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OSPblades Forum Testing |
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fzolesz 
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Joined: 06/11/2010 Location: Hungary Status: Offline Points: 146 |
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 Posted: 11/11/2010 at 3:31am |
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IMO In terms of speed Virtuoso is just slightly slower than PK Playing in shorts over the table is comfortable but little bit longer, so much better/easier to hit these balls with flick! Backspin shots,means pushed drops it is not the best , but blocks are quite easy variable... hope it helps... this week I'll play with virtuoso + after i get cleaner impressions. two game is not enough! |
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OSP VIRTUOSO AC (L=159 mm)( Aramid/Carbon)
FH: Tenergy 80 BH: Tenergy 80 Boosted with Falco long OSP Blades |
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fzolesz
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Joined: 06/11/2010 Location: Hungary Status: Offline Points: 146 |
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Posted: 11/11/2010 at 3:39am |
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Virtouso has more ..but not vibration instead a kick...so it flexible but has little bit harder feeling end it is great  IMHO as I mentioned before all these OSP blades don't vibrating...vibrating is a disturbance! These blades rather have one kick to the ball due to the power core  don't have after vibrating...this is the communication (between brain and blade via palm) ...what I really like with OSP blades!!PK is stiffer but has almost the same kick but I thnk slower than V+. |
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OSP VIRTUOSO AC (L=159 mm)( Aramid/Carbon)
FH: Tenergy 80 BH: Tenergy 80 Boosted with Falco long OSP Blades |
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tompy
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Joined: 06/12/2010 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 222 |
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Posted: 11/14/2010 at 7:08am |
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Sorry for again another lengthy post (can,t help it) but I have been looking at the osp website for possible differences between handletypes (related to the issue about stabillity/sharpness ). It seems I have made an unlucky choice for the griphalves - for me - with the ELcon.
I play chinese rubber fh-side (no glue effect) and for my fh looping stroke use the whole length of the handle for maximum leverage with often only the tip of the pointerfinger touching the blade (similar somewhat as Boll fh-grip). Not the best for stability and puts more torque and flex between the bladeface and handle but also enables me to add more energy to looping if I need to or have the opportunity (and that enables me to use more controlled rubber). The ELcon is not shown on the osp website but it has a similarity with the c-pen that is shown (and some pictures of ELcon can be found in this thread). Compared with the straight and flared handles where the grip runs over into the bladehead the c-pen and ELcon grip runs out clearly smaller (less wide). The soft abachi part as well as the (dark coloured) hardwood part. It,s obious then that the lamina is less strengthened and stabilized for torque in the neck-zone then and the abachi gets higher impact also (less material less strong, the material deforms more and dampens more). Thus more strengthened and stabalized with the straight and Konkav. Maybe if I had choosen the straight handle I wouldn,t have noticed this "relative weakness" at all who knows. So my criticque earlier has to be relativated (beside for rubbers I use and technicque ) for this also and understood as more relevant for the Elcon. For c-pen this plays no role as there is no significant torcque between griphalves and bladeface. I play rpb penhold regularly (and approx same level) so I suppose this also was one of the reasons I am more sharp and attentive to this as I compared between shakehand and penhold with the same blade and rubbers. In the meanwhile I do play with the virtuoso again but now with different griphalves applied to the lamina (glutinglue, reversable). The "cracksound" on harder hits is more pronounced know, bit more offensive but mostly the feel is sharper/less dampened and stability has improved (all as expected) closer to the feeling I allready had from the lamina using it for penhold. I am very much pleased with it now ; best lamina I ever played with in more then twenty years of tabletennis. I sense the spot where I hit the ball precise and conscious. This constant feedback helps to get a feel for the optimal spot to use for different strokes. For more speed more central to the blade or for somewhat more spin more to the side of the blade. Sort of a differentiated sweetspot idea depending on the situation (incoming ball) and stroke type that does wonders for consistency and putting in all kinds of variations between spin and speed. With my rubbers (firm sponge less fast so more dampening allready) and compared with playing penhold I somewhat missed this clear feedback compared to what I expected and to what I got now. Marc Edited by tompy - 11/14/2010 at 7:51am |
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arg0
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Joined: 07/22/2009 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 2023 |
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Posted: 11/14/2010 at 12:51pm |
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Thank you Marc for pointing this out. I am considering ordering a blade with ELCON handle, but after your post I'm not so sure. Also, I would like to make a mock-up, just to see how well it fits my hand.
Would you mind measuring the size of the handle (width and height) at the thinnest point before the chamfer starts? I mean here the dimensions marked W and H in the drawing. Exact dimensions are not so important (1mm accuracy is enough), but I'd like to know if it's narrower than the ST handle.  Edited by arg0 - 11/14/2010 at 12:53pm |
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tompy
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Posted: 11/14/2010 at 4:46pm |
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You can compare the dimensions on sight on page 16 on this thread between flared, ELcon and straight pictures.
Width in you,re drawing for my blade - as I can measure - is 25 mm where the griphalves end. Where you meassure it would be approx 26 mm. H is maybe 2 mm less there (can,t meassure this anymore) then the 27,3 it starts with at the end. I suppose Pll can give you more precise meassurements. The constructional difference for playing characteristics is that the Elcon starts with 27,3 mm height at the grip-end and straight grips with only 22,8 and 22,5 for resp round and squared. This initial height difference is realized with a thicker abachi ply between lamina and walnutlayer for ELcon and then the walnut is tapered thinner towards the bladeface not the abachi. The abachilayer is relatively thicker then. With the rounding then the walnut for Elcon also becomes less wide and becomes less funktional. Plus that for the sq-str handle on page 16 - as can be seen - the walnut runs further through on the chamfer (indicating thinner abachilayer) and where it stops the lamina has allready flared out more (thus more stable on itself). Therefor I expect sq-str to be the most stable/solid construktion. Edited by tompy - 11/14/2010 at 4:46pm |
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arg0
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Posted: 11/14/2010 at 6:14pm |
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I understand what you mean, now. And thanks for the measurements. If ELCON is narrower than SQST in the upper part of the handle, I'm not so sure I will like it. Maybe I should simply stick to SQST, which I usually don't have problems with. But I am curious to try a tapered handle which is not FL.
How does ELCON feel, regarding thickness? More like a thick FL or a thin FL? Edited by arg0 - 11/14/2010 at 6:16pm |
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jpenmaster
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Posted: 11/14/2010 at 8:37pm |
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From my measurement the difference is about 2mm at the very end. I have Elcon and St sq and both blades play identical. I actually prefer the Elcon over the St sq.
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OSP Expert II w DNA Dragon Grip
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arg0
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Posted: 11/15/2010 at 2:02am |
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Ok, thanks, so I now only have to wait for fzolesz's review of Virtuoso+ to decide between V and V+.
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karabijntje
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Joined: 04/09/2010 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 233 |
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Posted: 11/15/2010 at 7:55am |
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, I'm curious if the feeling will be as good as with Virtuoso, because the outer plies are harder...Edited by karabijntje - 11/15/2010 at 7:58am |
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* TBS - Color - Spear - Virtuoso+
* Vega Pro / Europe |
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icontek
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This is FPS Doug Joined: 10/31/2006 Location: Maine, US Status: Offline Points: 5222 |
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Posted: 11/15/2010 at 9:14am |
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Thank you for clearing that up! It makes sense that the Elcon shape might perform differently at the neck. And I'm truly glad you are now able to enjoy the clear and amazing feedback that keeps so many of us playing these blades! I play H3 Neo on my FH and had real trouble "feeling" my spin on my Avalox BT550 (the sponge felt harder than the bladeface, and dampened contact, as you described); the Virtuoso gives much more discernable tones. And on the opposite side I hit my first "silent" backhand brush loop last night. The contact was so thin that there was no noise from my regularly loud Acuda S3, but the Virtuoso told me the shot was clean. You should have seen my practice partners eyes when fairly closed block put the ball to the ceiling :D |
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eecrive
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Joined: 12/29/2004 Status: Offline Points: 75 |
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Posted: 11/15/2010 at 9:45am |
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fzolesz we are waiting for your complete V+ review!! ;)
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patrick1v
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Joined: 06/16/2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1497 |
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Posted: 11/15/2010 at 2:45pm |
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i would like to know what is the update on that musko that was sent out as a tester where is it at now.
