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back swing as close to the swing as possible

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stiltt View Drop Down
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    Posted: 11/25/2020 at 9:40pm
Years ago, when I learned the reverse pendulum serve MMaze style, I immediately stopped struggling when I noticed that his back swing starts the latest possible, as close as possible to the swing, it goes "tchack-tchack" and it's very fast in a spring effect, the back swing loads energy into the spring that unloads faster than if the back swing had started earlier. I still could do only one in 5 applying the idea but that one in 5 was so good I knew I had nailed it awareness wise. 

Interested in the pronation/supination discussion, I am thinking of applying this to the fh and bh drives and loops: just like in the reverse pendulum serve, more energy is transferred from the back swing to the swing, the hand never stops moving, it is more efficient. 

In both fh and bh, the trajectory is more an ellipse than a straight segment where the paddle stops completely before starting from scratch.

It works only if we crouch more in the back swing to draw a wider/taller ellipse when pushing from the legs (that's more related to the fh), its little axis will be higher. Above all it allows starting the back swing later, that little detail offers a double benefit:
-we have a bit more time to prepare the stroke
-the final speed of the paddle is higher.

On the fh side, in addition to the pronation, lumbar protection and the above, we are starting to close in a seriously well understood stroke.

On the bh side, the idea is even more pronounced when the back swing goes to the non playing hip palm facing down as I tried describing earlier today there, we can go "tchack-tchack" much better than on the more fluid fh where so much more mass is in movement.

The above all sounds logical to me and I wonder why I never read anything uniting all those tidbits into a simple yet solid model. 






Edited by stiltt - 11/26/2020 at 1:52pm
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zeio View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/26/2020 at 1:45am
That's the Stretch-Shortening Cycle(SSC).

http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=82115&PID=1019756&title=forehand-whip-question#1019756
Quote From the backswing to forward swing, the forearm and upper arm muscles would get stretched, where the SSC kicks in, causing the elbow to snap. So, the important thing here is to time it well such that it happens roughly upon impact.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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blahness View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/27/2020 at 7:06am
Originally posted by stiltt stiltt wrote:

Years ago, when I learned the reverse pendulum serve MMaze style, I immediately stopped struggling when I noticed that his back swing starts the latest possible, as close as possible to the swing, it goes "tchack-tchack" and it's very fast in a spring effect, the back swing loads energy into the spring that unloads faster than if the back swing had started earlier. I still could do only one in 5 applying the idea but that one in 5 was so good I knew I had nailed it awareness wise. 

Interested in the pronation/supination discussion, I am thinking of applying this to the fh and bh drives and loops: just like in the reverse pendulum serve, more energy is transferred from the back swing to the swing, the hand never stops moving, it is more efficient. 

In both fh and bh, the trajectory is more an ellipse than a straight segment where the paddle stops completely before starting from scratch.

It works only if we crouch more in the back swing to draw a wider/taller ellipse when pushing from the legs (that's more related to the fh), its little axis will be higher. Above all it allows starting the back swing later, that little detail offers a double benefit:
-we have a bit more time to prepare the stroke
-the final speed of the paddle is higher.

On the fh side, in addition to the pronation, lumbar protection and the above, we are starting to close in a seriously well understood stroke.

On the bh side, the idea is even more pronounced when the back swing goes to the non playing hip palm facing down as I tried describing earlier today there, we can go "tchack-tchack" much better than on the more fluid fh where so much more mass is in movement.

The above all sounds logical to me and I wonder why I never read anything uniting all those tidbits into a simple yet solid model. 


Hmm personally I've tried both, I very much prefer smooth silky strokes haha... I know some people who do quite well with jerkier strokes but I just can't do it...
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FH: Dignics 09c
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