|
|
Review: 7 fast blades-Photino,Maze,Jarmd,K5/6,T4/8 |
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Author | |
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Posted: 04/21/2009 at 4:07pm |
Recently there had been lot of interest on some of these fast but nice blades. Galaxy: K5,T4,T8, K6 Avalox: J-Aramid, Butterfly: Photino, Maze, Mizutani Jun, Amultart Some edits in red
Some more edits in green
I play a mixed game, somewhat close to table,with current rating 1714.
FH : Tenergy
BH : Palio Macro era (played with zeta on some of these blades) / tenergy 64
I got to test these 7 blades for a while now, and ready to answer questions J
Here �s a comparative review. I have considered Butterfly Maze as a standard for speed, since lot of people, including myself played with it. Physicial appearance and handle I tried FL of all these blades. Appearance-wise none of these blades are poor. Photino, Amultart and Avalox J-aramid has hinoki outer ply, which looks and feels nice, but prone to dents or even nail marks. T-4 and T-8 claims to have Juniper top plys. The top ply looks very very much like hinoki, including a engraving with a number that starts with HKY(in T-4). K-5 and K-6 claims to have ayuos top ply, and feels more like it. The top ply is harder and has hairline grooves on it. And is completely resistant to spintering. So no sealing is required. But I see a problem if you reglue. It may soak up some glue and get heavier over time. I personally prefer this harder top ply , as it reacts slightly better with my hard tenergy05 sponge. Mizutani Jun has limba top ply, pretty soft... more suited for away from table / mid distance loops. Mizutani and Amultart have similar construction with zylon carbon layers. the major 2 differences are- thickness (mizu i think 5.6 and amultart more than 7mm), and outerply of amultart is hinoki.
K5, K6 and J-Aramid has Kevlar / aramid layers. (to my knowledge Kevlar is just a brand subset of aramid), while T8 has Arylate caron layers, Photino has Zylon fibre (no carbon), and t-4 is unique that it has 4 thin carbon fleece/layer.
Th handle style of T 4 and t-8 are a little on thicker side, while K-5 probably marginally thinner handle among all of these, J-aramid and photino are average and closer to k5 than T- series. MJ and Amultart has slightly thicker FL handle, i would love it if the handles were few mm longer.
Look wise: Amultart> Photino, Mizutani, Maze > T4, T8,K5> J-Aramid >>>k6 (hate the handle color) Weight This will of course vary from piece to piece, but as per the ones I got: Photino is lightest. (I don�t know whether butterfly�s claim on zylons properties are correct, but I know for sure these blades are pretty light). MJ is also very light. Amultart is light among the blades of similar thickness... although it is heavier than photino or MJ. Others didn�t strike me as significantly light or heavy. Ts are probably slightly heavier than Ks due to bigger head size. J-aramid is okay light in spite of its head size. Speed This is probably easiest to compare, and I find it�s markedly different from how the manufacturers rate it. My rating below is based on considering Michael Maze as 10. T8 � 13 T4 � 12.5 Amultart - 12.25 ;)
J-aramid � 11.5
Mizutani - 11.5
K-5-11.0
Photnio � 11.0 Michael Maze � 10
K-6 � 9.5/10 Dwell Time Mizutani Jun>K6>K5,Photino>j-aramid, Amultart>Maze>>T-4>T-8 T-4 and T-8 has pretty low hold time, the ball rebounds crisply without much chance to adjust your stroke. Less forgiving... for the player and the opponent, both. i personally like that. Mizutani Jun is very high dwell blade. My observations are:
1. its not good for players close to table
2. not good for players with fast compact hand movement... timing will be problem since the ball doesn't leave your blade when you want it to.
3. for away from table loops the dwell time helps executing big loops more consistantly
4. the high dwell makes it high throw. and that becomes almost unplayable with high throw tenergy 05. no wonder Mizutani himself plays tenergy 64
I sincerely doubt if the dwell time is for zylon as butterfly claims or the lower thickness of the blade and soft top ply. because Amultart is quite different even with same zylon layers.
K5 and Photino allows nice dwell time, particularly K5. I love this blade for this. J-aramid also allows nice dwell-time NOT better than Mizutani Jun IMO, but not better than Photino. (apologize for wrong info earlier). K6 is slower and has even higher dwell time, but low speed. Amultart is my current blade with T-4 and K-5 as back-up. For my game involving close to table - mid distance mix of compact loop and smash, punch blocks and third ball / fifth ball attacks i found Amultart very good. (but i haven't played with it long enough). T-4 is very very similar to amultart, slightly heavier and slightly more powerful.
Sound J T-8 � Tkluck T-4 � Tcklung J-aramid � Thatch K-5 � Truk K-6 - Trruk Mizutani Jun -........ wait the ball is still hanging in there ;)
Ha ha.. kidding. But yes among all of these only T-4 has some ping, not significant, but noticeable.
Hard hits and loop drives: They work better in order of speed. T-8 is best, and K6 doesn�t cut it. Control Almost exactly in sequence of their dwell time.. except for the fact that with photino and mizutani lot of my loops were not clearing the net due to timing error. however for fast and hard strokes, stiff blades like T-8 helps in more pinpoint placement on the table.
Forehand Loops I loved avx J-aramid and K5, they seem to have more perfect speed and control balance for loops. T-8 and T-4 with such low dwell are okay for great winning loops, but difficult to balance in FH and BH equally for a 2 wing looper, like me. Photino is a little funny. It too has the perfect combination for speed and dwell, but I coulldn�t loop that great with it. I think it could be the frequency of vibration, or the light blade or something, or may be just the feeling, that makes you feel felt as if the center of gravity is no right where it is supposed to be while looping. Again when I tried to balance the blade on my finger, it was okay just like other blades. K-5 is slightly head heavy with tenergies, and although I don�t usually like head heavy blades, my experience here was different. Vibration and ball feel:
Photino and T-4 has some vibration. Others are damped by either arylate or aramid. Arylate in T-8 seems to make the blade a stiff, while aramid blades like J-aramid, K-5, K-6 still has decent flex, but not much vibration.
Better ball feel is a difficult call and people will differ. for me probably:
Photino> K5,K6, Maze>J-aramid> T-4,T8
Forgivingness K6>K5, photino>J-aramid>>>>T-4>T-8 Blocks Accuracy on blocks is same as �forgivingness�. But higher speed blades has better rebound. If you consider control and ability to punch block photino is best. Photino>K6, maze> K5>J-aramid>T-8>T-4 IMO, stiff but slow blades help in blocking and it�s a balance between the 2. pl note T-8 blocks better than T-4. Throw: Being fast composite blades none of them are really high throw like wooden blades. in fact i found Hurricane King to be much higher throw than all of these.
But still to compare,K6, maze and K-5 has comparitively higher throw, followed by photino, and then J-aramid, T-4, and then T-8 has really low throw.
Pushes Expectedly, K-6 and maze being slower and high dwell, are best in this department. Others nothing special. Reaction with Tenergy This could be my hallucination. But I feel the harder ayous top ply of K5 and K6 gets better out of tenergy sponge compared to maze or j-aramid or photino. But yes when you go to the level of t-4 and t-8 with the very thin top wood layer, the carbon /arylate shows up in your shots, and that is altogether a different level of tenergy speed and spin. Price I found price is no way related to characteristics of the blades. Photino>>Maze>J-Aramid>>K5,K6>T4>T8 Or more precisely: butterfly>avalox>galaxy J What�s missing? Will add it later by editing this review. |
|
Sponsored Links | |
JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Terrific review! no doubt it will help some people in their search for the holy grail
|
|
Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
Say "no!" to expensive table tennis equipment. Please... |
|
kruno
Beginner Joined: 03/03/2009 Location: Vietnam Status: Offline Points: 11 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Thank you so much for this. Although I never try Avalox and Galaxy products, your review still helpful cause I'm considering about Photino.
|
|
He who conquers others is strong; He who conquers himself is mighty
Lao Tzu |
|
Nutriment6464
Silver Member Joined: 11/20/2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 608 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Thanks so much, i've just received me k-6 but haven't tried it yet, that's helping me a lot for the choice of rubbers.
|
|
stepheN
Super Member Joined: 09/05/2008 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 146 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
thanks
i received my T-8 one week ago and played twice with it... it's too fast for me (at this time) as i'm coming from a keyshot light can you give me an advice for a slower blade of the T-Series? What about T-6 or T-7? Its labeled "OFF-" in a germany online shop but thats probably still fast? According to your rating i'm probably looking for a blade around 10... And should be Arylate(not that important)/Carbon and i definitely want to stick to T05 on my FH. thanks in advance |
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
i think your best bet is k-5. if i knew it, i wouldn't have spent so much money trying all these blades. hopefully my experience with all these blades would save some time and money for others.
if you want anything better than k5, i can only suggest mizutani jun... among the blades i played.
|
|
the_theologian
Premier Member Joined: 01/11/2009 Location: U.S. Status: Offline Points: 3895 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
If you're willing to leave Galaxy on this one, you won't be disappointed with the Dawei GTS. Still a rather stiff* carbon yet phenomenal control and not too fast. It's not an Arylate Carbon, but I think you'll be very surprised how well it plays.
(The only blade I've tried in the T-series in the T2... way too light/stiff/fast for me.)
*I don't like flexible blades... if you do, you might try the Gambler Arylate Carbon
|
|
Appelgren Allplay ST / Vega Europe max
|
|
Jonan
Premier Member Joined: 02/18/2009 Location: Elsweyr Status: Offline Points: 2933 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
This helps a loooot. My friend was looking for a new blade and we were looking at Michael Maze and other butterfly blades and I was suggesting the Galaxy blades, specifically the K-5, K-6, and I was looking at the T-2 for myself to try out, but there is so little comparative info on the blades on the net, until this of course. This should really help us make a more informed decision on them, thanks a lot!
|
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Jonan .. thanks .. i made some updated... and some more coming shortly.
|
|
Jonan
Premier Member Joined: 02/18/2009 Location: Elsweyr Status: Offline Points: 2933 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Did you do specific weights, or get them weighed? I've found especially with Galaxy blades, it's hard to get a K-5 under 90 grams, same with other ones, they say 85+-3, but really it's more like 90+10-4.
|
|
Jonan
Premier Member Joined: 02/18/2009 Location: Elsweyr Status: Offline Points: 2933 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
After trying my friend's K-5 he got today and put his Jo Platin hard on, I have to say you went with a good one out of this bunch. It is a powerful precision insturment. It has awesome control, but not like forgiving control, like it does what you tell it to do with good technique control. My friend was having problems at first with it going off the table, but I tried it, and it was technique, he swings too flat, a carryover from his tricarbon blade. But with good technique...man, I am so jelous of it now, I seriously want to get one. The backhand is just perfect with it, just perfect, so much control and placement, just can go corner to corner with forehand and backhand with such ease and placement, so nice.
|
|
cole_ely
Premier Member Joined: 03/16/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6898 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
gts is an arylate carbon I'm pretty sure. Im even making my wavestones a/c now.
|
|
Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b
Please let me know if I can be of assistance. |
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Jonan good that my review was helpful. i had felt the same issue with k-5 as your friend faced.. because i am also used to faster hand movement using higher speed blades. If your friend wants to stick to his style, the best blade below $50 would probably be 729 V-6. I played with that blade after i had posted the review... but it definitely deserves its position priced at $28 only.
However since i have seen many higher players playing slightly slower blades, K-5 definitely has its appeal. i am settled with Amultart... for my style.. but its a overkill on price. |
|
asyraf
Silver Member Joined: 07/12/2008 Location: Malaysia Status: Offline Points: 654 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
i use hinoki shake 7 now.. good dwell time.. good for spin..
|
|
Blade: TBS
FH: Sriver L 2.1mm BH: Vega Europe Max |
|
Antiq
Silver Member Joined: 06/30/2008 Location: Singapore Status: Offline Points: 732 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Try ttrubberman, manage to get 2 K-5 below 90 gram (87 and 88 gram)! tell him your spec!
All thks to Debraj. His review had help me decide on the right blade for me... I've been using a T8 and realised that it is way way too fast for me. Thus my stroke is not consistent... Tried changing to a 5 ply wooden blade. But realised that there is no power and too much vibration. Thus this review had help me zoom into K-5, which has better control and not too fast, very little vibration andvalue for money! With that, I'm now looking for the right rubber, and keeping the total weight around 180gram!
|
|
bruno_ar2002
Super Member Joined: 04/07/2005 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 158 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Debraj,
I think you have got some number wrong, in the couple of month I have been trying out pthotino and JM, with T05 2.1, and I do not concur with your review, here are my thought: Speed: photino is faster, one can confirm this simple by bouncing the ball, without trying it. The difference is not much but there is a difference. Spin: It feels in general than JM generates more spin, maybe because is a little slower, it feels so when looping, pushing and in serves. Control: here it is a little ambiguity between the two In serve and pushes JM has lot more control, the ball does not pop up so much, the throw angle is much lesser in the JM than in the Photino, and it is much easer too push more aggressively, the ball stays on the table (manly because of the speed of the Photino). On the other hand when one pushes with the Photino the ball goes a little faster so it compensates the lack of spin(less control). In blocks I think (not sure, TT is not a science), when u are blocking a high speed ball with much spin u have more control with JM, but other wise it is easer to block with photino, this is do to the higher dwell time of the photino, the balls sinks in and arcs back to the opposite table (not sure how two explain this), while in the JM the ball goes much more straighter line. Control: no one wins Hardness: JM is harder Dwell time: Photino has much more. Sweet spot: Not sure, I think that the Photino has larger, but I might get confused with by the speed property, but it feels like the JM has a more regular sweet spot, the difference between the sweet spot and the border does not change much (this is give u more control when missing the sweet spot) Sound: The photino make a crisp sound when u hit the sweet spot (vibrates a little more) Looping: In general I think the photino is much better, mainly because of its speed and dwell time it is much easer to loop. With JM and used rubber I had some problems when looping far of the tables. While with the photino no problem. When looping under spin balls both performs well, the photino with more speed and JM with a little more spin. When looping fast balls (blocks) near the table the photino is a little more forgiving (mainly because of its dwell time and hardness. This I notices especially when looping with BH, it much more easer). Serving: Better with the JM In general both are very good blades, but with T05 I prefer the photino, maybe with a softer rubber (T64) the JM can excel the photino, some other day I�ll try it out, for now I stick with the photino. |
|
FH: H3B 40
BH: TGS 3-60 Blade: ZJ ALC |
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
i could agree with you on photinos speed. even though i personally think that's because a difference in timing due to the different dwell times.
but on dwell time.. i am fairly certain MJ is more dwell. on looping.. i think MJ is for very specialized players ... who loop from away from table with big hand movement ... and very few of us average players could really like it. no wonder that nobody except mizutani uses this blade.. and probably he has changed the actual blade by now.. but butterfly kept the color and design like that. i agree photino is nicer feel... till i played amultart ;) |
|
Antiq
Silver Member Joined: 06/30/2008 Location: Singapore Status: Offline Points: 732 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
debraj, can I check what is printed on your K-5. Is it "Medium Fast" or "Fast'? I'm quite puzzle because the one I bought is printed "Medium Fast' but the picture on Yinhe's website show that it is "Fast".
Anyone else can verify this?
|
|
Jonan
Premier Member Joined: 02/18/2009 Location: Elsweyr Status: Offline Points: 2933 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I put new rubber on mine yesterday and I'm pretty sure mine said medium fast as well. |
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
dont worry about that... all k5s are now medium fast... yin he corrected their old rating about the blade ... the blade is the same
|
|
Antiq
Silver Member Joined: 06/30/2008 Location: Singapore Status: Offline Points: 732 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Thks Jonan.
debraj,
yes but Yinhe just replied that their K5s are still printed "Fast".. Btw we all may have bought our K5s from the SAME SELLER...
I just love the K5 blades so... what the hack...
|
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
yep.. i thought so too.. good that you like this blade. this is one of the great undiscovered blades from yin-he.
i have found only one blade better suited for my game than this... you can see my signature... but that is 4 times as expensive... and prolly only 20% better. |
|
aurelio
Beginner Joined: 10/05/2008 Status: Offline Points: 69 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
debraj,
You stated that the K5 is slightly head heavy with tenergy and that you usually don't like head heavy blades but your experience with the K5 was different. Care to elaborate why? |
|
Galaxy K5
Tenergy 05 Gambler Outlaw |
|
aurelio
Beginner Joined: 10/05/2008 Status: Offline Points: 69 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
debraj?
|
|
Galaxy K5
Tenergy 05 Gambler Outlaw |
|
anubhav1984
Gold Member Joined: 05/08/2009 Location: Snoqualmie, WA Status: Offline Points: 1214 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Hi Debraj,
Can you please tell me whether the Galaxy K-5 that you tested was marked as Medium Fast or Fast? And where did you buy yours from? Regards, Anubhav |
|
Butterfly Viscaria FL
FH - Undecided BH - Undecided |
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
don't worry about it.. earlier they used to mark as fast .. later they started marking medium fast.
but basically the blade is unchanged |
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
i don't like head heavy blades as they cause rotator calf pain. also they don't provide as good control as balanced blades.
i meant to say in spite of the head heaviness of k5 (thanks to tenergies on both sides), the other properties were soo good, that i forgot about that little balance thingy. |
|
asyraf
Silver Member Joined: 07/12/2008 Location: Malaysia Status: Offline Points: 654 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
gergely 21..
|
|
Blade: TBS
FH: Sriver L 2.1mm BH: Vega Europe Max |
|
anubhav1984
Gold Member Joined: 05/08/2009 Location: Snoqualmie, WA Status: Offline Points: 1214 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
But from what i have heard, it is the other way round!! Previously they used to mark it as Medium Fast but now they mark it as Fast. Even on their website the pic shows it marked as Fast itself. Can you please check and tell me the rating on yours? I am a bit worried!!! |
|
Butterfly Viscaria FL
FH - Undecided BH - Undecided |
|
debraj
Premier Member Joined: 06/04/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3369 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
mine was medium fast.
you may be right with the sequence... what i mean is the wood, the blade design, the kevlar layers .. dimensions didn't change... only the rating because they felt like that. why does that bother you? if you tell me what's your concern, i can try to help... |
|
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |
Forum Home | Go to the Forums | Forum Help | Disclaimer
MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd. |