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fzolesz
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Joined: 06/11/2010 Location: Hungary Status: Offline Points: 146 |
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Posted: 11/16/2010 at 9:27am |
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It needs more time guys to write it,but everything is clear in my mind...
forecasted: Sure OFF blade ( fastest 5ply wood ever tried) Long and relativly hgh arc Medium + touch feeling..closer to hard (great sounds) Best distance is over the table(flips) or mid-far distance looping (2-3 m)  Better for med/soft rubbers for me! To be continued |
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OSP VIRTUOSO AC (L=159 mm)( Aramid/Carbon)
FH: Tenergy 80 BH: Tenergy 80 Boosted with Falco long OSP Blades |
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GraemeW
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Joined: 01/08/2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 228 |
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Posted: 11/16/2010 at 11:33am |
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The Musco is with me at the moment. I was away in the States for a couple of weeks but intend to test it out over the coming weeks and will report accordingly in due course. |
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Butterfly Korbel ST
Red FH: BTY Tenergy T80 1.9mm Black BH: TSP Curl P4 1.5mm |
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patrick1v
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Joined: 06/16/2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1497 |
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Posted: 11/17/2010 at 2:54pm |
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hello laszlo, i see a lot of off- and off 5 plies blades in your custom-made portfolio with american walnut outer ply, so just wondering if you will be producing one similar to these ones in you osp standards models
Edited by patrick1v - 11/17/2010 at 3:02pm |
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fzolesz
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Joined: 06/11/2010 Location: Hungary Status: Offline Points: 146 |
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Posted: 11/19/2010 at 7:41am |
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Here is my complete review of virtuoso + OSP
Virtuoso+ I tested the offensive 5ply wood as an upgrade to Virtuoso. Size: 158x150 , 5.75 mm, 89 gr , ST balance…littlebit headheavy Tested with: Forehand: T05 and T64 2,1; Backhand: T64 and
T05FX 2.1 First of all I’ll write about main elements,
after a summary and some comparsion to other OSP blades Chopping or pushing is punctual even with the
tuned tenergy. But you feel this is more longer sometimes than
expected, is good when you are placeing if i wanted shorter chops more wrist
work is needed. With this blade counter is not that simple if
you are not trained well! punctuality needs concentrating. I liked its sound when the holder arc was
right! It is the best feedback ever had from a blade OK the combo feels little bit
as a hitter setup, but you don’t have to give too much power the balde is
working instead of you Passive Game like dropps are not so easy with
it but you find the right arc again.. your drops are going to be something like
a finishing drop shots But blocking is better far is I could place the
ball from 1 meter as well and I can hit them as well, I don’t know how but
modern blocking shots is better I could not do it before so good but with this I
learned Opponents speed is important Topspin
game: Opening topspin It is something like
the simpliest thing Pingpong lot of spin high arc amazing! Its harder feeling helped to make it as
finishing topspin easier then virtuoso. It gave much longer arc and also lower. The
ball jupms like never seen before from a 5 ply blade. Dynamic topspins is a modern hitter loop and
feels like as a cannon,I much surprised its getting faster, sure it has diffeterent
gluing process! Kicks a huge but without unpleasent after
vibration . After vibrating causes mistakes on unpunctual hits,,,but not with
this beauty I could make very fast topspins to end of the
table…with little bit less spin but with more power and speed ball curve
getting longer pushes the opponent back.I had to concenrate with touching arc
because it is still lifts the ball however it is harder! I realised some hidden possibilities in my backhand
topspins with tiny wrist moves. Me and my partners are surprised how fast is
away from the table?! This is my best place ..2-3 meter away from
the table and it still a cannon and getting more controllable.Amazing Serves,receives My serves had lot of spin Ok bit more
longer than wanted but it needs practice as well! But If I gave empty serves and after I could
finish te ponits with flick as easy as with more faster blades Receiving is easy if your good with topspins.
Pushing it back not as easy you need to practice it if you are familiar with an
OFF- blade or stiffer blade. Summary: I played with it
about eight times and I didn”t change the rubbers every training and realised
it is getting faster if stay with one combo at least 3 times. I changed them just
because to know which is better (harder T05 or softer 64 and FX) For me
with this the lighter and softer tenergy was better however on my virtuoso I
prefer harder to softer. As I mentioned this has harder feeling and
longer and faster throw with any OSP. The Musko has only harder feeling . Ultimate has the hardness but from the
core! Virtouso+ has it as well but from
the harder outer limba the laminating is still not a stiff blade...so it holds
the caracteristic of the 5 ply blade. But its hardness is helping me to get better
feedbacks. It made me more aggressive…I think my playing
style is getting wider with this If I am familiar with v+..after this seaseon
I”ll going to use it I think! Ball speed almost as fast as ultimate but has
higher arc so needs different playing. This is more like topspin oriented blade
then any other but needs better techniqe IMO. Good for being offensive at close to table and
and far from it. Some forum writers wanted to compare it with
PK. I can say it is better than PK in all aspects. Not so comparable... faster,
has bigger kick due to power core, and harder a little bit. Virtuoso+ has very good feeling, good control,
nice feedback in your palm, and huge spin. If you are looking for an offensive blade with
lot of spin, for example countertopspin game it is good choice This is what we need! |
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OSP VIRTUOSO AC (L=159 mm)( Aramid/Carbon)
FH: Tenergy 80 BH: Tenergy 80 Boosted with Falco long OSP Blades |
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karabijntje
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Joined: 04/09/2010 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 233 |
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Posted: 11/19/2010 at 8:15am |
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Thanks fzolesz, nice review!
