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Acuda now obsolete? |
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GeneralSpecific
Platinum Member Joined: 03/01/2010 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 2811 |
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Posted: 10/29/2012 at 8:36pm |
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Let me preface this by saying that I think there is still a place for S1 Turbo and it is NOT obsolete.
Now then. With the release of Bluefire M1 M2 and M3, doesn't this make Acuda S1 S2 and S3 obsolete? Both lines are of a very similar price so you can't say you are getting a better value by buying any of those 3 Acudas. The Bluefire line seems to have equal or better ratings in speed, spin, and feeling. Many have said that Bluefire plays extremely similar to Tenergy. Something Acuda has come short on. So my question is; what reason is there for someone to choose Acuda S1, S2, or S3 over Bluefire? Furthermore, what reason does Donic have to continue to manufacture Acuda S1, S2, and S3. |
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Blade - Xiom 36.5 ALX FL
Forehand - Xiom Omega V Asia 2.0mm Backhand - Victas Curl P5V with Der Materialspezialist Firestorm Soft/Outkill 1.8mm sponge |
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Anton Chigurh
Premier Member Joined: 09/15/2009 Status: Offline Points: 3962 |
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This is a good question to pose to petermoo. He is a high level player who prefers S1 to S1 Turbo and who has no use for Bluefire, M1-3. |
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Neo H3 40D| Offensive S | Tenergy 80
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tsanyc
Platinum Member Joined: 05/23/2006 Location: Mt. Hinoki Status: Offline Points: 2367 |
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I am using S1 Turbo and I like it better than M1.
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GeneralSpecific
Platinum Member Joined: 03/01/2010 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 2811 |
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If you notice what I said in the preface. I indicated that S1 turbo is the only one I think is not obsolete. |
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Blade - Xiom 36.5 ALX FL
Forehand - Xiom Omega V Asia 2.0mm Backhand - Victas Curl P5V with Der Materialspezialist Firestorm Soft/Outkill 1.8mm sponge |
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shirazir
Super Member Joined: 08/20/2012 Location: Toronto Status: Offline Points: 238 |
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I wouldn't say the Acuda series is completely obsolete just yet. Personally, I still think that Acuda S3 is one of the best backhand rubbers I've had the opportunity to try. As far as Acuda for forehand, Bluefire is the natural successor but the feel of the two series' is quite different I'd say.
I think it's a matter of preference but speaking from a business perspective, yes, Donic will sell far less Acudas with the introduction of Bluefire.
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Blade: Galaxy Venus-14
FH: Donic Bluefire M3 BH: Galaxy Moon |
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GeneralSpecific
Platinum Member Joined: 03/01/2010 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 2811 |
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Good answer. That's interesting. Have you tried M3 on the backhand? How does it compare to S3? |
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Blade - Xiom 36.5 ALX FL
Forehand - Xiom Omega V Asia 2.0mm Backhand - Victas Curl P5V with Der Materialspezialist Firestorm Soft/Outkill 1.8mm sponge |
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collins.latag
Super Member Joined: 05/10/2012 Location: CA US Status: Offline Points: 407 |
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Bluefire is Bluefire, and Acuda is Acuda... not everyone prefers Bluefire over Acuda... Majority of equipment enthusiast might favor Bluefire, but the other percentage of the Donic fan database would still use Acuda, baracuda, and the older lines of Donic... i think the older lines would have to discontinue first before the Acuda series gets in line... One question is when would a M1 Turbo come out! :)
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PPisLife
Blade:TBS Rubber: Donic |
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GoldenDragoon
Silver Member Joined: 01/09/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 769 |
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I think that you can get more spin vs speed from Acuda. You also require less effort in most shots near or over the table due to its bouncier nature. I think Bluefire is primarily the better rubber not hecause of performance, but because of how easy it is to use for a high end tensor. Skilled players will more likely favor harder Acudas for their better spin
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Blade: Nexy Spartacus FL 84g
FH: Evolution FX-P Max Blk BH: Evolution EL-P 1.9 Red |
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Leshxa
Gold Member Joined: 01/03/2009 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1917 |
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I use Acuda S1 on FH and BH. I have Turbo glued on FH right now because I had one sheet of Turbo left while I was out of regular S1.
Comparing S1 to S1 turbo, I feel there is a difference in speed, but that is not what I am looking to get from the rubber. Extra speed on S1 makes it a more like an in between version of close to mid distance rubber. While S1 is really close to the table rubber, which depending on your style may or may not suit your game. The fact that S1 Turbo is advertised as spinnier to me only shows that the softer sponge vs harder sponge produce different dwells for the same topsheet. Yet, I do not feel the difference in spin between these two. I guess it depends what kind of strokes one has and how these rubbers suit the game. I tried M1 briefly ( and not on my blade ), but my overall impression was that it felt softer and stable for slower strokes. With fast hard drive shots and flatter shots, the rubber behaved slightly differently. That alone will make someone choose a different type of rubber than M1. Lastly, the harder sponges are easier to control in short game. So the softer counterparts of M1 and S1T make touch shots less controllable. Edited by Leshxa - 10/29/2012 at 9:50pm |
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Back to table tennis...
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collins.latag
Super Member Joined: 05/10/2012 Location: CA US Status: Offline Points: 407 |
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I tried the S1 you sold me and would say that its harder to use the rubber for on-the-rise strokes compared to S1T, maybe because of the throw angle or the dwell time, or maybe because its just not for my style of play... I just guess different strokes need different equipment.
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PPisLife
Blade:TBS Rubber: Donic |
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AndySmith
Premier Member Joined: 11/12/2008 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 4378 |
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Acuda is definitely not on its way to the knacker's yard just yet.
I love M3 on the forehand side, but my backhand has always been more of a slappy full-arm bang shot. I prefer S3 on the backhand because it has more low-speed bounce - M3 on the BH side requires more effort, and I'm used to softer, bouncier rubbers.
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This was a great signature until I realised it was overrated.
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Imago
Premier Member Joined: 07/19/2009 Location: Sofia Status: Offline Points: 5897 |
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There are at least three RC2000 players around here who exhibit the same predilection.
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Leshxa
Gold Member Joined: 01/03/2009 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1917 |
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I just glued the regular S1 back on my blade and feel a significant difference. S1 control over S1 Turbo seems superior to me.
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Back to table tennis...
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right2niru
Silver Member Joined: 11/10/2011 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 820 |
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I tried s1 red 1.5 years back and the durability was really bad - is it better now?
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ZJK SZLC |5Q+
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Imago
Premier Member Joined: 07/19/2009 Location: Sofia Status: Offline Points: 5897 |
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I bought one red max two years ago and it still has perfect spin and throw. Did not reglue it though. Looks almost as new. |
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popperlocker
Gold Member Joined: 03/24/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1753 |
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Imo, Acuda is the perfect forehand rubber, and Bluefire is the perfect backhand rubber. Acuda has that sticky chinese feeling that I like for FH. Bluefire has that euro short stroke pop control that I like for BH.
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GoldenDragoon
Silver Member Joined: 01/09/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 769 |
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Ineteresting statement. I would have said the exact opposite. I don't think either "feel" sticky though they both have good grip compared to alot of other rubbers.... |
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Blade: Nexy Spartacus FL 84g
FH: Evolution FX-P Max Blk BH: Evolution EL-P 1.9 Red |
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AcudaDave
Gold Member Joined: 11/02/2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 1859 |
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agree Golgen...would probably have said the opposite. Some people will still like Acuda so it will be around for a while. I thought I would never leave Acuda, but I have now switched to Bluefire. I have played with S3 for the last 2-3 years and always loved it. Tried M3 and played with it 3x. First impression was that it was firmer, heavier, and had more spin. Decided to put my S3 back on and immediately noticed a dramatic loss of spin, and the lighter weight actually bothered me. I play with pips out on 1 side so my racket is already light, and with the Acuda it felt too light so I went back to M3. I have a tournament next Sat and will play with M3 so will let everyone know if I play better or not.
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Joola Zhou Qihao 90 blade
Joola Dynaryz Inferno max - BH Nittaku Moristo SP 2.0 - FH |
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slevin
Premier Member Joined: 03/15/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 3602 |
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I feel that M1 has better spin & performance than S1 on slower strokes & opening loops. S1' spin feels better for higher hand speeds and faster games. S1's throw is also more consistent (in soft strokes vs hard strokes). M1's throw seems to be higher for harder strokes and that takes some getting used to (though T05 users shall find it easier to switch). No wonder that some of the better players gravitate towards S1.
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popperlocker
Gold Member Joined: 03/24/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1753 |
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Hmm, it could have donic baracuda instead acuda :)
Edited by popperlocker - 11/01/2012 at 11:09am |
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Imago
Premier Member Joined: 07/19/2009 Location: Sofia Status: Offline Points: 5897 |
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petermoo
Silver Member Joined: 10/13/2003 Location: Jamaica Status: Offline Points: 651 |
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Regarding the original message.
I am one of those who prefer Acuda S1 over S1 turbo. I find the turbo to be a bit too heavy and even though it has a better catapult than S1, I found the mat, non grippy surface did not assist my serving at all, even though on the flipside, It produced good spin in loop drives and is the easiest rubber I have ever used in the lifting heavy backspin department. (almost too easy). Acuda S1 is harder than Turbo which is more of a medium rubber. I found that as I improved as a player, I gravitated more towards harder sponges and whereas medium is probably more preferable to most people, I love the solid linear feel of the Acuda. Now on to the greater question of the Acuda series, especially in the light of the emerging Bluefire series. Its no secret that I have never been a great fan of the tenergy rubbers. I find that they are too heavy, certainly for two sided use (like Bluefire). Indeed I find the Bluefires to play almost exactly like the tenergy maybe with M1 being a little faster and M2 a little slower but still very similar. I prefer the trajectory and kick of the Acudas over the tenergy and Bluefire and I have not found a rubber that creates more havoc in serving than Acuda S1 (in black). Choice of a rubber is not a simple matter of choosing the rubber with more spin and more speed. I remember back in the day when there were several rubbers faster and spinner than sriver L and yet if you did a list of the top 20 players back in the 80's they were all using sriver. Today the same thing is true of the Hurricanes. But more on that later.... Petermoo |
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Petermoo
AcudaS1 Max JO Silver Butterfly Gergely Carbon http://petermoo.blogspot.com/ |
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slevin
Premier Member Joined: 03/15/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 3602 |
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Thanks Petermoo, A question for you on harder sponges: It is no secret that many European players use boosted Tenergies. Is it also true that many European pros use Tenergy with harder sponge than the one that normally comes on T05? Also, I did not find the S1 to be much lighter: my S1 max was 68g uncut & only about 1g lighter than my T05 when cut to my Butterfly blade (S1: 48g vs T05: 49g. That T05 has shrunk to 46g now). Are the S1s you use much lighter?
Edited by slevin - 11/02/2012 at 1:01pm |
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petermoo
Silver Member Joined: 10/13/2003 Location: Jamaica Status: Offline Points: 651 |
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Most of the players who I personally know are in the lower divisions of European TT. I do not have direct knowledge of the real pros. All the players that i know use the standard off the shelf tenergy along with booster. (And a few do not boost at all) I have seen Tenergy without the packaging in China with harder sponge and a lot of chinese or Japanese writing on the back of it. I take it, these are customized sponge hardnesses. Once, I sat next to Liu Gouzheng and he took out a regular sheet of sriver and put it on his bat right next to me. There was nothing special about it at all! On the other hand, I once got a used sheet of Bryce from a Chinese national player (again with chinese characters on the sponge) and the sponge was rock hard. I do not have the benefit of a scale, right now,but I can guarantee you that my S1 is at least 10% lighter that any sheet of Tenergy I've seen. Petermoo
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Petermoo
AcudaS1 Max JO Silver Butterfly Gergely Carbon http://petermoo.blogspot.com/ |
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NextLevel
Forum Moderator Joined: 12/15/2011 Location: Somewhere Good Status: Offline Points: 14844 |
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I find it interesting that I have never given the Acuda series a try before. With all my EJing too... maybe I settled on Baracuda too early...
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I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
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Imago
Premier Member Joined: 07/19/2009 Location: Sofia Status: Offline Points: 5897 |
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It is high time to go to the Next Level.
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mrdoodzki
Gold Member Joined: 06/10/2011 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 1279 |
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but in general which one is faster? the acudas or bfs?
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Aman1234
Member Joined: 12/09/2011 Location: Maryland Status: Offline Points: 92 |
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I was looking for a substitute for Tenergy 05FX (which I do like, just not at $70 a sheet) and decided to try Bluefire M3 on my FH. I am very happy with M3. It seems to do everything I need very well. I can generate a lot of spin with my loops from off the table. It is a little sensitive to in coming spin on passive shots. How does the Acuda S3 compare to the Bluefire M3?
Thanks,
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BTY TBS
FH Tibhar Evolution FX-P BH Donic Bluefire M3 |
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frogger
Premier Member Joined: 08/03/2010 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3062 |
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Obsolete is a rather strong word in this case. Perhaps older generation would be more suitable. Example, Mark V is not "obsolete" in fact it still remains a top seller. Mark V Max + BTY Primorac Carbon= nice! :) |
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ttping85
Gold Member Joined: 04/09/2012 Location: France Status: Offline Points: 1061 |
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If you something similar to T05 fx then the M3 is better than the S3 for you. S3 is softer, more bouncy, less grippy and has lower throw. |
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