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Xushaofa polyball review

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    Posted: 08/23/2014 at 5:03pm
Bought it from TTNPP (and received them in about a week).  $10 for 6 balls, not too bad.  These are seamless balls.  I have now played a total of about 6 hrs with these balls.  I have been a very vocal critic of the ITTF decision to mandate production of these balls for many reasons, no reason to go into them here.  I have also spent a lot of time trying the various 40+ balls, and have been quite frustrated with many of them, which seemed to justify my worst fears.

Short summary:  XSF is the best polyball I have used yet by far, with the possible exception of the Nittaku Japan polyball (except that one I did not get to use for such a long time).

Today my practice partner and I had a lot of fun playing with these, had some great rallies, I have no complaints.  I have hated playing with all of the seamed Chinese polyballs.  With this ITTF approved seamless polyball, I had fun.  Our play was much better, and many fewer inexplicable unforced errors. 

All six balls were acceptably round when you spin them on the table.

They are a very bright white, easy to see, and are visibly slightly larger than celluloid balls, as with all of the 40+ balls I have seen so far.

Simple bounce test by dropping them onto the table.  All 6 balls bounced just a little bit higher than celluloid (in contrast to Joola 40+ and Chinese Nittaku 40+ which always bounce lower).

They no longer sound broken.  The sound is definitely a little different from celluloid, but nowhere as strange as the seamless balls of a few months ago.  No problem there.

In play, including match play, it is very easy to get used to these balls.  At least for me, this was not true for Joola or Nittaku Chinese seamed 40+.  I am now convinced that bounce is more of a factor than the size in giving us a ball we can use.  Yes, the XSF ball is a little slower, and there is a little less spin, but the ball still comes to where you think its going to be.  You have a just a tiny bit of more time to get to balls, so rallies are extended, but the rallies can be great fun.  We had a lot of great topspin to topspin rallies away from the table that went longer than usual because we were each able to get to balls in slightly better position than we would have otherwise, but we were not mistiming so much like we both did with Joola or Nittaku China 40+.  Blocking is a little easier, but it doesn't mean that blockers will dominate with this one because loopers will have a little more time.  I am no defender, but my guess is that defenders will love this thing.  Even though there is just a bit less spin, the extra time they will have will mean they will have time to vary the spin more.  I still won plenty of points today with loops from both sides.  I found myself using a slightly more open racket angle and needed to aim a little higher to get good clearance over the net.  That adjustment seemed to come naturally and I didn't need to think about it. 

None of my serves were as effective and it is easier to return serve.  This is a small effect, and it was less as time went on, but both of us noticed it.

Two things I noticed.  Pushes tended to not come out as far and they seemed to kind of sit up for you.  This takes a little adjustment in timing, but not much.  Much better than the Joola 40+ ball.   

Sidespin loops, strangely enough, really jumped a lot farther to the side after they hit the table.  That was really cool to see (and modern defenders are going to love that aspect). 

I haven't weighed the balls yet, some people have reported they are on the heavy end of the spectrum.  Could be, but they did not feel heavy at all when I played with them. Too soon to say anything about durability, but we didn't break one.    

The bottom line is that this ball could in fact accomplish what ITTF seems to want to do, which is to take down the speed and spin just a small bit, without completely messing up the game.  My guess is that a match between ZJK and Ma Long with these balls would be a visual treat for the ages.  In addition, my impression is that these would be quite fair for all styles of play I think (although I still think it would be a boon for real defenders). The price is not bad at all. 

If all polyballs can reach this standard of play and price, I will be quite happy.  They are vastly superior IMHO than all of the Chinese polyballs I have tried so far.  I think DHS should be embarrassed by the ball they have introduced, at least in its current form.

I wish XSF had a little more clout on the international scene so that there was actually a ghost of a chance that this ball could be adopted in significant competitions. I really think most players would be content.

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 5:33pm
This ball was reported dangerous by user Croudy on a German forum 2.5 Months ago: http://forum.tt-news.de/showthread.php?p=2543964#post2543964

Quote Jetzt mal ohne Spaß - gestern ist es (endlich, nach 18 Trainingseinheiten bzw. ca. 45 Spielstunden) passiert: Der erste P-Ball (XuShaoFa nahtlos) ist beim Schuss gegen den Netzpfosten förmlich explodiert. Einige Einzelteile sind dabei nur knapp am Auge vorbeigeflogen, eins wäre fast im Mund gelandet. Kann mir gut vorstellen, dass es da wirklich mal zu Verletzungen kommen könnte.