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* TBS - Color - Spear - Virtuoso+
* Vega Pro / Europe |
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johnny89atc
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Joined: 06/28/2008 Location: Greece Status: Offline Points: 1600 |
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Posted: 11/19/2010 at 7:38pm |
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A coach from my country (he is also a coach of the Greek table tennis federation) played some minutes with my racket today and he liked the Virtuoso. He said that he has not held a blade with so good feeling for a long time!
P.S. Nice review floresz! Edited by johnny89atc - 11/19/2010 at 7:39pm |
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Blade: OSP Virtuoso-L RST 87gr
FH: Butterfly Tenergy 05 FX 2.1 BH: Butterfly Tenergy 05 1.9 |
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speaquinox
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Posted: 11/20/2010 at 3:48am |
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That's the same reaction I get from many friends that hit with my Virtuoso or Ultimate. They also love the handles and quality.
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Innerforce ALC, Glayzer / Rozena
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tiehwen
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Posted: 11/20/2010 at 11:27am |
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Not that I want to window dress these threads some more, just recently I had couple of seasoned players who borrowed my Virtuoso for a few mins. hits each, I wasn't surprised by their expressions on their faces, the 1st few words haven't been always like "Wow! WTH is this blade? Is it carbon? It's so nice. How much? Where can I find it?"
You would think that their comments were made after they just played with the latest & greatest Btfly's 200s USD new offerings...Sometimes it's just the blade's simplicity & functionalities that shocked & awed these people. I got 1 older player who was willing to trade his new Btfly MJ combo for my Virtuoso combo...
Just go figure. Edited by tiehwen - 11/20/2010 at 1:56pm |
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patrick1v
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Posted: 11/20/2010 at 12:32pm |
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tiehwen that last part about the swap is hilarious anyways got my friend to order me one of the virtuoso+ blades just like how they look.
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arg0
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Posted: 11/20/2010 at 12:55pm |
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fzolesz, thanks for the review. Your impressions confirmed that Virtuoso is probably more suited for my style of play. Now I'm in the process of ordering one.
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arg0
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Posted: 11/20/2010 at 5:02pm |
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to avoid misunderstandings, i meant that fzolesz's review convinced me that v+ is probably too hard and fast for me, so i'm going for virtuoso.
thanks patrick1v for pointing this out. |
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karabijntje
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Posted: 11/22/2010 at 4:00am |
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I've decided I can't decide here based on reviews, so I've ordered a Virtuoso+ to find out for myself
 . I have a feeling this blade might work very well for me. It's a M (158mm) btw, FL handle, around 86-87gr.So now I have three new blades to try, Color, Spear and Virtuoso+!  |
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* TBS - Color - Spear - Virtuoso+
* Vega Pro / Europe |
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arg0
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Posted: 11/22/2010 at 4:37am |
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I'm looking forward to the comparison between virtuoso+ and color, as I also have a color to compare my virtuoso to.
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eecrive
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Posted: 11/22/2010 at 5:08am |
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waiting for mine.. i hope is slower than Ultimate.......
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karabijntje
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Posted: 11/22/2010 at 7:47am |
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 . Tonight i will practice with it and I'll receive another vega pro+europe for Spear, so i can give a good comparision between the two. Virtuoso+ is next...
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* TBS - Color - Spear - Virtuoso+
* Vega Pro / Europe |
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karabijntje
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Posted: 11/25/2010 at 6:32am |
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Virtuoso+ shipped! yay!
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* TBS - Color - Spear - Virtuoso+
* Vega Pro / Europe |
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speaquinox
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Posted: 11/25/2010 at 9:36am |
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Mine in the customs. Probably will get it on Saturday.
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Innerforce ALC, Glayzer / Rozena
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karabijntje
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Posted: 11/25/2010 at 10:16am |
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* TBS - Color - Spear - Virtuoso+
* Vega Pro / Europe |
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arg0 wrote: