Bad rubbers
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Category: Equipment
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URL: http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=79148
Printed Date: 05/02/2024 at 10:40pm
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Topic: Bad rubbers
Posted By: ronakvyas86
Subject: Bad rubbers
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 12:48pm
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I've found that the rubbers with, sort of like, an "identity disorder" are actually very bad rubbers. The manufacturers of these rubbers claim that the rubber "falls into their own unique category", say, spinlord sandwind for example. Sandwind is not anti, it's not inverted, then what is it? I'll tell you, it's crap. Another one is tenergy 25, piece of garbage. And rakza 9, oh my. I find the names "rakza" and "yasaka" so much appealing that I fell for it, twice. Rakza 9 is soooo heavy. Spin is not so great, speed not so great, it's expensive, and the control?...uhhh plssss. What's the point of rakza 9? pls tell me someone! A good rubber should fall into a "solid" category like T05 - high thow and spinny, same is baracuda. T64 is speed focused, so is MX-P. Another class of bad rubbers are the ones which claim a unique balance of speed and spin. T80, again, identity disorder....speedy? spinny? Nope, neither, just pricey. Sorry for such a negative post, really pissed at rakza 9 and sandwind today ------------- Yasaka Goiabao 5 CPEN, Donic Baracuda MAX FH & RPB |
Replies:
Posted By: jt99sf
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 1:03pm
You must've just lost to a lower rated player.  BTW, I love T25 - the best Tenergy ! -------------  Photino/Super Viscaria : H3 (FH)/Dr N pips(BH)林德成 HardBat:Hock 3-Ply /Dr Evil |
Posted By: ronakvyas86
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 1:20pm
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I lost few, won few, just like another day. It's not about that. It's about "why this crappy piece of rubber cost 45 dollars???" Also, "I wanted an antispin rubber, why the hell I have to loop with it to win points?" ------------- Yasaka Goiabao 5 CPEN, Donic Baracuda MAX FH & RPB |
Posted By: ronakvyas86
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 1:23pm
Also, I splintered my favourite blade while removing rakza.  ------------- Yasaka Goiabao 5 CPEN, Donic Baracuda MAX FH & RPB |
Posted By: JacekGM
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 1:33pm
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Another one to suite your complain is Yasaka's Rising Dragon... I think that, for players who want to be able to control the rubber very well, there are two types of control to consider: loop control and drive control. The Rising Dragon is very good for all kinds of looping game, not so much for fast drive put-away/smash type of game. Another one like that is Vega Europe, although it is a different type, non-tacky. Cannot smash well with this one. A complete opposite are the Nimbus rubbers that I like very much, especially the NSoft (not the Sound which is mushy) - there, the putaway drives are wonderful but to work it out by looping game is not so easy, just not great for looping. The T25 might be in this category, too, at a higher end. As for the T80, I think this is the best rubber of all that combines the two types of control, but yes it is expensive, and for a player with lesser technique (me
 ) it just does not make sense that much.------------- (1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Yinhe T7 (Fl, 87 g) with Bluefire M3 (red 2.0) on FH and 0.6 mm 755 on BH. |
Posted By: JacekGM
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 1:39pm
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[QUOTE=JacekGM] deleted ------------- (1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Yinhe T7 (Fl, 87 g) with Bluefire M3 (red 2.0) on FH and 0.6 mm 755 on BH. |
Posted By: ronakvyas86
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 1:42pm
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@JacekGM 100% agree with your description of nimbus soft. I loved playing with Nimbus Soft. Had it been more durable, I would've always used it. Had to let go just because of this ------------- Yasaka Goiabao 5 CPEN, Donic Baracuda MAX FH & RPB |
Posted By: SmackDAT
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 2:34pm
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Hmm, I think this "identity disorder" thing is because most players are heavily biased towards one or the other - for example, you get many power loopers and many blockers/counter-drivers, and not many who can do both, therefore they tend to prefer the rubber that suits their "specialised" game (T05 for the former, T64 for the latter etc.) I believe that when you have someone who can do both at a reasonable level and integrates them well into match play, then one can start to realise why rubbers with less specialised characteristics (e.g. Rozena/T80) may be of particular value. ------------- Zhang Jike ALC AN (88g) Tenergy 05 Hard (2.1, B) Tenergy 19 (2.1, R) https://goo.gl/bFWoxW" rel="nofollow - https://goo.gl/bFWoxW |
Posted By: cole_ely
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 4:35pm
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Identity disorder was h3 Japan. ------------- Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b Please let me know if I can be of assistance. |
Posted By: Basquests
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 10:47pm
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As Smackdat said, its probably because the rubber clashes with your style. No-one, not even professionals, have a super balanced game - they have strengths and weaknesses [relatively]. Likewise, amateurs like us are focused on some aspects of the game. Our technique also may clash with certain rubbers. Yes, rubbers without identity are less likely to suit most players, but it may suit some players and that's good enough for some lines. |
Posted By: gekogark1212
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 11:21pm
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That's what I thought of EL-P at the start. Then eventually, and I mean like a year and a half later, I like it. I think we all have different expectations of a rubber depending on how we pair it with blades, our changes in styles, our improvements etc There are no bad rubbers, just bad bank balances. ------------- (\__/) (='.'=) But there's no sense crying over every mistake, (")_(") You just keep on trying till you run out of cake. |
Posted By: gekogark1212
Date Posted: 05/20/2017 at 11:23pm
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But fair to your point, many years ago I used all sorts of rubbers and I agree with you that spinny anti rubber is just awful, sorry, AWFUL to play with. I'm looking at you 729 804. *death eyes* ------------- (\__/) (='.'=) But there's no sense crying over every mistake, (")_(") You just keep on trying till you run out of cake. |
Posted By: jt99sf
Date Posted: 05/21/2017 at 6:18pm
You should try Gambler Reflectoid. ------------- Photino/Super Viscaria : H3 (FH)/Dr N pips(BH)林德成 HardBat:Hock 3-Ply /Dr Evil |
gekogark1212 wrote:Posted By: frogger
Date Posted: 05/23/2017 at 5:14pm
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There have several rubber sheets over the years that I did not like. What may be "garbage" to one player may be gold to another. with all the consideration for variations of styles, levels of play, and the mindset a lot of players have then the long search begins to find that "gold" rubber. I found some of the early Chinese rubbers (40 years ago) to be junk but to the right player they could kick your butt with it. Just keep an open mind when it comes to equipment...after all I can still beat you with Mark V...maybe, maybe not. :) ------------- Wood Paddle Red side Black side. |
Posted By: TT newbie
Date Posted: 05/23/2017 at 8:30pm
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Worst rubber I´ve ever tried was Bluefire M1. It´s heavy, uncontrollable, and too fast for me. Oh yeah, and I had issues trying to glue that shit, ops.. that sheet. On the other hand Bluefire JP 01 was one the best, much more friendly and balanced than M1. But the Turbo version was bad...
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Posted By: mjamja
Date Posted: 05/23/2017 at 11:44pm
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Bad rubbers, Bad rubbers Watcha gonna do, Watcha gonna do When they loop with you? Bad rubbers, Bad rubbers Watcha gonna do, Watcha gonna do When they loop with you? Mark
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Posted By: h0n1g
Date Posted: 05/24/2017 at 1:03am
Because it was too fast for you and basically the wrong rubber for YOU, it's a bad rubber? I'm starting to wonder what I'm reading on these forums. ------------- --- http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=71705&title=feeback-h0n1g" rel="nofollow - My Feedback Thread |
Posted By: TT newbie
Date Posted: 05/24/2017 at 1:19am
Since my post means my own opinion... yes, it is a bad rubber (in my opinion). Is that so hard to understand? Or at least, respect?
