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DHS D40+ to Be Released in April |
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rocketman222 
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Joined: 01/06/2007 Location: Walnut Creek,CA Status: Offline Points: 1151 |
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 Posted: 09/25/2017 at 12:39pm |
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The new one is white and the older ones are off-white
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Baal
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Posted: 09/25/2017 at 1:24pm |
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So people need to know that everything I have said about how much I like D40+ balls pertains to the ones with the thick seam. I haven't seen one with a thin seam yet but will keep a look out for them.
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rocketman222
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Posted: 09/25/2017 at 3:16pm |
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Baal, I agree with you 100% about the thick-seamed off-white colored ones, they are simply as good as nittaku.
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Baal
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Posted: 09/25/2017 at 3:24pm |
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Here is my conspiracy theory of the day. It is a theory and it is based on no facts, it is pure speculation.
But what if....... CNT saw their results with Nittaku and original D40+ balls and didn't like what they saw, so put pressure on their partners, DHS, to make their ABS balls more like the crappy cellulose acetate ones? Again, I am just thinking out loud, but it was based on something that was in the thread from Schlager's old coach, an interview that was on TT11 originally, in which he said that these ABS balls were not good for the way CNT plays? |
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emihet
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Posted: 09/25/2017 at 3:27pm |
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i believe there some truth in that
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Stiga Intensity, Viscaria, Clipper Wood
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zeio
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Joined: 03/25/2010 Status: Offline Points: 7040 |
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Posted: 09/25/2017 at 3:37pm |
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Please refer to my "prediction" nearly six years ago. While we're not exactly one year in with the 3-star D40+, perhaps it's going much better than expected for DHS that they decided to accelerate the schedule.
http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1617&PID=570195&title=fake-butterfly-rubber#570195 |
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Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare) + Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃) = 184.8g |
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Baal
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Posted: 09/25/2017 at 4:20pm |
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Yes there is that too.
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igorponger
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Posted: 09/25/2017 at 8:32pm |
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ABS balls: more improvements to come.
Cellulose acetate (CA) is sometimes referred to as "noncombustible celluloid", and it plays much similar to celluloid as having much the same mechanical properties --hardness, density, dynamic friction etc. In short terms, CA is the best available alternative for celluloid in making table tennis balls. ABS plastic, in its present composition, is a far different beast from celluloid. It is fairly lightweight material 1.15 > 1.40, and it is very rigid.. And inelastic. ABS would producing irregular, bizzare bounce in play.  RIO Olympics 2016 were played with acetate balls, DHS 40+, and it was a spectators pleaser. So many prolonged rallies. The lately WC 2017 in Germany used ABS plastic ball, and it was some mock of the game ... So many missed balls. abridges rallies.Hopefully, chinese CNT will eventually enforce further improvements of ABS product: some softer, ductile material is expected to better emulate the celluloid. |
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Baal
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Posted: 09/25/2017 at 8:38pm |
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So much time spent correcting misinformation.
The idea that cellulose acetate plays like celluloid is simply not correct based on everyone's experience from the top pros down to club players. They are fragile, not round, they do not bounce consistently. They are also expensive. Recall that Igorponger is referring to the plastic Chinese 40+ ball that was introduced in 2014 that everyone hates. Regarding ABS balls, at least the DHS ones that were being made in the early part of this year received very good reviews at all levels. Most people also very much like Nittaku Premium, except for the price. The reason they like them is they bounce consistently, they are round, and they bounce the same height as celluloid. As with all 40+ balls, their spin properties are different from celluloid. Also, we must not have been watching the same matches at WTTC 2017. The rallies were very good. Regarding the very poor quality of the cellulose acetate DHS balls used at Rio, see the following link, with quotes from many players, including Timo Boll, Panagiotis Gionis, Paul Drinkhall, Li Ping, Dima, and even Thomas Weikert: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/13/sports/olympics/table-tennnis-ball-changes-rio-games.html?mcubz=1 |
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Fabian1890
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Joined: 01/15/2017 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 335 |
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Posted: 09/26/2017 at 8:04am |
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Another thing I found out:
During WTTC I won some Andro 3S 40+ balls, the new ones by Andro. Back then I thought they must be some Double Fish ABS ball since they were whiter and had a thinner seam than the D40+, so it could not be a clone. Now it turns out, they are pretty much identical to the new D40+ I bought, at least that's what they look and feel like. So I actually think they are not fake but another version. I have to try them out, maybe they are not as bad as I thought, it was just so weird after being used to the sound of the old D40+... I will keep you posted.
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AcudaDave
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Posted: 09/26/2017 at 3:59pm |
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I am so tired of having to get used to different balls. If I go to a Butterfly tournament then I have to play with the Butterfly balls for a week or so to get used to them. Same for the Joola Flash and the Nittaku premium.
Let me just say right here and now that I don't really care for the Nittaku premium balls. I've talked with some friends that also prefer the Joola Flash and the Butterfly balls over the Nittaku ones. The balls weigh the same but I don't seem to be able to spin the Nittaku balls as much. Some have suggested the material is harder than the others. Is that really the case? Case in point: I depend on winning many points on my backhand loop, and when I loop heavy underspin balls my loop usually has quite a lot of spin that is difficult for my opponents. I played a very good defensive player with the Joola Flash balls and won 6 games in a row without any trouble. Then we switched to the Nittaku premium ball and I lost 11-9 in the 5th! Many times when I tried to loop his heavy chops to my backhand I looped the ball in the net. So why am I having a much harder time looping the Nittaku balls? Some of the other good players I play against are used to playing with the Nittaku balls and claim the Joola Flash (aka XSF balls) bounce much higher and cause them problems. A couple of weeks ago I played a 2150-2200 looper using the Joola Flash ball and won 3-0. Last week I played him again and used the Nittaku and lost 3-0. It's just so frustrating having to go back and forth between different balls as there is clearly differences with the major brands. I also don't like the fact that the Nittaku balls start to yellow after a couple of weeks. What is it about the plastic they use that causes this? The Flash and Butterfly balls stay very white, but the Nittaku yellow after a while. Thanks
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Joola Vynaryz Freeze
Joola Dynaryz ACC max - BH Joola Dynaryz ACC max - FH |
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zeio
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Posted: 09/26/2017 at 5:45pm |
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Those are symptoms of the seamless-withdrawal syndrome. You need to go through the seam-ification again.
