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Homemade Blade |
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acer800
Silver Member Joined: 12/12/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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MY SECOND ATTEMPT IS ALMOST DONE. Curing time is kill ing me.
Its working! I figured you have to put atleast 1000 pounds of pressure for 10 minutes. Then observe it and constantly wipe off the excess epoxy that oooozes out ever now any then |
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flatulenzio
Super Member Joined: 02/27/2007 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 144 |
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Take more time!
For me it's minimum one day for a blade! Epoxy likes it warm to get hard! Benny Benny |
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acer800
Silver Member Joined: 12/12/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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no worrys. I have a heat gun aimed at it for 1 hour allready. Running on low mode of corse.
So yeah hopefully this isnt a waste of 40 bucks on the carbon fiber |
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acer800
Silver Member Joined: 12/12/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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holy snaps too this is my official 200th post. with a average of 14 post per DAY!! WOOOHOOOO YIPPY HORAYY
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5370H55V
Beginner Joined: 10/27/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 79 |
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I don't know if it applies here, but in knifemaking, you don't want to apply too much pressure to 2 things being glued together. The reason being that you'll squeeze out most of the glue/epoxy and there not being enough left to make a strong bond. But who knows? You don't need a particularly strong bond in a TT blade. Anyway, just saying.
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acer800
Silver Member Joined: 12/12/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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ahh thanks for the tip. My attempt #2 blade has 9 more hours of curing time. ahaha many people are interested I see? XD. I will only go to attempt #5 max if it fails. I allready spent a total of 60$.
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markguyver1
Member Joined: 10/26/2006 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Hi acer800,
I got my kevlar/carbon fibers from these guys below. A linear yard will make at least 6 rackets with dual reinforced layers. I'd used epoxy mixed at 3 (resin) to 1 (hardener) ratio so that it's not too stiff nor brittle. I'd also used a foodsaver to vacuum pump the air while apply weight over the entire board.
I'd used both spruce (outer and core) and balsa (core). I get my balsa from local airplane/hobbie store and of course, the density of balsa boards are not uniform. I usually apply pinch pressure to make sure that the ones I want is dense (hard) enough and laminate the good ones into one board. You can see this in some of the more expensive blades (BTY Amultart).
I got my spruce and other tonewood from fleabay. Search for guitar or violin wood. Get the cheap ones but watch out for shipping. I'd used tone wood because they're excellent in resonance and vibration. You've probably already noticed that in hinoki and kiso blades.
Have fun building,
Mark
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DeathAngel
Gold Member Joined: 02/10/2008 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1015 |
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Hey if u have the chance try to make a hollow blade and see how it plays. Who knows what will happen...
Make it all wood with like 2 plies each side and than just take your core and hollow it out so there is like 2-3 CM left around the edges and than glue it up. Hopefully it will hold through the press :P. Just and idea :P |
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Korbel ST
H3 Neo 2.2 Desto F3 2.0 USA: 1522 CAN: 809 |
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bleachfan92
Super Member Joined: 11/15/2008 Status: Offline Points: 299 |
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I cant help but say this, deathangel, it will not work! theres no core! its like hitting only the other layer of 2 plies!
anyway, butterfly doesnt use epoxy to glue the layers together
and just asking, how do you get the shape of the blade out?
thanks
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Ranger-man
Gold Member Joined: 03/27/2008 Location: Pakistan Status: Offline Points: 987 |
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I agree, just a little bit less pressure, to ensure all of the glue does not squeeze out, and more time to give it time to harden and ry up while still under a lot of pressure. |
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Darker Speed 90 10mm: Dawei IQUL
Ahinoki Lutz Spruce Jpen: 729 SuperFX Member: 1-ply Hinoki Club Violin/Acoustic Clan The speed of a Rhino and the power of a Gazelle! |
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5370H55V
Beginner Joined: 10/27/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 79 |
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So acer, any results yet?
And I just thought of something; epoxy dries to be very stiff and hard, so maybe it'll make the blade stiff also? If you want, you could try making identical blades with different glues (wood glue, contact cement, etc) and comparing the feel. |
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Liquid Sky
Member Joined: 02/17/2004 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 70 |
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I'm building blades as well. If you understand any German, there's a large forum (tt-news.de) that can provide you with lots of information about diy blades. Like flatulenzio (probably) I'm also part of this forum.
I specialized basically on two models: 1) Abachi-Carbon: Abachi (Ayous) core, a carbon alternatively carbon/kevlar layer and Limba, Abachi or Koto outer layer: This is glued together with epoxy. You have to be careful to totally coat the fiber. This is the critical step. If you use too less epoxy the blade will be too soft that means the carbon fiber is "wasted". It can be useful to warm the epoxy so that it will be fluid. But be careful, this will reduce the pot life. After letting it dry in the press for at least 24 h (use backing paper!!!) you could apply heat to the laminate (still in the press!) to further harden the epoxy. You have to consult the epoxy manual for the right temperatures and time. If you want to stop the epoxy leaking through the topveneer, you have to close the pores. I'm using lacquer at the inner side of the topveneer.
2) The Classic: Abachi core and Limba middle- and outer ply. This is glued together with bone/hide glue like in the old days. Hide glue gives the blades a special feeling. Compare the interview with Borko in this forum on this topic.
What you always have to keep in mind is the weight! That's why all blades are made of light weight cores like Abachi, Balsa, Kiri or Poplar. All the best Liquid Sky |
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acer800
Silver Member Joined: 12/12/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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UGH! Well the second try was done a days ago. I just forgot to post results. The carbon fiber and everything held in place fortunately. But you guys were right epoxy was so darn hard when hardened. I'm going to try and order some more epoxy but this time I'll get the manual mixing epoxy. Then I'll test out different formulas. Right now the blade I just made is almost exactly like a Butterfly TriCarbon or Primorac Carbon. Flat plain hard fast blade
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markguyver1
Member Joined: 10/26/2006 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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When applying the epoxy, I cut open a plastic trash bag and place it on a flat surface. The carbon fiber is placed on one half and the core or outer ply is placed on the other. The plastic bag will keep the fibers intact and make it easier to tranfer. I'd used the hard foam roller from Home Depot (white, about 1inch thick, 4 inch wide) to evenly saturate the fabric and thin out the excess epoxy. The excess is rolled on the wood. Only a small amount is required. Finally, flip the BAG (fabric half) onto the wood and carefully pill the plastic off. You might have to use the roller to press the fabric onto the wood and to remove any bubbles. Continue with the next layer. Vacuum pump will remove the air pockets and displace them with the epoxy. DO NOT HEAT THE EPOXY because it will cure VERY quickly. This will cause you to rush and swear and of course make a bigger mess.
I'd made a template from a blade and with it, I trace the outline onto my sandwiched board. I'd used a jigsaw to do a rough cut (about 1/2 cm from the outline), but now I'm using a bandsaw. The template is attached to the board by a double sided tape and the two pieces are placed on a router table. The router bit roller is aligned against the template so you'll always have a clean and perfect cut. It usually takes me about 5 minutes to cut each blade.
My first blades (always make twin) had the core and outer plies in a parallel configuration (grains of the inner and outer plies running in the same direction). I didn't like it much because it was too stiff. The one I'm using now has the core running perpendicular to the outer plies. This gives the blade a minute flex that I'd wanted.
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acer800
Silver Member Joined: 12/12/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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I'm thinking about running fans next time. Commercial water fans ( the ones that spray a stream of mist while running) I have two right now too. Because I was working in a very hot place when glueing
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