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Posted By: Rich215
Date Posted: 05/24/2017 at 7:45am
Rakza...you bad rubber you making his blade splinter and all..... ------------- |
Posted By: berndt_mann
Date Posted: 05/24/2017 at 9:26am
Great stuff, Mark. The soul of a poet combined with the self-deprecating humor of my kind of TT player. I can think of only one thing to do. The player stuck with the bad rubbers has gotta go to a church and a synagogue and talk to a priest and a rabbi. Then persuade them to go to the nearest neighborhood bar where the priest has his customary Guiness, the rabbi his usual Manishewitz, and the unfortunate TT player finding himself unable to loop with bad rubbers drinks himself stone blind with whatever liquor he can afford after shelling out 120 bucks for the bad rubbers using which he lost 156 rating points in his last tournament because he couldn't loop with them. ------------- bmann1942 Setup: Mark Bellamy Master Craftsman blade, British Leyland hard rubber |
Posted By: yogi_bear
Date Posted: 05/24/2017 at 9:26pm
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i do not like Rakza 9. IT feels like a brick but it isn't that fast and you have to put effort in your brush contact against the ball if you want to produce good amount of spin. ------------- Independent online TT Product reviewer of XIOM, STIGA, JOOLA, SANWEI, GEWO, AIR, ITC, APEX, YASAKA and ABROS ITTF Level 1 Coaching Course Conductor, ITTF Level 1 Coach |
Posted By: GeneralSpecific
Date Posted: 05/25/2017 at 2:52pm
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Years back when I tested Tuttle Beijing 4 I really liked the rubber a lot. I even made my first video review of it explaining how I liked it. However, after 1 month both the topsheet and the sponge died. After the second month the rubber turned into a bad antispin rubber and became unplayable. If anyone ever decides to purchase this rubber be prepared to change it once per month. Though I think at that point it's better to get something more durable. ------------- Blade - Xiom 36.5 ALX FL Forehand - Xiom Omega V Asia 2.0mm Backhand - Victas Curl P5V with Der Materialspezialist Firestorm Soft/Outkill 1.8mm sponge |
Posted By: Hozuki
Date Posted: 05/25/2017 at 3:42pm
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The only rubber I would consider 'bad' is one that has production issues, resulting in inconsistencies between sheets or in extremely short durability. There are just bad combinations, such as too bouncy or too undynamic setups. But that still depends on personal preference. |
Posted By: haggisv
Date Posted: 05/26/2017 at 3:43am
Yes my thoughts exactly.  Some rubbers are 'bad' because they simply don't suit you, or require major changes to technique to use them to full advantage. Also the blade can make a huge difference, rubbers that feel dead or lifeless on one blade, can feel crisp and lively on another blade. ------------- Smart; VS>401, Dtecs OX http://tabletennisshop.com.au/index.php?main_page=page&id=42" rel="nofollow - Tenergy Alternatives | http://tabletennis-reviews.com" rel="nofollow - My TT Articles |
Posted By: AndySmith
Date Posted: 05/26/2017 at 5:47am
Yeah, TB4 was great initially but dropped off a cliff so quickly. Was a big shame. Whereas Calibra Tour started off like a fast anti and just...stayed there. Definitely the worst rubber for me that I've ever tried. But I've seen other players use it really well, so I blame myself. Somewhat. ------------- This was a great signature until I realised it was overrated. |
Posted By: iamj8
Date Posted: 05/27/2017 at 8:25am
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Agree with JacekGM and SmackDAT. Tenergy 80 is my favorite Tenergy. ------------- A version of Hurricane 3 A version of Tenergy A Stiga blade... |
Posted By: man_iii
Date Posted: 06/28/2017 at 1:01am
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Bad rubbers for me was like DHS H3 Neo :-P DHS G888 :-P DHS TG3 Neo I dint like Andro Rasant rubbers or any of the Donic rubbers JO Platin , Sonex JP Gold, Bluefire. Tenergy a big solid NOPE. But TG2Neo and TG2 original were superb. I am simply in love with the entire Yasaka line of rubbers MarkV < Valmo < Rakza7 Soft < Rakza7 < Rakza9 / YSD < YRD. |
Posted By: 1dennistt
Date Posted: 06/28/2017 at 8:36am
For me that rubber was Tibhar Grip S Europe, my comments on this rubber would parallel your's for Beijing 4, exactly the same. Couldn't figure out what went wrong at the time...but never tried it again to see if it was a quality control problem or just one bad sheet.  ------------- Donic Waldner World Champion 1989 ZLC (Inner), Donic BlueStorm Pro (Red) Max, ????? (Black) 1.8 mm) |
Posted By: cje
Date Posted: 06/28/2017 at 9:39am
really? I've really enjoyed using Rakza 9-indeed (after 6 months-good durability as the old sheet was still usable), i've just glued on a second sheet. Feels fairly (but not crazily) fast and spinny to me... ------------- http://www.murrayfieldtt.com/ YEO/ Galaxy E-3/ FH: Skyline III Neo / BH: Palio HK 1997 |
Posted By: icontek
Date Posted: 06/28/2017 at 10:43pm
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25 years on, Tibhar Dang is still the worst rubber I have ever used... http://www.tabletennisdb.com/rubber/tibhar-dang.html" rel="nofollow - Dang! Why did I buy this? Heavy, slow, not very spinny and erratic. Overpriced piece of garbo. ------------- http://bit.ly/vLMhuB" rel="nofollow - - RC1042 . OSP Virtuoso AC: PK50 + R42 |
Posted By: haggisv
Date Posted: 06/29/2017 at 12:50am
Quality control I think.. this rubber is both among my best and my worst...I loved the earlier sheets, massive spin and great feel....tried two different sheets later, felt hard with only average spin..so I gave it up due to inconsistancies... didn't know how many more sheets I'd have to go through to get a good one again. Now it seems they're discontinued.
------------- Smart; VS>401, Dtecs OX http://tabletennisshop.com.au/index.php?main_page=page&id=42" rel="nofollow - Tenergy Alternatives | http://tabletennis-reviews.com" rel="nofollow - My TT Articles |
Posted By: Knuckle Ball
Date Posted: 06/29/2017 at 1:18pm
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Those difficult to use effectively at your current style and skill level. So the bad rubbers for me have changed much over the course of many years. Calibra LT I found too bouncy and too fast. Trajectory too flat, couldn't get enough spin on low and medium effort strokes or loops. That was a few years ago when it first came out, now my skill level has improved and I find it not too bad. A few years ago, I actually hated T05, too spin sensitive, hard to control, too fast so bouncy. Now I can use it for an active offensive style of play and I believe it is the best rubber for FH and BH. It may be bad rubber cause I don't know how to use it. Bryce Speed which I first used a few months ago I initially labeled 'bad rubber'. Couldn't generate decent spin on loops, too fast. Drive angle was all wrong, push had less spin, must have given up on it but by just sheer luck, tried switching it to my BH side. Now something just clicked in; insensitive to incoming spin so great service receive, very good and solid for blocks with stinging punchblocks. Great at smashing high spinny loops, fantastic at counters and smashing put aways. What I initially thought as 'bad rubber' was in fact a 'plug n play' rubber for my BH. Just need time to learn how to use it. crap rubber for some may be gold for others. A club mate gave me two pieces of ten year old Srivers red and black. I stuck it on the BHs of two separate blades. I didn't mind if it has lost most of its spin as I used to play with anti rubbers on my BH. It turned out to be two of my most effective setups, good service receive, great control on blocks, I can chop block on the table and chop from afar. Inconsistency in the spin generation of the rubber drove my opponents nuts. Blocks against drives and loops sometimes gave back less spin, no spin, sinking knuckle balls. ------------- Blade: Rosewood NCT V FH: Dignics 05 Black BH: Moristo SP Red |
Posted By: GeneralSpecific
Date Posted: 06/29/2017 at 3:37pm
From what you are writing it seems this is the result of you preferring low throw angle rubbers on your backhand. Both the Calibra LT and Bryce family of rubbers are known for being good inverted rubbers to switch to for people that are used to short pips. They help alleviate the mid-distance weakness of short pips while retaining the spin insensitivity and lower trajectory that are the strong suits of short pips, at least as close as possible for inverted rubber. Low throw angle is often a dirty term for many, especially on the forehand, but for those that seek it or benefit from it those rubbers are a pretty good choice. ------------- Blade - Xiom 36.5 ALX FL Forehand - Xiom Omega V Asia 2.0mm Backhand - Victas Curl P5V with Der Materialspezialist Firestorm Soft/Outkill 1.8mm sponge |
Posted By: Knuckle Ball
Date Posted: 06/29/2017 at 6:56pm
From what you are writing it seems this is the result of you preferring low throw angle rubbers on your backhand. Both the Calibra LT and Bryce family of rubbers are known for being good inverted rubbers to switch to for people that are used to short pips. They help alleviate the mid-distance weakness of short pips while retaining the spin insensitivity and lower trajectory that are the strong suits of short pips, at least as close as possible for inverted rubber. Low throw angle is often a dirty term for many, especially on the forehand, but for those that seek it or benefit from it those rubbers are a pretty good choice. [/QUOTE] I never thought about it that way, that I probably preferred low throw angle rubbers on my BH. And yes you are right, I used to prefer using short pips BH years ago twiddling with 802 Mystery III for some time. Low throw angle a dirty term for many he he he Cool. That's a neat analysis of how I play. Thanks GeneralSpecific ------------- Blade: Rosewood NCT V FH: Dignics 05 Black BH: Moristo SP Red |
Posted By: anubhav1984
Date Posted: 06/29/2017 at 11:46pm
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The worst of the lot for me was Stiga's Magna TCII. Not sure if the regular magna was any good but ordered this one under the assumption that it would be close to Boost TC or be something similar in that range. It turned out to be a dud. It has such a low throw and no speed, no power...just control. Don't know what it is good for because if you try using that control on the forehand, then the rubber lands into the net. If you try using it on the backhand, there isn't enough spring to land the ball across the net. And then there is Tibhar's Grip-S. Such a huge quality control disaster. The first sheet that I bought was amazing to play with. It was a dream. The moment I removed its glue layer though, it became a piece of shit. ------------- Butterfly Viscaria FL FH - Undecided BH - Undecided |