Edited by zeio - 09/26/2017 at 5:45pm |
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Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare) + Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃) = 184.8g |
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Fabian1890
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Joined: 01/15/2017 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 335 |
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Posted: 09/26/2017 at 5:59pm |
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So I tried the new DHS 40+ and it's horrible. The sound alone. Let's all hope it was a fake one.
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zeio
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Posted: 09/26/2017 at 6:19pm |
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Found a thread on Tieba, on the same issue, dated late July.
At least two users say there is a new version of D40+, and that it plays better than the old one. The last comment(#18) says the one he got looks yellowish, whereas the one his friend has looks whitish. Edited by zeio - 09/26/2017 at 6:20pm |
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Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare) + Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃) = 184.8g |
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qpskfec
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Joined: 07/28/2011 Status: Offline Points: 468 |
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 1:03am |
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 Left side is May mfg date ball with the thick seam. Right side is a July ball with the thin seam. I put the balls on top of a mini flashlight for the pix. With the naked eye the seams are darker and very easy to see on both balls. I hit balls with my regular practice partner tonight. We have been playing with D40+ since April. We started out with the older balls with the thick seam. Without telling my partner, I switched balls to a newer thin seam ball. He could tell straight away the ball was different. Thin seam balls do not have the nice solid feel of thick seam balls. The trajectory wasn't the same. We didn't play for long with the newer balls. This is a very disappointing development. |
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Fabian1890
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 6:30am |
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Same experience as me. Did you also buy from ttnpp?
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AndySmith
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 6:33am |
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Grrrrrr.
If these are legit DHS balls, I wonder if they put the modified construction back through the ITTF approvals process?
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This was a great signature until I realised it was overrated.
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ashishsharmaait
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Joined: 02/27/2013 Location: India Status: Offline Points: 821 |
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 6:40am |
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I purchased a few packs from Beijing last week for 16 yuan a pack.
It is solid, feels a bit heavier than yinhe s40 and the surface is a bit smooth. How do I tell if it's new or old? Edited by ashishsharmaait - 09/27/2017 at 6:40am |
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haggisv
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 7:11am |
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Look at the seam... see pictures above.
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Baal
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 9:04am |
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Fabian1890
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 9:37am |
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I got the feeling that the „new“ D40+ is actually an old 40+, that’s how they look like. So weird?!
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tom
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 9:48am |
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What does code "XBAG" mean?, Edit - think it means Feb 2017
Edited by tom - 09/27/2017 at 9:53am |
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LUCKYLOOP
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 10:52am |
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Maybe this was their 1st prototype with the seamed ball, a thinner seam, so they are getting rid of some old manufactured production stock. |
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Hntr Fl / 4H & BH Xiom Sigma Pro 2 2.0
Yinhe T-2 / 4H Xiom Sig Pro 2 2.0 BH Xiom Omega IV Elite Max Gam DC / 4H DHS Hurricane 8 39deg 2.1 BH GD CC LP OX HARDBAT / Hock 3 ply / Frenshp Dr Evil OX |
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Fabian1890
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 10:54am |
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Yeah but why is the manufacturing date later than from the good balls?
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Egghead
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 10:58am |
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Do you have an old 40+ to compare with?  May be you are right; actually, if the old 40+ has thicker seam, it would be good to.
Edited by Egghead - 09/27/2017 at 11:23am |
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Aurora ST: Rhyzm / Talent OX
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LUCKYLOOP
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 11:09am |
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They used currently dated boxes to validate the product, or they would have had to accept returns for refunds. |
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Hntr Fl / 4H & BH Xiom Sigma Pro 2 2.0
Yinhe T-2 / 4H Xiom Sig Pro 2 2.0 BH Xiom Omega IV Elite Max Gam DC / 4H DHS Hurricane 8 39deg 2.1 BH GD CC LP OX HARDBAT / Hock 3 ply / Frenshp Dr Evil OX |
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Baal
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 11:25am |
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Alternative hypothesis.
Two factories? |
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AndySmith
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 1:02pm |
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Possible, but pretty lame of DHS to badge them up as the same type of ball when they're obviously made in a different way.
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This was a great signature until I realised it was overrated.
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ashishsharmaait
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 1:09pm |
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Q/YSRP 48 XGAG The ones I have are top notch. Edited by ashishsharmaait - 09/27/2017 at 1:18pm |
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Baal
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Posted: 09/27/2017 at 1:16pm |
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So summarizing the possibilities.
1. The thin seamed ones are fakes. 2. The thin seamed ones are a new product that may be worse than the one they were making earlier. 3. There are two factories making non-identical D40+ balls. We will reject #1 if people start getting thin-seamed ones from authorized dealers like TT11, as opposed to ttnpp. We accept #2 if nobody sees a thick seam on any balls from authorized dealers with manufacturing dates after, say, June of 2017. If a consensus emerges that the thin seamed ones really are worse we can begin to accept the second part of #2. Finally if we see both thin and thick seam versions from authorized dealers that have manufacturing dates of June 2017 or later we would probably reject #2 and accept #3. So I suppose we will know before too long. Someone will let me know if there are possibilities I haven't included. |
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Baal wrote: