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RPB power and positioning.

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Sallom89 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sallom89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/05/2011 at 6:22pm
Today I was Ripping some crazy RPB topspins, If I keep that form then I'll record it!
Member of Wang Hao fan club.

Hurricane Hao III
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sweetstrike View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sweetstrike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/06/2011 at 7:31pm
Originally posted by Rogson Rogson wrote:

According to reviews, H2 has a low-throw angle so this MAY be the reason I am scared of using RPB and resorting to block/lob.
H2 has a higher throw angle than H3. H3 has a little more speed. You may also want to try a Jap/Euro rubber as that seems to be preferred by the masses. I'm using Palio Blitz for RPB and it works great.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Penhold_Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/06/2011 at 10:39pm
Wow, there was some amazing RPB shots.
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simon_xuan View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote simon_xuan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/06/2011 at 10:41pm
I tried Thor on the fh to replace my TG2 and H3 and really liked it. I do have to hit into the sponge more to generate the loop, but that's a good habit to build up anyway. I never tried Blitz at BH for RPB. Is it grippy only and half sticky/tacky?
RPB Rocks!
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YEO (90g) | BTY Spin Art | T05 FX


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sweetstrike View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sweetstrike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/15/2011 at 3:54pm
Blit'z is very grippy and it has a higher throw than Macro Era. The throw and spin generation is pretty close to T05. The sponge feels slightly softer and bouncier than T05 and the topsheet is more fragile. Never had a chance to use Thors so can't compare to that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zikmir Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/19/2012 at 7:36pm
Hi, i mean no offence, but its hard to watch people with good equipment not playing or having the wrong technique ! Please if you must, bend lower, the whole point is to be at a level like a 10 year old kid, plus your foot work is just not there, u can watch some video of how to hop side ways or do cross work for reaching the corners of the table ! and may i suggest not using your wrist and keeping it locked. Im just saying all this to see people improve, i my self am a beginner, using Ma lin Extra off /DHs 3 hurricane neo 2.15/ and friendship all rounder 1.8 on back. 

Edited by zikmir - 04/19/2012 at 7:37pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote raphyelrosby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/19/2012 at 9:45pm
I think instead of arguing over differences, everyone should try to figure out what is best for their game. I use a lot of wrist for my RPB and it allows me to move around to initiate a forehand attack easier than a large arm movement. Also if you watch Xu Xin, he uses a lot of wrist action whereas Ma Long used more arm as he is one of those who helped develop the shot. I would bet that Xu Xin has a good shakehand backhand (as I do) because that's how I learned my backhand. I played shakehand for about 6 months, and hated the forehand, but it helped develop my backhand. There is good and bad to both techniques. Why not make it a real discussion instead of an argument. I swing more upwards when opening a rally on my forehand, but I can recover, so its not a hindrance, but most would say go forward. Its all about your comfort and your style. I have videos posted in the video section of my technique for RPB and honestly I think it is going to be a bigger challenge to loop backspin without the wrist snap.
Xiom Hayabusa ZX, Sigma II pro on FH, Vega Elite BH.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Loop40mm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/20/2012 at 11:30am

I have played shakehand for eleven years and played RPB for 6 months.  My RPB has gotten better than my shakehand backhand.  Shakehand backhand has more power. To me, there is more finesse in RPB.  Given the opportunity, when I use my left leg, rotate the body and snap the arm, I can still generate power.  There seems to be more opportunities for finesse for me.

 

I have two RPB top spins.

1. Bend low, paddle horizontal, elbow close to body so wrist is at 90 degrees. This is not powerful but it is a finesse stroke.

2. Similar to shakehand backhand.

 

Wrist is used when I return serves to my middle.  I consider this a finesse stroke.  I have not gotten to the stage to generate enough power, but the spin of the ball generates enough velocity.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote V-Griper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/20/2012 at 11:54am
Originally posted by raphyelrosby raphyelrosby wrote:

I think instead of arguing over differences, everyone should try to figure out what is best for their game. I use a lot of wrist for my RPB and it allows me to move around to initiate a forehand attack easier than a large arm movement. Also if you watch Xu Xin, he uses a lot of wrist action whereas Ma Long used more arm as he is one of those who helped develop the shot. I would bet that Xu Xin has a good shakehand backhand (as I do) because that's how I learned my backhand. I played shakehand for about 6 months, and hated the forehand, but it helped develop my backhand. There is good and bad to both techniques. Why not make it a real discussion instead of an argument. I swing more upwards when opening a rally on my forehand, but I can recover, so its not a hindrance, but most would say go forward. Its all about your comfort and your style. I have videos posted in the video section of my technique for RPB and honestly I think it is going to be a bigger challenge to loop backspin without the wrist snap.

You are right. We can have different solutions to the same problem. In general I like to use drive shots to overcome spins which usually involves more torso/shoulder rotation. I don't use a lifting motion, Which puts more spin on the ball, because I don't like the high arc and subsequent high bounce. It is also slower. The downside to this is that I have a smaller margin of error and thus miss a slightly higher percentage of my shots. The upside is that I either win the point outright or get a defensive return. It also has a "shock and awe" effect whereby opponents won't take the risk of hitting it to my backhand for fear of losing the point outright, even if my conversion rate is low. 

Xu Xin seems to entice people to hit his flip return so he can set up his attack so it definitely works this way as well.

I use an unconventional grip but my bh is much more similar to a ph rpb than a sh bh.


Edited by V-Griper - 04/20/2012 at 1:38pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote raphyelrosby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/20/2012 at 12:24pm
Yep!!!! I have that problem of missing my opening loops where the trajectory is very low. By lifting the ball athe backnahd is a  little I am confident of getting it over the net. Also a lot of the top guys are tending to loop a little higher as well. I think the 40 mm ball and all rule changes have changed the way you have to approach the game. Back in the days of KTS and those guys, Waldner had a higher arc at that time. The big thing for me right now is not get too anxious to finish the point. We all wish we could finish the point with one hit, but the ball just doesn't go as fast as it used to. I think that's why RSM isn't winning like he used to, because he often ends up defending because he may not have the opportunity to step around, and his opponents force him to to do a weaker shot that can be manipulated easier. Anyways I have found Xu Xin's strategy to be very useful. I specifically cross the backhand loop with outturning spin, to force a return to my center-backhand, and step around and wait to attack. I can catch it right off the bounce down the line with ease, and many times its not contested. I have adopted this tactic and it works great.

Another reason I use a higher arc is because it gives me an extra second to get in position, at which time I can attack the ball earlier on the bounce and use a less powerful safe shot that is difficult to block. That's what Ma Lin did so well, he would attack so quickly that he often hit the ball at medium speed and was not taking the risk of missing.



Xiom Hayabusa ZX, Sigma II pro on FH, Vega Elite BH.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote raphyelrosby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/20/2012 at 12:25pm


**Look at the first point**

It is a very good strategy.


Edited by raphyelrosby - 04/20/2012 at 12:26pm
Xiom Hayabusa ZX, Sigma II pro on FH, Vega Elite BH.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote V-Griper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/20/2012 at 1:19pm
Hit the nail on the head the first time. I have noticed this a lot in his play.

Here is an example of the more attacking rpb of Wang hao. Points 3 and 4 and bunch after that. 



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cherC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/21/2012 at 12:56pm
Originally posted by Rogson Rogson wrote:

And there is the positioning too, what is the best way to position for a RPB'er? I usually stand right in the middle of the left side but I've found out that I can't seem to cover my backhand well in there and I can't do a comfortable RPB loop in there, everytime I have to do a rpb, I have to lean a bit to the right side if my opponent loops it to the far left even though im the middle of the left side. even worse if the incoming loop is very low, I can't seem to hit rpb and 70%of the times I resort to do a traditional block...




the positioning is the most important thing in TT, because if you are positioning the wrong way its more then likely to miss the shot. depending on where you are in and on the table. If your in the middleof your left table then you just have to stand towards your right more...... Because ping pong is a fast game you dont have time to turn your body for your RPB. and by the way sense RPB is slower you`ll just have to train. Or you can try blocking the ball for you to improve on your forehand.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Loop40mm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/21/2012 at 2:11pm

If you are having problem with positioning, it is a matter of how you do your RPB strokes.

 

I have noticed many traditional penholders try to hit RPB from the left side.  In the beginning, try learning to lower your stance, with the paddle in front of you.  I actually suggest closer to your eye level in the beginning to block the ball back.  I typically do this in warmups.  Though I am only blocking, because of the angle of the paddle, top spins are generated.

 

I have a tendency to keep my left foot back when I use RPB to loop.  My coach told me that was not necessary in every situation.  Having the left foot back is a bigger loop situation. I imagine you are trying a bigger loop so that’s why you need to lean slightly to the right.  In many situations, I needed to keep my left foot slightly in front to hit with RPB, including looping.  I have seen my coach doing the RPB off the bounce of the ball with the ball in front on the right center(My coach is left handed).  Leaning is not needed. For us right handers, that should be left center.

 

Practising blocking against loopers has greatly improved my RPB stroke.  There is no time to lean but to put the paddle in front to block the ball with RPB.  I then realized I could use the wrist to control the spin and the direction of the ball.  The technique is such that the elbow is tight to the body, the paddle is horizontal with wrist at close to 90 degrees and the arm is moved forward to hit the ball.  Gradually I learned to bend the wrist backward, while maintaining paddle in horizontal position, before hitting.

 

I think this technique can be carried over to the similar stroke my coach used to loop the ball off the bounce.  My coach has the quick arm snap to create the spin.  Obviously the angle of the wrist is no longer 90 degrees.  The stance is higher to allow space to snap the arm forward.

Stiga Ebenholz NCT V

FH Tenergy 05

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decoi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote decoi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/21/2012 at 6:18pm
for power do what simon does.. forget about trying to generate spin. just have the needed angle and drive the ball the rest should be taken care of.. using a slow rubber and something soft'ish helps. i found it a lot easier to control the ball with 729 focus 3 Snipe than Haifu shark or stiga calibra lt.

and what loop40 said practicing against heavy loopers helps. which is when you can start learning how to punch through the spin( like ma lin would do with TPB) and use that knowledge to moove your opponent around the table first loop send it to his bh then next one deep to Fh or deep into Fh on the first one if he stepped around for the first loop


also helps when the ball is center of your body and you must play from the body or else its going to be weak and chance of missing the ball



Edited by decoi - 05/21/2012 at 6:21pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Imago Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/30/2012 at 3:32am
Originally posted by Loop40mm Loop40mm wrote:

I have a tendency to keep my left foot back when I use RPB to loop.  My coach told me that was not necessary in every situation.

 
For SH, it is really not necessary or at least not essential. For RPB, however, opening the body angle is a great accessory to success.
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