In short, after being hit against the metal part of the net assembly the ball broke so violently that it burst into small pieces that almost flew into the player's eye and mouth.

The guy who reported that had been known as pro-plastic ball before the accident.


Edited by Mastermind - 08/23/2014 at 5:37pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 5:50pm
Good one  Clap

You get points for creativity.  Somehow I'm not going to get too worked up about that.  After all, the ball is actually more likely to hit me in the eye without exploding.  In spite of this incredible risk, I still play a sport that has flying projectiles. 

(Also nothing in the post I could see that indicated that it is the current ITTF approved one.  The XSF ball I got to hit with 3 months ago was completely different and quite terrible).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:09pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

The XSF ball I got to hit with 3 months ago was completely different and quite terrible).

The only way the current XSF could be different I can imagine is if they make use of temporary changed specification. Just making a different ball under the same name is surely not allowed, such a ball must be submitted for approval first. Otherwise the whole approval procedure would be a joke.

Besides, even if they make a heavier ball now but the material is the same, the reported danger still remains.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:10pm
I have actually played with both -- one four months ago and some over the last few days, so I know they are different.  They sound different, and they play different.  Something changed.  That is true even if you can't imagine it.  And like I say, the danger is, well, not really very scary. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:14pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

Good one  Clap You get points for creativity.


Baal, I definitely did not create that posting I quoted, if this is what you mean. Even without solid knowledge of German you can google translate what that guy wrote on that thread and see that he can not be me, as you are familiar with my postings here. He was a clear proponent of plastic balls.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:15pm
I know you didn't create it.  I read it myself (I have some elementary German reading skills). I am sure it happened. I just think that as a reason to not use the ball, it is, well, just not scary.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:18pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

the danger is, well, not really very scary. 


So, possible getting one day a small sharp piece of plastic stuck in the eye is not a danger to you? Shocked

I admire your courage.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:22pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

as a reason to not use the ball, it is, well, just not scary.


OK, maybe using some sort of eyes and mouth protection is what you have in mind? Maybe nose protection as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:26pm
The risk of somebody mishitting a full out loop and sending the intact ball straight into their opponent's eye has always existed and is almost certainly much much higher than the ball "exploding".  This is absurd.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:29pm
Mastermind, do you actually play table tennis? Other than criticize ITTF decisions that you disagree with, is there anything about our sport that interests you?
It's joyless to read your repetitive posts without any sense of the joy that our sport brings within them. You are almost worse than a spambot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tassie52 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:29pm
Great review, Baal.  I admire your willingness to concede that something you were extremely sceptical of has some positives.  I also admire your willingness to risk having your thread sidetracked by Mastermind's exploding balls.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:31pm
I have had celluloid balls hot both eyes, causing inflammation in both. That did not atop me from playing. Celluloid balls can also explode on high impact. Since they are less hard, it may plausibly happen less than with plastic, but until it becomes a pandemic, let's leave paranoia alone.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:41pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

The risk of somebody mishitting a full out loop and sending the intact ball straight into their opponent's eye has always existed and is almost certainly much much higher than the ball "exploding".


The XSF in that German posting did not explode, it burst into peaces when hit against a hard part of the net assembly. The guy used the word just figuratively.

As for a whole ball hitting an eye, it is quite different and ways less dangerous. Besides, people do react.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:42pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Celluloid balls can also explode on high impact.


This is not true.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:43pm
I played one match with the XSF balls and one match with Double Fish immediately after. While the double fish IMO is the best of the seamed cloned balls, and onlookers didn't know I changed balls between matches, I could tell just about everything in Baal's review from playing with those balls back to back. I pummeled a   much lower rated player without any Significant adjustments with the XSF ball, but the DFish ball was the same low bounce over the table nightmare. Lost a game because the pip ball didn't come up on the return for my OTB strokes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 6:54pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Other than criticize ITTF decisions that you disagree with, is there anything about our sport that interests you?


You can not be serious about that Shocked

Where do you think we are here, in a gym?

This is a forum where people report and discuss things.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 7:27pm
I am sure my sentiments are shared by many on the forum and are grounded inactive observation. You don't review balls as someone who has used them. You do know how to find a critique of the plastic balls. This is not the usual behavior of someone interested in the sport as a participant.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 7:31pm
Originally posted by Mastermind Mastermind wrote:

Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Celluloid balls can also explode on high impact.


This is not true.


Do you actually play table tennis or are you concluding this by rationalization? I have broken defective balls in various ways and cracking into bits is one of them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 7:31pm
@mastermind  Well, when someone only wants to talk about one thing and always makes pretty much the same point, I generally start to avoid it because it more or less stops being a discussion at that point -- especially when I can't figure out how this person gets from A to B.  Also, maybe I missed it, but I haven't actually heard you mention that you have played with any version of a polyball.  I certainly can't point to a single example on this forum (or for that example, anything you have actually ever said about playing table tennis). 

This is a thread on how one of these new balls actually plays.  You have put it on the record that someone on a German thread had a ball made by this company break into pieces some time back.  OK, it's a datum.  Great.   We can all weigh this "risk".

In the mean time, some people want to know how these things play and how the properties are progressing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mts388 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 7:33pm
Some people spend their life as a fear monger.  Mastermind strikes me as one of them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 7:34pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

You don't review balls as someone who has used them.


Shocked This is the most stupid argumentation I've ever read on this forum.

I quoted what a guy who used this very ball under discussion here wrote in German. And gave the link.

Do you expect everyone who needs information to read German and maybe forums in other languages themselves?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 7:42pm
Of course, like I said, you assume that he used this very ball, and I provided a reason why it may or may not be the same ball.  Be that as it may, you have mentioned it, and now if you have nothing else to add......

By the, way, quoting from my own original comment in this thread that addresses this:

They no longer sound broken.  The sound is definitely a little different from celluloid, but nowhere as strange as the seamless balls of a few months ago.  No problem there.

[emphasis added]
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 7:43pm
Originally posted by mts388 mts388 wrote:

Some people spend their life as a fear monger.  Mastermind strikes me as one of them.


After me just pointing out to one real comment on this XSF from another forum? Shocked

I guess you missed all that enormous fear mongering by a large group of users on this forum about "dangerous" celluloid etc.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 7:48pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

Of course, like I said, you assume that he used this very ball, and I provided a reason why it may not be.


I agreed with you that it might be possible, because of temporary changed specifications in the first place, didn't I?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 8:07pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

Also, maybe I missed it, but I haven't actually heard you mention that you have played with any version of a polyball.


Baal, let us put one thing straight. If I were a f***ing liar like some people here, I would have made up some negative reports of my own, but I did not. Secondly, I guess people would rather read the report by e.g. WR 111 Thomas Keinath I gave the link to than by, you know, humble me.


Edited by Mastermind - 08/23/2014 at 8:09pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 9:33pm
Originally posted by Mastermind Mastermind wrote:

Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

Also, maybe I missed it, but I haven't actually heard you mention that you have played with any version of a polyball.


Baal, let us put one thing straight. If I were a f***ing liar like some people here, I would have made up some negative reports of my own, but I did not. Secondly, I guess people would rather read the report by e.g. WR 111 Thomas Keinath I gave the link to than by, you know, humble me.

It actually reeks of having an agenda other than the love of the game.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 9:34pm
Originally posted by Mastermind Mastermind wrote:

Originally posted by mts388 mts388 wrote:

Some people spend their life as a fear monger.  Mastermind strikes me as one of them.


After me just pointing out to one real comment on this XSF from another forum? Shocked

I guess you missed all that enormous fear mongering by a large group of users on this forum about "dangerous" celluloid etc.




But those other posters post about many other things - all you post about is stuff criticizing ITTF decisions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 9:39pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

It actually reeks of having an agenda

Plastic ball scam is an agenda.


Edited by Mastermind - 08/24/2014 at 9:33am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mastermind Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2014 at 9:48pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

all you post about is stuff criticizing ITTF decisions.

This is werid, but you are increasingly sounding like a North Korean police guy.


Edited by Mastermind - 08/24/2014 at 9:34am
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