  There is something different about the way they are putting the layers together, or something.  I think the Viscaria is a lot better.  The ZJK handle is a marginal improvement, but not enough IMHO.  The ZJK is now on its way to a new and hopefully more satisfied owner.

Edited by Baal - 06/04/2012 at 10:52pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote peter79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/04/2012 at 11:01pm
Originally posted by yuna yuna wrote:

Nice review, Peter ! Wink

my No:1 blade is a Viscaria wz T-05 FH. i get more complaints from frens compare to other blades / setup.
(should be quite similar to ZJK blade)

hahahaha   LOL


Have you tried clipper CR? It has better feel, a bit more powerful than Viscaria, nice too loop for 7 ply.
My current setup is Clipper CR with H3 National + Gold Arc 3
Plays much better than my Viscaria setup.
Now I try Tin Arc on Clipper CR...
W968 94 gr
H3 National blue sponge 2.2 untuned
T64 2.1
186 gr
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cotdt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/04/2012 at 11:02pm
peter79, how is the 
Gold Arc 3?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote peter79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/04/2012 at 11:09pm
My gold arc 3 is 37 degree 2.0 thickness. It's like Tenergy 05, but harder. It's as spinny as T05 but it has better control and not sensitive from incoming spin, very good for blocking also.
The weight is the same as Tenergy. Mine is 64 gr uncut, I also have the 60 gr uncut.
The weight cut on Clipper CR is 48 gr for the 64 gr uncut...

W968 94 gr
H3 National blue sponge 2.2 untuned
T64 2.1
186 gr
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cotdt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/04/2012 at 11:29pm
thanks for the info, peter :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/04/2012 at 11:38pm
It's a matter of taste I suppose.  I much prefer Viscaria to Clipper.  But I can't play with Chinese rubbers either.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote peter79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/16/2012 at 12:04am
I've just tried my heavier Viscaria, it's 93.6 gr when I bought it. Now it become 92 gr when I put it on air condition room for several days.
The rubber from 90 gr Viscaria, I put it on Clipper Cr.
I use new rubber which is also H3 National neo topsheet 40 deg 2.2 and Tin arc 37 deg 2.1 mm
My 90 gr Viscaria setup is 185 gr.
My 92 gr Viscaria setup is 191 gr.
There's head size different between 90 & 92.
The 92 is broader above the wing, that's why it's heavier.
The handle of 92 is bigger too, so it's balanced.

When I play it, the 92 is more solid than 90, it's harder, faster when smashing, as well as looping.
I'm very happy that although it's heavier, it's doesn't feel heavy, doesn't slow my reaction so far.

Compare to Clipper CR, the 92 gr is as powerful, but it's better for looping.
W968 94 gr
H3 National blue sponge 2.2 untuned
T64 2.1
186 gr
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