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need help against this guy |
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theman
Premier Member Joined: 09/22/2006 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 7234 |
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Posted: 05/05/2007 at 2:36am |
hi guys, im playing against this indian dude at university. a former national player during high school.
he does a fh pendulum, and his strong point is his fh smash. with regards to his serve. he most of the time serves fast cross court, topspin and basckspin to my bh. how do i counter these? how can i flip low topspin ball, casue when i do with bh flip, he just smashes it casue its too slow. how can i make it quick? and also, with fast heavy backspin on my bh side, how do i chop it short and low? cause evrytime i try to, it keeps floating up, help on pushing game plz. my strong point is fh smash, i use bh service. since he does fast service, is there any hints if its backspin or topspin? is it the trajectory of the ball? and his contact and motion is sooo similar!! |
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pingpongpaddy
Gold Member Joined: 06/27/2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1286 |
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hi theman
if you need to ask thes questions sadly theres no quick fix.your opp has talent from the sound of it. pushing game tip: practice picking pendulum top or chop: usually when they serve with top the servers elbow is higher. flipping faster: practice Hey just be glad you are playing a strong player. If I were you I'd ask him for some practice tips, he'll probably remember something from his training camps. |
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inactive dotec carbokev
yin he galaxy 1 p ly FH moristo sp AX MAX bh moristo sp ax max |
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Qtjoel
Super Member Joined: 02/25/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 409 |
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The way I figured out to counter any ball that is fast and deep, is to move a little bit farther from the table because a lot of time I get jammed and I don't have the time flip the fast under spin balls, for fast top spin deep in the table DON'T flip them, just follow through with a hit, this is what my couch told me. if it flies out or goes high with the top spin deep in the table, change the racket angle, NEVER smash servers no matter how high they look. Since this guy seems talented he'd probably be smart and vary his serve but he can only have so many serves in his armory, so focus on which serve he does but don't think that much, I suggest you his to his backhand or his body . Hope that helps.
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theman
Premier Member Joined: 09/22/2006 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 7234 |
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ok thx, ill try it out next tuesday.
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legender
Member Joined: 07/03/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 41 |
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that sounds hard. strategy may help a little bit. The bottom line is the skill. You may want to try some combination of short and long, short to the net and long to the edge of the table. For the slow topspin, if you can tell, just attack using backhand (assume you use shakehand) to both sides. My way to return fast backspin is to chop back to the edge. it is not easy to smash a long one, even looping a little difficult for very deep return.
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Pip Master
Silver Member Joined: 02/12/2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 678 |
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if he's consistently serving to your backhand, you can step around and hit a forehand down the line or into his backhand, this is what i usually do to good effect, make sure that you get yourself back into position quickly after this shot though.
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Blade:Yasaka Gatien Extra 3D
FH: Mendo MP BH: Sriver EL |
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YATTP
Silver Member Joined: 08/15/2005 Location: Antarctica Status: Offline Points: 563 |
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Simple answer: Step back a bit let the ball fall a bit and open with BH topspin with *heavy* spin to his bh or fast bh topspin down the line to throw him off balance. Nobody can smash heavy topspin with enough consistency - nobody (if he can, work on your topspin). Vary the spin, try to do as fast as possible, but the spin is the key.
Quick tip if you can't see what spin it is: If the serve is fast, it will be some form of topspin. This means that you have to loop with a much more violent forward impuls than against backspin in oder to keep it on the table. Fast heavy backspin is highly unlikely because it tends to sail off the table due to the spin. A tiny bit of backspin is no problem. A bit of backspin, or a bit of sidespin or a bit of topspin doesn't matter at all *IF* you are able to let the ball drop a bit and spin it hard (=spinny control loop). Remember to have a strong forward impuls in this case (not just upwards, but upwards + strong forward impuls) and don't forget to use your legs for good spin. The biggest problem with the bh topspin opening against long serves is to get into position early enough. Judge the amount of sidespin. How much will it curve? In which direction will it curve? (it will curve later if it's a fast serve, and this can be dangerous). Watch the ball all the way from contact to contact. You know where the table is. Just watch the ball, move your feet and then spin it hard. Have fun. Some day your bh topspin has to be good enough to deal with this scenario because it is pretty common. A passive shot like a chop is no solution to your problem - at least not if you want to get better. |
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BH-Man
Premier Member Joined: 02/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5042 |
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Just like paddy and everyone is sayin, the guy got skill and a high rating for a reason. If he is pulverizing your return, you can do a couple things. You can try to change up how you give the return in terms of placement, speed, depth, and spin. He is probably good enough to hit most of your returns for winners though. Being too close to the table makes it much more difficult to react in time to get a good controlled stroke in. So, you can try moving back some and hope he doesn't notice and serve short and spinny. Since he crushes your returns, you don't have a lot to lose by looping those long deep serves. You will have a great chance at a winner if he is serving deep from his BH corner and you BH loop one down his FH line. A lot of times, he will not expect it and he is too committed to the BH corner to do much to it. If he starts moving to cover this return down his FH line too soon, you can then try carrying over the wrist on the horizontal plane and loop it back to his BH corner - this can paralyze him if he jump to the FH too early. You have to able to read his spins and get into position in time. It is easier to do BH loops if it is served in that direction - there is less footwork and time involved. Give it a shot. Change up the returns or try a controlled loop down the line. You don't have a lot to lose. He was killing your returns anyway. At least this way, you go down on your terms with smoke coming out of you six-shooer and your boots on. Plus, you get nice practice attacking the long balls.
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Korea Foreign Table Tennis Club
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priior
Member Joined: 04/24/2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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if the serve u think is backspin, is coming at you fast and when u chop it the ball is going up, it;s probably flat made to look like backspin.
a lot of players when they're serving long they like vary between a flat and a kicking topspin serve with pretty much the same hand movement. like everyone said, seems like ur returning the serves too close to the table.. (hes probably serving long because ur too close to the table?) take a step back and heavy topspin it.. (i wish i could follow my own advice..) |
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priior
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theman
Premier Member Joined: 09/22/2006 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 7234 |
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ok thx guys ill stnad a few steps back. my bh used to be kreanga like, but now with the switch of a normal flared handle instead of dotec its gone.
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YATTP
Silver Member Joined: 08/15/2005 Location: Antarctica Status: Offline Points: 563 |
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No wild shot of despair! A controlled loop with *heavy* spin is your friend if you want to get better because it can be used against pretty much everything. You need consistent quality openings. And this is the only way to get there. If you try to powerloop everything you'll never ever get far. This is a fact.
As a matter of fact, many people don't manage to learn to play this type of topspin with enough spin or it's not consistent enough. These players are stuck forever. if you want to play a "modern" topspin game some day, there is no way around controlled quality openings that get the game started. These shots are notoriously difficult for beginners though because they require lots of handspeed, good footwork and very good timing. Don't give up until you master them. This day will be a big step up in class for you. |
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BH-Man
Premier Member Joined: 02/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5042 |
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I hope what I said is in agreement with what wunderbare advice YATTP is emphisizing - that you have to start looping those long balls consistantly to advance your level and take the fight to your opponent. If you just push the return all the time, that is what the server expects and is more than ready to finish the point with a high percentage kill shot. It is your mission to disrupt his rhythm and put him off balance- you then have a better opportunity to attack and finish the point on YOUR terms, instead of him dictating the game. You will not right off the bat hit everything for a winner nor land all your opening loops, but it is important to develop the mentality to attack or open the point on these balls if you expect to raise your level. I find myself falling behind in such matches when I inexplicitedly fail to take the initiative in opening the attack. You gotta try the loop for these long serves and only push short or deep as a variation, even if it is initially unsuccesful - it is how you grow. I have recently went through such a phase. You will get better later for doing this. I like the way YATTP uses the word class, it is how Europeans express better skill or talent/superiority. Try the few steps back only when you can get away with it, like after you open the point. You stand that far back on the serve and he will surely catch you easy with a short serve. You should get back only as far as you can and still be able to use step under footwork to receive a short serve if he gives you one.
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Korea Foreign Table Tennis Club
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theman
Premier Member Joined: 09/22/2006 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 7234 |
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thanks so much for ur words of inspiration. i will try to loop with heavy spin casue YATTP u r absolutely correct in syaing im a power looper with no/lack of spin.
thats y when i play chopper or whoever pushes long, icant get it above the net. i will practice my footwork and bending knee,s and whole body as well as timing. thanks alot for the advice, ill surely try it tonite. |
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cole_ely
Premier Member Joined: 03/16/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6899 |
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The sad part is he's only sending you fast serves because he can get away with it. Once you get to where you can loop those consistently, then you've got his "A" game to look forward to.
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Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b
Please let me know if I can be of assistance. |
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BH-Man
Premier Member Joined: 02/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5042 |
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I agree with Cole, but one has to get past the "c" and "b" stuff and develop the mentality to attack the long b/c stuff to be able to think of developing a game to begin to address the "a" stuff of an advanced player.
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Korea Foreign Table Tennis Club
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Swiff
Platinum Member Joined: 06/09/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2587 |
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I suggest you play with the angles of your racket upon ball contact.
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