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Ding Ning replaces Guo Yan for Olympics Confirmed

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    Posted: 05/09/2012 at 9:21am
http://www.ittf.com/Stories/pictures/qualifier_w1.pdf

I'm sure we will see news articles coming out.



Edited by ZApenholder - 05/09/2012 at 11:03am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 10:56am
Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

http://www.ittf.com/Stories/pictures/qualifier_w1.pdf

I'm sure we will see news articles coming out.



That was predicted here, wasn't it?!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 11:01am
Yes, it was speculated everywhere.
I think Chinese media was speculating this during the final of World Team Champs as Guo Yan didn't play.

I wonder if CNTT even release a press release yet. As I can't find anything formal from China media yet. Or maybe only send the changes to ITTF, and some how ITTF was very fast to update the list lol?!!


Edited by ZApenholder - 05/09/2012 at 11:08am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrscatman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 11:08am
Ok, in that list by my count 15 Chinese born players - not mention when did HK become a country. How does Guo Yan feel? Wonder if she'll be willing to go to another Country - where she'll be guaranteed an Olympic spot in 8 years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nerve*blade Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 11:49am

Guo Yue already has been selected by Chinese National Team to play London Olympic table tennis women team Event. 

Guo Yue and Li Xiao Xia’s double is the absolute No.1 in the world. So, Li Xiao Xia will be in the list to play single event in London Olympic Games.

Compare the two players:  Ding Ning (22 years old) and Guo Yan (29 years old), they are both from Beijing Team. For the long run if Guo Yan play Olympic Games, she can play once time only this year, Ding Ning can play Olympic Games more times as well as she currently holds the World champion and World Cup titles. Who will be the best candidate for London Olympic Games is obvious. Guo Yan will yield the chance to Ding Ning to play London Olympic Games since they come from the same team – Beijing.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 11:54am
If Ding Ning takes gold, will she be the fasters and youngers - both male and female to take Grand Slam (Olympic, World Cup, Word champ)?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 12:58pm
Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Ok, in that list by my count 15 Chinese born players - not mention when did HK become a country. How does Guo Yan feel? Wonder if she'll be willing to go to another Country - where she'll be guaranteed an Olympic spot in 8 years.


Actually you can play Olympics as soon as you get the citizenship. If you were referring to the ITTF rules, they only apply to WTTC and WCup, and also wouldn't allow Guo Yan to play for the new country at all (if the player is older than 21 then he/she is not allowed to represent the new country at World events EVER!!)

4.01.03.04  Players being 21 years of age or older will not be registered with the ITTF and will not be eligible to represent a new association at World Championships. 
4.03.06.03  Players being 21 years of age or older will not be registered with the ITTF and will not be eligible to represent a new association at the World Cup. 
4.04.06.03  Players being 21 years of age or older will not be registered with the ITTF and will not be eligible to represent a new association at the World Team Cup. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrscatman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 1:26pm
Too many rules and regulations. Way too complicated for my taste!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 3:23pm
Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Too many rules and regulations. Way too complicated for my taste!


Not to mention - completely contrary to decency and common sense. The new rule means that after 21 you will never be able to represent your new country. NEVER. Even when you turn 50 !

They should have made 3 years from 15 and 18, 5 years for 18-21, 7 years after 21. Then at least people could have had some hopes...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AJay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 6:05pm
So it looks to be official now.    Fully expected.   Unusual that Chinese media didn't get wind of it first.

Nobody can say Ding Ning did not earn her spot.     World No.1, World and World Cup champion.      Amongst their top 5 women, I think she is the only one that didn't lose to a foreign player since Moscow WTTTC.       The only question she didn't answer fully is her ability to deal with the best choppers under pressure.    

Feel bad for Guo Yan.     I know it is infeasible, but imagine Singapore gives Guo Yan citizenship in 1 day and she plays for Singapore in London, that could be a riot of a team final.      I know I know, even if that happens, the rules don't allow Feng TW, Guo Y and Wang YG to form a team anyway.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smackman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 6:42pm
O the list 3 player from China, two direct and 1 qualified
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 6:57pm
Originally posted by AJay AJay wrote:

Feel bad for Guo Yan.     I know it is infeasible, but imagine Singapore gives Guo Yan citizenship in 1 day and she plays for Singapore in London, that could be a riot of a team final.      I know I know, even if that happens, the rules don't allow Feng TW, Guo Y and Wang YG to form a team anyway.


Not to mention that three Singaporean women have already qualified so their roster is full - no luck for Guo Yan there. However, she could quickly "emigrate" to Macao, they have their own team if memory serves me, get the citizenship in 1 day then board a plane to Qatar Tongue

Oh wait, their rosters (for Qatar qualification tournament, that is) are also closed. Sheesh... Guo Yan is indeed royally screwed then. Angry

Did you know she never played at the Olympics? and now they pushed her off the list in favor of a younger (though fully deserving) player - imagine how she must feel...

She is World Cup holder (twice), Grand Finals winner (twice), 7 ProTour golds (and 10 in doubles), silver at WTTC 2005, bronze at WTTC 2007... too bad there always is someone better than her at the topmost level.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AJay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 7:11pm
I meant if Guo Yan is a Singaporean citizen tomorrow, could one of the current 3 entries be 'injured' to allow for Guo Yan?       There is a deadline for sure, but they kept talking about May 13 which makes me think there is still time to substitute.

Guo Yan is actually in a good position to switch side since unlike LSW, at her age, she won't care much for World titles anymore.     One last chance for glory, and redemption/revenge.      It makes for great drama.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 10:50pm
Originally posted by AJay AJay wrote:

I meant if Guo Yan is a Singaporean citizen tomorrow, could one of the current 3 entries be 'injured' to allow for Guo Yan?       There is a deadline for sure, but they kept talking about May 13 which makes me think there is still time to substitute.

Guo Yan is actually in a good position to switch side since unlike LSW, at her age, she won't care much for World titles anymore.     One last chance for glory, and redemption/revenge.      It makes for great drama.


You are right - the "fake" injury is always possible... but hopefully not.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rodewan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/09/2012 at 11:48pm
poor guo yan. just so much competition amongst women (and men) at the top ranks of the chinese national team. too get shafted in 3 subsequent olympics....cant feel good :(.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kenneyy88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 1:07am
Ding Ning is a lot better than Guo Yan. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 4:32am
I think if I was CNT management and have control over the likes of HK, I would make them China B team. How about Macau too (C team)

Currently SG is like China B team now, they can become D team lol

There is just too many Chinese talents in the womens side, compared to mens.
Guo Yan does stand a chance to get a medal in this Olympics, so my theory is, she may be good enough to be Olympic champion or 2nd or 3rd place etc, but not good enough to be a top Chinese player today.

We can also talk about Fan Ying (26yrs) - one of the best defensive players in the world, is just never good enough to represent China in any major event. As well as so many current 25 ~ 30 years old players China A team players that still can beat the rest of the world.

Then they have so many juniors that will challenge the top 3 spots in Feng Yalan, Zhu Yuling, Chen Meng. While the likes of Guo Yue, Li Xiaoxia, Liu Shiwen, Ding Ning will not even be 30yrs old yet.

Imo, I think Chinese women player only have 1 chance for Olympic, 2nd chance is slim with the 2 player rule and so many up and coming talents.

I hope Guo Yan doesn't quit Chinese TT, but I do hope all the players that can't find a place in Chinese TT team, does go out to the rest of the world to help develope TT.

BTW, Will Chinese women occupy the whole top 10 ranking?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 7:49am
Originally posted by AJay AJay wrote:

So it looks to be official now.    Fully expected.   Unusual that Chinese media didn't get wind of it first.



I have a feeling CNT didn't send a press release yet, and still need to.

Maybe they sent the update to ITTF, and somehow ITTF was very fast to update that list
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AJay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 12:23pm
Well its out on ITTF website now, and all over Chinese media too.

For strategic reasons, CNT would want to keep it in the bag for as long as possible, but it does take some paperwork on the part of several organizations, so they could not risk cutting too close.

Perhaps it was unintentionally leaked in some embedded document as you found it.       Great find ZApenholder, you might have been the first in the world to report it to the public!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 3:27pm
so it didn't come across to any one that I have direct ties with CNT so can get info very early?
jokes lol.

I was just looking for which 2 players made Womens from direct qualification off the ITTF list, and want to see which third player are pissed off at the rule change and then I saw Ding Ning's name there, and the file was just a few hours old. Spend like 30 mins checking all medias and found nothing

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kenneyy88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 4:26pm
Originally posted by AJay AJay wrote:

Well its out on ITTF website now, and all over Chinese media too.

For strategic reasons, CNT would want to keep it in the bag for as long as possible, but it does take some paperwork on the part of several organizations, so they could not risk cutting too close.

Perhaps it was unintentionally leaked in some embedded document as you found it.       Great find ZApenholder, you might have been the first in the world to report it to the public!
It was stated on ITTF facebook before ZApenholder started the thread. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 4:27pm
interesting that it is on ITTF FB before ITTF website.
I wonder which is more important for them nowadays...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kenneyy88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 4:29pm
Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

interesting that it is on ITTF FB before ITTF website.
I wonder which is more important for them nowadays...

ITTF website is a mess. I just read updates from facebook from ITTF or from tabletennisista(sp?).


Edited by kenneyy88 - 05/10/2012 at 4:30pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 4:35pm
I actually wonder if Facebook can be considered "public".

There was a debate/complain from Google, that Facebook doesn't allow google to search FB's data. So what ever is on FB is a secret. You would need to have an account and have correct friendship/privacy rights to view information.

Can't remember where I saw this article relating to online information something something something. I think the argument is that if every place is like FB, then search engines wouldn't work any more.

So, is FB considered "public"?


Edited by ZApenholder - 05/10/2012 at 4:36pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amateur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 5:32pm
The German forum had the news too before it was posted here.

As for ITTF's facebook page, you don't need to log in to view it, so in that sense it certainly is public. It depends on the privacy controls. (And why should Google be allowed to access pages that a user wants to keep private?) Of course now FB is teaming up with Microsoft/Bing in another episode of search engine and social networking wars.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amateur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 5:36pm
Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

so it didn't come across to any one that I have direct ties with CNT so can get info very early?


If you could find out what Guo Yan's injury is and how much compensation/hush money she's getting from CTTA, now that would be impressive. Wink

As for playing for another country, the Olympics also have a period of ineligibility for those who switch (usually 3 years) but that would still work for 2016.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amateur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 9:39pm
"Shi Zhihao, head coach of the Chinese women's table tennis team, shut his cell phone down and cannot be reached immediately for comments." Big smile
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/sports/2012-05/11/content_15264334.htm

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/10/2012 at 10:39pm
Some believe nepotism and cronyism are at work here.  Ding Ning as well as Liu Shiwen are Shi Zhihao's apprentices afterall.

In any case, Ding Ning was merely 4 points behind in rating when the first ranking list was released after the Rotterdam WTTC.

Guo Yan's loss to Wang Yuegu at the Pro Tour Grand Finals in London last year was an alarm call.

Edited by zeio - 05/10/2012 at 10:39pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/11/2012 at 3:45am
I still think it is silly to take Rotterdam's WTTC results / May 2011 results into consideration at all (Maybe atmost medal winner can be direct qualifers, but not 28 people per gender)
Is there any other sports that take world rankings so far back like TT does? I just know there is still so many qualifcation tournament happening lately, sure didn't hear about them last May.

Imagine if Wang Liqin won Rotterdam, and had a few good pro tours before May 2011. He would qualify and "retire" before Olympic and would need to be replaced due to "injury"

And I think it has almost nothing to do with Shi Zhihao's apprentices. If we look at LSW, she basically was beach warmer in Dortmund. That is the first time I saw a member of Chinese Teams that hardly played.

I have a feeling Guo Yan knew her fate before Dortmund already. Obviously Dortmund was a test for the "olympic team", and they did pretty well.

And I still believe Guo Yan is good enough to get a medal at the Olympic, feel so sad for her from a sportsman point of view.
Next life time I guess (same as what LGL mentioned to Wang Hao if he fails again)



Edited by ZApenholder - 05/11/2012 at 3:55am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/11/2012 at 3:47am
Originally posted by amateur amateur wrote:

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

so it didn't come across to any one that I have direct ties with CNT so can get info very early?


If you could find out what Guo Yan's injury is and how much compensation/hush money she's getting from CTTA, now that would be impressive. Wink

As for playing for another country, the Olympics also have a period of ineligibility for those who switch (usually 3 years) but that would still work for 2016.


Thats a dangerous place we going into now.
Sure don't want some secret agent knocking down my doors lol, jokes.

I think CNT management needs to handle this PR extra carefully.
It is very "dangerous"
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