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Does this rubber exist?

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Hozuki View Drop Down
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    Posted: 02/27/2019 at 5:40pm
I'm trying to find a rubber with an extremely grippy topsheet, grippier than H3 and also harder than H3, with very high throw.
Sponge  should be medium fast and medium dynamic with hardness about 39 degree DHS scale.
Spin sensitivity I'd like to be as high as possible.

The reason is that I still want to be able to do spinny brush loops with ABS balls. I know many rubbers nowadays want you to hit deep into their sponge to get the spin and speed. But this is very reliant on standing in an optimal position to the ball, which is not something you can achieve consistently. Especially since the floors here are dusty as hell.

Any ideas?

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jt99sf View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jt99sf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/27/2019 at 5:51pm
Spinart.
Photino/Super Viscaria : H3 (FH)/Dr N pips(BH)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/27/2019 at 6:08pm
Im not sure what rubber I could recommend based on your requirements. But I sometimes go to this site to compare the relative characteristics just out of curiosity...



Perhaps you will find something suitable!

FdT 
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haggisv View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote haggisv Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/27/2019 at 6:55pm
Golden Tango, sponge may not be quite as hard (although H3 hardness varies enormously even when it's marked at 39deg), but topsheet is tacky and softer compared to H3, so much easier to spin. Victas 401 is another option, which is not as tacky, but harder sponge and also softer topsheet for high spin.


Edited by haggisv - 02/27/2019 at 10:19pm
Smart; VS>401, Dtecs OX
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Lightzy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lightzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/27/2019 at 8:42pm
Harder and grippier than h3, AND high arc ???? lol that's a hard one...
I don't believe there's such a thing.

I've yet to hear of a rubber harder than h3 and with a high arc.
Harder than h3 means you can barely get any spin out of it unless you're superman or something. If you're really that good my hat is off to you.

The grippiest rubbers I know are all soft sponge (which makes sense), with the absolute grippiest being Rakza7 Soft, which also has a high arc and plays like a tenergy05 except without the top end.
Or why not just Tenergy05? There's nothing it can't do.

Also if the floors are so dusty it affects play, why not clean the goddamn floors :>
And if cleaning is not an option (???), it sounds like you might actually prefer a soft rubber since the topsheet will be dusty and you need the sponge to spin the ball.





Edited by Lightzy - 02/27/2019 at 8:44pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote igorponger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 2:35am
Originally posted by Hozuki Hozuki wrote:

I'm trying to find a rubber with an extremely grippy topsheet, grippier than H3 and also harder than H3, with very high throw.
Sponge  should be medium fast and medium dynamic with hardness about 39 degree DHS scale.
Spin sensitivity I'd like to be as high as possible.

The reason is that I still want to be able to do spinny brush loops with ABS balls. I know many rubbers nowadays want you to hit deep into their sponge to get the spin and speed. But this is very reliant on standing in an optimal position to the ball, which is not something you can achieve consistently. Especially since the floors here are dusty as hell.

Any ideas?



OUR MOST SINCERE GREETINGS FOR the scientific endeavors taken by HaggisV, for over 10 years.
      
By courtesy of HaggisV, you can do all the comparative analysis on a great variety of table tennis rubber.
All the data is gathered in Haggis's diligent testing works with real rubber samples at his hand; Shore O durometer in use.               

https://tabletennis-reviews.com/reference/sponge-hardness-table/

Hurrycane 3 Neo --54*   (tested by Shore O scale)
Hurricane 3 #19   --55*

Hurrikane 3 Blue Sponge --58*
Hurricane 3 Orange --60*

Globe 999 National --63*

So, we do suggest that Globe 999 rubber should meet your need in every way/. It is a hard sponge and tacky rubber up to the extremality/

Be happy.
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Lightzy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lightzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 8:26am
The problem with those very hard rubbers is that they're dead unless you have incredibly good technique and are physically powerful and quick. Which is to say, you won't find the arc high at all.
But I don't know what you're like so if you know what you want it'll probably work for you.
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Shifu View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shifu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 10:06am
Tenergy 05 Hard is missing the tacky surface. Or H3 Neo national blue sponge
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BeaverMD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 10:20am
Originally posted by Lightzy Lightzy wrote:



The grippiest rubbers I know are all soft sponge (which makes sense), with the absolute grippiest being Rakza7 Soft, which also has a high arc and plays like a tenergy05 except without the top end.


+1 on Rakza7 Soft.  If the OP wants a harder sponge, use regular Rakza7.  Lasts very long too for a Tensor. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hozuki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 12:16pm
I think I phrased it a bit unprecisely. I don't want a harder sponge but a harder topsheet.
Sponge hardness should be 39 deg as stated before. But topsheet should be harder and grippier than H3. So that forceful brush loops have minimum energy loss.
I don't like soft sponged rubbers on my FH. So no rakza soft please.

Golden Tango sounds interesting though, as I have not tried tacky ESN rubbers yet.
A training partner, a chopper, plays the 401 so I know it, but 57,5 deg is too hard for continuous looping. Also the rubber becomes useless with just a bit of humidity.
I like its basic characteristic though.

globe 999 national I had before, not bad, but is inferior to my H3 prov BS, so not really an option.

Cleaning floors is only an option for home games. So it's not a constant I can rely on.
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Lightzy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lightzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 12:20pm
Dunno then, sorry man.
Did you try Battle2 ? It has topsheet like a rock and is the tackiest rubber I've ever known. But it won't be all that different to rubbers like H3Neo. Just a bit better overall, in my opinion.



Edited by Lightzy - 02/28/2019 at 12:21pm
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nv42 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nv42 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 12:24pm
You can give the joola golden tango a miss if you are particularly looking for a hard topsheet. Dint find the topsheet on that hard compared to h3 neo. Btw, isn't the topsheet on the regular h3 neo (commercial ) harder than any provincial h3.
1.dhs pg2 fl

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TT newbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 12:24pm
Tackifire Special. Too bad it´s been discontinued...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ashishsharmaait Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 12:24pm
Originally posted by Hozuki Hozuki wrote:

I think I phrased it a bit unprecisely. I don't want a harder sponge but a harder topsheet.
Sponge hardness should be 39 deg as stated before. But topsheet should be harder and grippier than H3. So that forceful brush loops have minimum energy loss.
I don't like soft sponged rubbers on my FH. So no rakza soft please.

Golden Tango sounds interesting though, as I have not tried tacky ESN rubbers yet.
A training partner, a chopper, plays the 401 so I know it, but 57,5 deg is too hard for continuous looping. Also the rubber becomes useless with just a bit of humidity.
I like its basic characteristic though.

globe 999 national I had before, not bad, but is inferior to my H3 prov BS, so not really an option.

Cleaning floors is only an option for home games. So it's not a constant I can rely on.
Been there, done that and wasted. alot of time and money in the process. There is no substitute for a H3 Neo, especially when you can pick the hardness and thickness.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote anubhav1984 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/28/2019 at 4:56pm
Originally posted by Hozuki Hozuki wrote:

I think I phrased it a bit unprecisely. I don't want a harder sponge but a harder topsheet.
Sponge hardness should be 39 deg as stated before. But topsheet should be harder and grippier than H3. So that forceful brush loops have minimum energy loss.
I don't like soft sponged rubbers on my FH. So no rakza soft please.

Golden Tango sounds interesting though, as I have not tried tacky ESN rubbers yet.
A training partner, a chopper, plays the 401 so I know it, but 57,5 deg is too hard for continuous looping. Also the rubber becomes useless with just a bit of humidity.
I like its basic characteristic though.

globe 999 national I had before, not bad, but is inferior to my H3 prov BS, so not really an option.

Cleaning floors is only an option for home games. So it's not a constant I can rely on.

Have you tried Haifu Whale II perhaps? I thought the topsheet on Haifu was a bit harder than H3s back in the day. 
Butterfly Viscaria FL
FH - Undecided
BH - Undecided
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Hozuki View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hozuki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/01/2019 at 8:05am
hm... I guess I have to just take my chances again.
thanks for all the input so far.

If anyone remembers the original pf4, I really liked that topsheet back in the day.
But the rock sponge was useless. And the new pf4 has a different topsheet.
Something similar to old pf4 topsheet with NEO sponge 39 deg would be nice...
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