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Kill Shot ADVICE NEEDED! |
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tommyzai 
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 Topic: Kill Shot ADVICE NEEDED!Posted: 04/10/2014 at 11:25pm |
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Which technique and rubber is best for putting away high kill shots that are loaded with incoming underspin? Edited by tommyzai - 04/11/2014 at 12:50am |
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NextLevel
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 12:22am |
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I preferred the original post - it made it clear that you didn't want to hear the truth.
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I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
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mjamja
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 12:23am |
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This is a problem I have been analyzing in my game also. I have come to the conclusion that for the kill over the table you need to use an entirely different stroke. Because better players do not hit back the kind of short high balls you are talking about often, coaching discussions aimed at higher level players usually do not discuss this stroke and you do not see it being hit much if any when watching professional players play.
In my opinion it requires somewhat of a modified flick kill shot. You need to step in with your playing hand foot (right foot for right handed players). Additionally you need to not step in towards the ball, but instead step in so you are on the opposite side of the ball from your playing hand (for righties you need to step in well left of the ball). You then use the shorter flick type stroke using no body rotation, a little movement at the shoulder, and lots of movement of the forearm. Unlike the regular flick stroke where you put you hand below the elbow, you want to do this one with the hand a little above the elbow so that the forearm snap is slightly down (more down for high balls and topspin return and less down for lower balls and balls with slight underspin). Try to find some pro footage where a player really pops up a short return of serve and watch how the server does his kill on that really high short pop-up return. When the high ball is deep enough that the top of the bounce is within a foot or so of the endline then you can revert to using a more conventional Fh drive type technique to make the kill. As always, if a real coach tells you different please follow their advice and not mine. Hope this does help get you thinking about a slightly different way to approach this kill shot. Mark Edit - PS Sorry but I do not have a specific rubber suggestion. I am able to miss those kills with anything I play with. Edited by mjamja - 04/11/2014 at 12:31am |
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NextLevel
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 12:33am |
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By the way, isn't a question about rubbers supposed to be in the equipment forum?
Generally, a high ball will get a more consistent smash from a less spin reactive rubber. On the other hand, it is harder to generate spin with a less spin reactive rubber so the smash is less stable. So the question is how much spin you need to generate on other strokes. However, for smashing technique, coaching is unavoidable (I know you didn't want to hear this but I had to say it). Not so much coaching, but practice. I would recommend a less spinny short pip and lots of practice. |
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I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
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speedy
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 2:02am |
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Without going into any analysis/details, I can tell you this. Go watch 3 players for technique: Liu Guoliang, Johnny Huang, and He Zhi Wen. They all use short pips.  |
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SPEEDY
Viscaria Super ALC ST JOOLA Rhyzen CMD(FH) Nittaku Moristo SP (BH) |
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smackman
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 3:22am |
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was liu Guoliang a high ball hitter? anyway all players from the past
I think Tommy has tried every rubber in the World anyway but have a rubber for 1 shot seems strange to me anyhow softer sponge rubbers/ short pips or anything really if the ball is high , just practice
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CraneStyle
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 3:59am |
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@ tommyzai - Relax playing arm, then take your arm far backwards...
Drive through from legs to smash the ball. Your power will cancel out most of the spin. ... Top players are known to twiddle their bats to the Euro/ Japanese side when smashing really high balls... 
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1. Mizutani Jun ZLC, FH T80, BH T05
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DDreamer
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 5:31am |
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+1 Just use your usual smashing technique but open the angle of your blade more. |
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I know that faster equipment will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out
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tommyzai
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 1:02pm |
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I'm half tempted to twiddle to my LP/OX that is on the BH for this . . . I couldn't do any worse.
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Fulanodetal
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 4:49pm |
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Tommyzai!! can I ask a question that's off topic?
Where are you working as an animator if you don't mind me asking. I'm an animator too! Cheers! F.
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tommyzai
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 7:13pm |
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I'm not really an animator. I'm a licensed psychotherapist, ESL teacher, and music producer. :-).
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tuco
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Posted: 04/11/2014 at 7:15pm |
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practice, practice, practice ..... :) |
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The Dark Side is:
"Quicker, easier, more seductive" - Yoda |
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tt4me
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Posted: 04/12/2014 at 12:49pm |
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It is good to be able to twiddle quickly. |
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Clarence247
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Posted: 04/12/2014 at 5:07pm |
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If a high short ball is loaded with heavy underspin - and since it is high you want to hit it (not use topspin) - then hit normally (open forward motion) - use a lot of force - as much as you can / have - and aim slightly long / off the table - the underspin will pull the ball down - since you aimed off the table it will clear the net... but as there is the underspin pulling it - it will go down and nicely land - normally a safe distance away from the edge.
The most effective kills / smashes are with slightly harder rubbers - not rock hard - but harder than most tensors I have seen or tried. When you master the stright kill - right before you hit the ball flick the wrist (like a whip motion) it will add direction and even more sharpness- it becomes hard to miss these once you have it covered. This is if most of your kills were ending up in the net (I assume so because you mentioned underspin) - if your kills are ending long it is different - just keep same power but close the angle more - the face of the bat has to be "looking" just above the white tape of the net with a forward / downward motion - flat hit - this is true for no or little spin balls. Summary: imagine the face of the bat had eyes: no or little spin - bat looks just above white tape of net underspin - bat looks just off the edge of the table in both cases HARD forward and slightly downward motion. Once mastered add whip motion with your wrist if desired. practising 30 kills per day for 5/6 days (bounce the ball for yourself) is enough to master this basic shot... the adaptation for underspin is logical and will come naturally. |
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tommyzai
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Posted: 04/12/2014 at 8:44pm |
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Great stuff! Keep it coming. This thread is becoming the ultimate KILL SHOT tutorial!
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Imago
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Posted: 04/13/2014 at 1:58am |
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Slap shot.
Like that Of course, younger people are more flexible and will do it better. PS. Slap shot with underspin is simply impossible. |
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BH-Man
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Posted: 04/13/2014 at 8:49am |
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Open blade full, swing forward with pace. Hit ball SOLIDLY while high, closer to net gives more room for error. Against heavier underspin, finish follow thru higher.
Coach McAfee talks about this shot a long time ago.
pics of stroke here... http://www.newgy.com/TTCommunity/Archive/lesson75.html#SMASH
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tommyzai
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Posted: 04/13/2014 at 12:32pm |
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According to BH-Man, "Coach McAfee talks about this shot a long time ago . . . ."
Here's how! 1. Make contact with the ball at the top of its, bounce. Once the ball begins to fall it cannot be hit. It must be spun. 2. The contact point on the ball is the center or slightly below the center of the ball. The heavier the under spin, the lower the contact point. 3. Make "force", not friction, when you contact the ball. 4. The direction of the racket is forward and up (push up at contact). 5. The heavier the under spin the more you should accelerate your racket through the ball. 6. Stroke towards your target. Edited by tommyzai - 04/13/2014 at 12:33pm |
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tommyzai wrote: