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GAC GROUP 2012 ITTF World Tour, Chile Open

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    Posted: 04/27/2012 at 11:52pm
Training 26/04/2012







Men's Singles - Quarter Final  28/04/2012  GTM-4:
iTTV live



 1   71 MIZUTANI Jun JPN    
 17:30 - 28/4/2012   Table 2   -: --- ---
   
 2   67 CHAN Kazuhiro JPN    
 3   63 FILUS Ruwen GER    
 17:30 - 28/4/2012   Table 1   -: --- ---
   
 4   16 MATSUMOTO Cazuo BRA    
 5   95 ZHAN Jian ^^ SIN    
 18:15 - 28/4/2012   Table 2   -: --- ---
   
 6   70 MATSUDAIRA Kenji JPN    
 7   66 MENGEL Steffen GER    
 18:15 - 28/4/2012   Table 1   -: --- ---
   
 8   91 GAO Ning SIN  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shaks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/28/2012 at 12:45am
Nice to see Jennifer Wu playing.....

Originally posted by u47108 u47108 wrote:

Training 26/04/2012







Men's Singles - Quarter Final  28/04/2012  GTM-4:
iTTV live



 1   71 MIZUTANI Jun JPN    
 17:30 - 28/4/2012   Table 2   -: --- ---
   
 2   67 CHAN Kazuhiro JPN    
 3   63 FILUS Ruwen GER    
 17:30 - 28/4/2012   Table 1   -: --- ---
   
 4   16 MATSUMOTO Cazuo BRA    
 5   95 ZHAN Jian ^^ SIN    
 18:15 - 28/4/2012   Table 2   -: --- ---
   
 6   70 MATSUDAIRA Kenji JPN    
 7   66 MENGEL Steffen GER    
 18:15 - 28/4/2012   Table 1   -: --- ---
   
 8   91 GAO Ning SIN  

~shaks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chunyenliu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 1:05pm
match video please?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 1:19pm

Pro Tour Chile Open Table Tennis 2012


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 3:18pm
Its such a pity how one Pro tour can be treated like trash, where the other Pro tour has some sort of support by ITTF.
Why bother making it a pro tour if ITTF has different levels of supporting it.
Refering to ITTV, or lack of Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZingyDNA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 3:42pm
Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

Its such a pity how one Pro tour can be treated like trash, where the other Pro tour has some sort of support by ITTF.
Why bother making it a pro tour if ITTF has different levels of supporting it.
Refering to ITTV, or lack of Confused


I heard the prize money for making the quarters is 600 USD. Not enough money to even bring the personel and equipment over there, I guess Ouch
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bbkon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 4:21pm
Originally posted by ZingyDNA ZingyDNA wrote:

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

Its such a pity how one Pro tour can be treated like trash, where the other Pro tour has some sort of support by ITTF.
Why bother making it a pro tour if ITTF has different levels of supporting it.
Refering to ITTV, or lack of Confused


I heard the prize money for making the quarters is 600 USD. Not enough money to even bring the personel and equipment over there, I guess Ouch



now i see why there was so many upsets, the answer is the stag tables omg  ,they should sue stag and chilean federation..if i m amateur how come a pro used to play in stiga,joola,dhs tables  can play in that crappy tables.. high spin and speed fade quickly in that furniture

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 4:30pm
Originally posted by bbkon bbkon wrote:

Originally posted by ZingyDNA ZingyDNA wrote:

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

Its such a pity how one Pro tour can be treated like trash, where the other Pro tour has some sort of support by ITTF.
Why bother making it a pro tour if ITTF has different levels of supporting it.
Refering to ITTV, or lack of Confused


I heard the prize money for making the quarters is 600 USD. Not enough money to even bring the personel and equipment over there, I guess Ouch



now i see why there was so many upsets, the answer is the stag tables omg  ,they should sue stag and chilean federation..if i m amateur how come a pro used to play in stiga,joola,dhs tables  can play in that crappy tables.. high spin and speed fade quickly in that furniture

 
ITTF dare calls it Pro Tour, then they need to make it Pro Tour.
I think it is that simple.
You can't have Pro Tour A league and Pro Tour B league - talking about equipment, tables etc etc.
Pro Tour is Pro Tour.
If other sports hears about how ITTF runs these different quality of pro tours, then they would laugh
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 5:02pm
Originally posted by ZingyDNA ZingyDNA wrote:

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

Its such a pity how one Pro tour can be treated like trash, where the other Pro tour has some sort of support by ITTF.
Why bother making it a pro tour if ITTF has different levels of supporting it.
Refering to ITTV, or lack of Confused


I heard the prize money for making the quarters is 600 USD. Not enough money to even bring the personel and equipment over there, I guess Ouch


well in the end it's all business.
if they don't have sponsors or a big audience they can't pay much money.
otherwise they'd end up losing money themselves (the organizers).
I guess the long distance makes it a not so attractive pro tour to play.
it is cheaper however I assume, comparing it to europe and japan and all those places.


Edited by sa01 - 04/29/2012 at 5:05pm
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ya, that is true Thumbs Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bbkon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 5:25pm

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

ya, that is true Thumbs Down


with that amateur quality tables the top10 players will never want to play in southamerica and the sport will be evrytime more unpopular in that part of the world, see  no internet coverage, bad tables..  i d like to burn a stag table and send the footage in 1080dp resolution and send it to adham.. do you guys see the whole picture: stag(india), adham(egypt)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 5:32pm
I don't want to bring in any country into this.
 
I just feel ITTF should try and develop the game.
If for any reason that Stag tables are not good enough - it is still ITTF match approved, so some questions needs to be asked to ITTF and Stag or India shouldn't be bought into this.
 
So if they want to have a South American Pro Tour (which I feel it is super important), they need to back it with sponsors, tables, cash prizes, player invitation and most important - world wide coverage.
 
ITTF is the governing body. The boss - you simply don't blame the employees or staff, you need to blame the boss.
And I think this boss isn't really promoting, it is more like demoting
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/29/2012 at 6:29pm
I don't think it's about the tables really....
as far as I know ittf is not the organizer.
the chilean federation is.
so chilean federation needs to get sponsors, tv coverage, crowd, publicity, organization staff, etc.
and they also need to pay ittf for having a pro tour event.
actually it's a pretty expensive show to mount so to make it big you need to win big.

table tennis is not a popular sport in chile.
thus not a big crowd.
thus sponsors are not interested.
thus the balance of the event starts going down.
thus less money payed to players and less money available for infrastructure (this includes tv/ittv coverage).

argentina would love to mount a pro tour.
but it takes some serious money.
and the argentine federation is poor.

chilean government gives a lot of money to promote sports, that's why they are able to mount a pro tour.
but it seems the bills are not quite there and the quality of the event has been going down in the latest years.
as for ittf, afaik, it has nothing to do.

regarding tables, it's also related to federations.
the national chilean federation probably has a contract with stag (yes, maybe adham or ittf has something to do with this).
so stag provides all the tables and probably other equipment as well for the federation events.
I really don't know about stag tables quality, but if they were too bad I don't think they would be using them.

so as you can see the situation is far from adham saying
"ok let's mount a pro tour in chile to promote table tennis, take all the cameras there, take all our staff there, good tables, let's promote our sport!!!! buahahahhaha"

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

I don't want to bring in any country into this.
 
I just feel ITTF should try and develop the game.
If for any reason that Stag tables are not good enough - it is still ITTF match approved, so some questions needs to be asked to ITTF and Stag or India shouldn't be bought into this.
 
So if they want to have a South American Pro Tour (which I feel it is super important), they need to back it with sponsors, tables, cash prizes, player invitation and most important - world wide coverage.
 
ITTF is the governing body. The boss - you simply don't blame the employees or staff, you need to blame the boss.
And I think this boss isn't really promoting, it is more like demoting


Edited by sa01 - 04/29/2012 at 6:46pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bbkon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 12:03am
Originally posted by sa01 sa01 wrote:

I don't think it's about the tables really....
as far as I know ittf is not the organizer.
the chilean federation is.
so chilean federation needs to get sponsors, tv coverage, crowd, publicity, organization staff, etc.
and they also need to pay ittf for having a pro tour event.
actually it's a pretty expensive show to mount so to make it big you need to win big.

table tennis is not a popular sport in chile.
thus not a big crowd.
thus sponsors are not interested.
thus the balance of the event starts going down.
thus less money payed to players and less money available for infrastructure (this includes tv/ittv coverage).

argentina would love to mount a pro tour.
but it takes some serious money.
and the argentine federation is poor.

chilean government gives a lot of money to promote sports, that's why they are able to mount a pro tour.
but it seems the bills are not quite there and the quality of the event has been going down in the latest years.
as for ittf, afaik, it has nothing to do.

regarding tables, it's also related to federations.
the national chilean federation probably has a contract with stag (yes, maybe adham or ittf has something to do with this).
so stag provides all the tables and probably other equipment as well for the federation events.
I really don't know about stag tables quality, but if they were too bad I don't think they would be using them.

so as you can see the situation is far from adham saying
"ok let's mount a pro tour in chile to promote table tennis, take all the cameras there, take all our staff there, good tables, let's promote our sport!!!! buahahahhaha"

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

I don't want to bring in any country into this.
 
I just feel ITTF should try and develop the game.
If for any reason that Stag tables are not good enough - it is still ITTF match approved, so some questions needs to be asked to ITTF and Stag or India shouldn't be bought into this.
 
So if they want to have a South American Pro Tour (which I feel it is super important), they need to back it with sponsors, tables, cash prizes, player invitation and most important - world wide coverage.
 
ITTF is the governing body. The boss - you simply don't blame the employees or staff, you need to blame the boss.
And I think this boss isn't really promoting, it is more like demoting


latin american countries use stag because stag gives away one free table if you buy 8 and give you away other stag stuff, and they  are forced to use stag tables in latin american tournaments..ask any player and will tell you how much they suck, the ball always sinks in to the net..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote u47108 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 4:07pm
I'm Chilean and I think the same, the STAG tables are bad, bad decision was the Chilean federation of table tennis using. Our leaders have over ten years without any changes, we need new people who can do more professional things right.
With regard to the ITTV, responsible for live video transmission were not sent by the ITTF.








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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 4:15pm
Originally posted by bbkon bbkon wrote:

Originally posted by sa01 sa01 wrote:

I don't think it's about the tables really....
as far as I know ittf is not the organizer.
the chilean federation is.
so chilean federation needs to get sponsors, tv coverage, crowd, publicity, organization staff, etc.
and they also need to pay ittf for having a pro tour event.
actually it's a pretty expensive show to mount so to make it big you need to win big.

table tennis is not a popular sport in chile.
thus not a big crowd.
thus sponsors are not interested.
thus the balance of the event starts going down.
thus less money payed to players and less money available for infrastructure (this includes tv/ittv coverage).

argentina would love to mount a pro tour.
but it takes some serious money.
and the argentine federation is poor.

chilean government gives a lot of money to promote sports, that's why they are able to mount a pro tour.
but it seems the bills are not quite there and the quality of the event has been going down in the latest years.
as for ittf, afaik, it has nothing to do.

regarding tables, it's also related to federations.
the national chilean federation probably has a contract with stag (yes, maybe adham or ittf has something to do with this).
so stag provides all the tables and probably other equipment as well for the federation events.
I really don't know about stag tables quality, but if they were too bad I don't think they would be using them.

so as you can see the situation is far from adham saying
"ok let's mount a pro tour in chile to promote table tennis, take all the cameras there, take all our staff there, good tables, let's promote our sport!!!! buahahahhaha"

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

I don't want to bring in any country into this.
 
I just feel ITTF should try and develop the game.
If for any reason that Stag tables are not good enough - it is still ITTF match approved, so some questions needs to be asked to ITTF and Stag or India shouldn't be bought into this.
 
So if they want to have a South American Pro Tour (which I feel it is super important), they need to back it with sponsors, tables, cash prizes, player invitation and most important - world wide coverage.
 
ITTF is the governing body. The boss - you simply don't blame the employees or staff, you need to blame the boss.
And I think this boss isn't really promoting, it is more like demoting


latin american countries use stag because stag gives away one free table if you buy 8 and give you away other stag stuff, and they  are forced to use stag tables in latin american tournaments..ask any player and will tell you how much they suck, the ball always sinks in to the net..


I've never seen a stag table in argentina....
I think here they have some dhs.
but they are old tables, I think if pros looked at them they wouldn't want to play there.


Edited by sa01 - 04/30/2012 at 4:20pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 4:24pm
I have experience on Stag tables.
I noticed uneven bounce on a 2 of them I played with - some bounce so high and you would be suprised by the sudden tennis ball bounce.

Imagine if you playing a short game and you going for a underspin, and the ball bounces upwards or the ball is long, and bounces to your top edge of your racket. Both examples, my timing was off, and couldn't go through with a countrol and powerful shot

I thought the table was just "damaged", didn't know there was so many unhappy experiences out there



Edited by ZApenholder - 04/30/2012 at 4:27pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 4:39pm
whatever the conditions, they were the same for all players, so it's not an excuse.

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

I have experience on Stag tables.
I noticed uneven bounce on a 2 of them I played with - some bounce so high and you would be suprised by the sudden tennis ball bounce.

Imagine if you playing a short game and you going for a underspin, and the ball bounces upwards or the ball is long, and bounces to your top edge of your racket. Both examples, my timing was off, and couldn't go through with a countrol and powerful shot

I thought the table was just "damaged", didn't know there was so many unhappy experiences out there

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 4:40pm
Re pictures: they what? decided not to give medals to the 3rd places? that girl in white is certainly easy on the eyes but what the heck is she doing standing in front of pedestal's 3rd place slot in all  the pictures? that's unclear (at least)

And why is number 2 barely hanging there? was it photoshopped later? digits 2 and 3 seem that way but I might be wrong, of course.
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Lol JimT Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 5:18pm
Originally posted by sa01 sa01 wrote:

whatever the conditions, they were the same for all players, so it's not an excuse.



I guess you are replying to me?
Did I make it sound like an excuse?
I am sharing my experience with Stag tables, and reply back to forum member disliking Stag tables.

BTW, I won those games comfortably, so I dont' need to find excuse, or to complain to you and forum members after 3 mont ago.
Do you have experience on Stag tables?
Maybe you disagree with me from your experience, but surely you don't need to say I'm making excuses by my experiences linking Stag table to Pro Tour usage.
So do you still think I'm making an excuse?

Coming back to the subject, those tables I played with IMO is not ITTF pro tour standards - you may choose to agree, disagree or ignore.

Or wait....maybe you are refering to the players in Chile Open and not me? (I do struggle to understand your sentences at times).

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ikaros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 5:25pm
Im from chile and like here their federation doesnt get much support and money from the goverment thats why everything looks so poorly organized.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 5:31pm
Ikaros,
I was in Paraguay almost 10 years ago.
Was playing with a provincial champion (he said his province was the weakess one so he wasn't in the national team).
His playing venue was a friend's house (Chinese people). They play they every day. I was there for a few times, and didn't see more than 5 people including me.
He mentioned to me he had to fund everything himself.

The fact is Table Tennis is a tier 3 sport (3 refers to lowest) in so many countries and it sure has the potential to be tier1 or even tier 2 (with ease).

Regarding organising. I thought ITTF Pro Tour, either Chile or any country needs to meet x amount of criteria, and I think either ITTF would police it, or would support in a way. (Of course hoping for the later.)


Edited by ZApenholder - 04/30/2012 at 5:35pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fruit loop Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 8:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bbkon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 9:07pm
Originally posted by ikaros ikaros wrote:

Im from chile and like here their federation doesnt get much support and money from the goverment thats why everything looks so poorly organized.

do you have information about the raquets of the pros that played in chile?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 10:07pm
I don't remember ever playing in a stag table.
but I played in unbranded tables, local "argentinian made" tables, in bar tables, in chinese "unknown brand" tables.....
even in some bar tables with wrong measures and what could be called "little mountains" all over the surface (I guess a leak in the roof could do that LOL)
so I know what it's like to play in difficult conditions.



Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

Originally posted by sa01 sa01 wrote:

whatever the conditions, they were the same for all players, so it's not an excuse.



I guess you are replying to me?
Did I make it sound like an excuse?
I am sharing my experience with Stag tables, and reply back to forum member disliking Stag tables.

BTW, I won those games comfortably, so I dont' need to find excuse, or to complain to you and forum members after 3 mont ago.
Do you have experience on Stag tables?
Maybe you disagree with me from your experience, but surely you don't need to say I'm making excuses by my experiences linking Stag table to Pro Tour usage.
So do you still think I'm making an excuse?

Coming back to the subject, those tables I played with IMO is not ITTF pro tour standards - you may choose to agree, disagree or ignore.

Or wait....maybe you are refering to the players in Chile Open and not me? (I do struggle to understand your sentences at times).

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 10:11pm
Originally posted by ikaros ikaros wrote:

Im from chile and like here their federation doesnt get much support and money from the goverment thats why everything looks so poorly organized.


it takes a big chunk of money to organize a pro tour, I wouldn't say they are doing too bad....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/30/2012 at 10:16pm
Originally posted by Fruit loop Fruit loop wrote:

u47108, Do you know Bruno Levis?


I remember when I was there bruno levis was like their biggest star, he was up there with juan papic and was his doubles partner.
but I don't think he stands much of a chance against asian guys.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ikaros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/01/2012 at 12:59am
yeah their level is not high enough to compete at a international level. back in the day there was a lot of young promising stars around my city but most of them quit when they get to college . you just cant live from table tennis alone and theres absolutly no money to be made around it. all the funding comes   from local associations and parents. 
Galaxy Yinhe W6 penhold
Fh: Yasaka Rakza 7 2.0
Bh: Butterfly Cermet 2.1
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sa01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/01/2012 at 1:20am
Originally posted by ikaros ikaros wrote:

yeah their level is not high enough to compete at a international level. back in the day there was a lot of young promising stars around my city but most of them quit when they get to college . you just cant live from table tennis alone and theres absolutly no money to be made around it. all the funding comes   from local associations and parents. 


strange that he stopped competing in 2008, he still seemed very young.
he should have kept at it, you may not get to be the best but you get free trips to exotic locations and all that cool stuff that players get.
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