|
|
Best blade for a beginner |
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Author | |||
toolie
Beginner Joined: 02/21/2009 Status: Offline Points: 4 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Posted: 07/24/2013 at 7:45pm |
||
Hey, guys.
My friend is looking to start playing table tennis. He's never owned a decent blade/rubbers before -- I've recommended Mark V rubbers, and I'm just needing a good recommendation for a blade. Any suggestions? Cheers, Mike
|
|||
Sponsored Links | |||
JacekGM
Platinum Member Joined: 02/17/2013 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 2356 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Gambler Arylate Carbon, flared handle (if he chooses to play with handshake grip)
|
|||
(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Yinhe T7 (Fl, 87 g) with Bluefire M3 (red 2.0) on FH and 0.6 mm 755 on BH.
|
|||
power7
Silver Member Joined: 01/25/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Blade - I recommend a 5 ply for beginners
Rubber - I recommend Sriver-EL, Mark V, or any other good none tacky general rubber. Unless he has a style of play that suggest otherwise. For example he keeps blocking on his BH and has no talent for looping on the BH. Then short pips. Or he's really really old and cranky and doesn't like to rally...then short pips on both side.
|
|||
DHS PG-7, H3 Neo, 729-5
Butterfly Power-7, Red TG2 Neo 39degree, Black Donic Bluefire M1 |
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Why do people even bother buying fast equipment. It's not like you play better when you can't even keep it on the table. MarkV used to be a pro rubber, and while 40mm ball is bit slower, it's not as if amateurs all of a sudden can't easy hit hard enough to launch the ball halfway across the hall never the table.
|
|||
power7
Silver Member Joined: 01/25/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Mark V isn't really that fast anymore compare to the other rubbers out on the market.
Some coaches have beginners start with Tenergy and Bluefire on a composite blade... But if player is self taught I recommend starting with a light 5 ply and any good qualify non-tacky inverted rubber. 728, Xiom, Donic, Butterfly, etc...take your pick. Sure they can go with composites and newer spring sponge as well. Most beginners wouldn't know the difference anyways, since their style of play doesn't push the equipment to the limits. Not like the ball is suddenly going to loop itself onto the table 100% of the time because of the equipment. Let the player be happy, not everyone is going world champ, but at least they have the equipment.
|
|||
DHS PG-7, H3 Neo, 729-5
Butterfly Power-7, Red TG2 Neo 39degree, Black Donic Bluefire M1 |
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
MarkV like most classic pro rubber was fast enough for advanced level amateurs. Loopers would glue but except for people with a specific type of game (open loop to rally every point) even that doesn't make much diff, ie. lose a point maybe in rally, pick up one on soft/touch shots.
The equipment changed at the highest levels because actual pros who do this for a living would glue to the max, and the new stuff was created to replace the extreme elasticity of that effect. The game also changed somewhat at highest level because of the loop-drive so everyone wants to power through every shot regardless of their effectiveness at it. So even at lower ranks it became an arms race. Some coaches do want their kids to win that race, and using tensor/carbon is OK on simple rallies as long as opponents oblige (which they often do because everyone wants to play like pro style), but are complete shit at anything else. In a way that's ok because the latest rubbers esp can be so overpowered that as long as you get good enough at topspining anything coming over the table nothing else matters, since at lower level very few play nuances of the game anyway. |
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
BTW, this is also why in the US at least the juniors could hold their own again chinese counterparts in rally, but get owned everywhere else.
|
|||
power7
Silver Member Joined: 01/25/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
There are 729 training rubber or Sriver-FX that very soft sponge for control. Good for learning counter hitting and putting spin on the ball. But if the beginner already knows how to attack, might not be a good choice since sponge might bottom out.
|
|||
DHS PG-7, H3 Neo, 729-5
Butterfly Power-7, Red TG2 Neo 39degree, Black Donic Bluefire M1 |
|||
bluebucket
Platinum Member Joined: 02/20/2011 Location: 16 Status: Offline Points: 2882 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
If money is no option, Donic allplay and mark V both sides in 1.8mm. Best beginner setup on the planet
|
|||
Imago
Premier Member Joined: 07/19/2009 Location: Sofia Status: Offline Points: 5897 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
yogi_bear
Forum Moderator Joined: 11/25/2004 Location: Philippines Status: Offline Points: 7219 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
adidas challenge light, tibhar samsonov alpha, stiga all around classic or offensive classic, nexy peter pan
|
|||
Independent online TT Product reviewer of XIOM, STIGA, JOOLA, SANWEI, GEWO, AIR, ITC, APEX, YASAKA and ABROS
ITTF Level 1 Coaching Course Conductor, ITTF Level 1 Coach |
|||
PatrickL2012
Member Joined: 07/10/2013 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 68 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
I would recommend a allround 5-ply wood blade as a start. I think blades such like YASAKA Extra, STIGA Allround Classic and Butterfly Primorac are all decent choices. They are generally more forgiving than a 7-ply blade or a composite blade.
Edited by PatrickL2012 - 07/25/2013 at 3:59pm |
|||
assiduous
Platinum Member Joined: 05/01/2011 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2521 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
if you want a blade that you don't need to change for 5 years buy Korbel or Timo Boll Spirit. You can get a used in good condition too. Post an add in the For Sale section here and I guarantee you will find one in no time.
For rubbers, just make sure it was released in the last 5 years. Mark V and Sriver are not a good choice in the 30+ price range. It doesn't matter if they are good enough. What matters is that there are 1000 rubbers better than them for that price.
|
|||
puppy412 : Sorry man, I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but I know that more training will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out
|
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
LOL, noob w/ TBS and tensors. It's like introductory membership to the forever-1500 EJ club. |
|||
machmach_3
Member Joined: 09/07/2012 Status: Offline Points: 32 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
I would Suggest stiga clipper and he will stick with it till the end of the world
|
|||
bluebucket
Platinum Member Joined: 02/20/2011 Location: 16 Status: Offline Points: 2882 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Assiduous, I know a guy that went from beginner to us-2250 in two years on the donic allplay. Who's done that with a TBS ?. He's still improving and still using the allplay. An alternative would be the Stiga allround classic or in a faster blade the yasaka extra, nothing faster than the extra please
Edited by bluebucket - 07/25/2013 at 8:09pm |
|||
assiduous
Platinum Member Joined: 05/01/2011 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2521 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
and I know.. I know this one guy.. who can do back flips.. and he can eat 10 sausages in 2 minutes.. and... and.. I know.. this guy who came from Shaolin.. and he uses this donic allplay..
yukk. what a pathetic argument. Bluebucket KNOWS SOMEBODY. Case closed.
|
|||
puppy412 : Sorry man, I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but I know that more training will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out
|
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
He is right, though. People who improve their game significant despite fast equipment are the exception not the norm (and attributable more to endless hours of training), and also more of a recent phenomenon w/ development of a very specific overpowering loop drive style.
|
|||
assiduous
Platinum Member Joined: 05/01/2011 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2521 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Maybe it's because I play at a high level club. Everyone will tell you you can't play with a slow blade. Tell someone at my club TBS is fast. Ha. What blade exactly on this green earth has better control than TBS? All these kids that the coaches around are teaching.. David has IF ZLC, Michael has Xiom Zetro Quad.. all the kids learn the game with fast blades. TBS is never on the list of fast blades.
Listen, if you are gona be happy hitting around in some basement and beating all challengers in the neighborhood, then this discussion is all pointless. Walmart, Kmart, Appelgren, how does it really matter. If you like how the good players play and want to play like them, slow blades make learning HARDER, not easier. Two weeks and you are used with the new bounce. Then it's just learning the shots.
|
|||
puppy412 : Sorry man, I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but I know that more training will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out
|
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Well, that's funny because I'm guessing your club is at a lessor level than the chinese national team.
US TT coaching is notoriously bad, and the results speak for themselves. Look, I know it's easier to teach/learn the one loop/drive shot, esp when everyone else at the club does it, too, so all the games are just topspin counterrallies asap unless someone screws up. In fact, the complete lack of diversity in play is exactly the reason for all the hate against "junk" rubbers/styles or anything NOT strictly confined within very limited and trite boundary when the real reason is a generation of idiots who don't understand spin much despite what should be respectable ratings. BTW, those very high level players can use composite because they already have incredible touch from a lifetime of training. Eg, some notable high level coaches use it because they get sick of excessive exertion just to hit balls back. Entirely different story to average amateur. |
|||
frogger
Premier Member Joined: 08/03/2010 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3062 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
A tried and true formula has always been medium speed blades with medium speed/spin rubbers for beginners. Donic Allplay is a great beginners blade and can function well into medium levels.
|
|||
Wood Paddle
Red side Black side. |
|||
crackfst
Super Member Joined: 02/23/2013 Location: Milky Way Status: Offline Points: 365 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
TBS isnt even that fast. By far the worst are the beginners take a Schlager carbon + T05max/T05max :D
Still i wouldnt give a beginner a TBS, too expensive. Give them an ALL+ to OFF- blade(doesent matter if all wood of composite) that is cheap, like galaxy clones dhs blades And for rubbers mark V is good Sriver is good, cheaper chinese euro style rubbers would easily do it too though
|
|||
Darker Speed 90 Jpen
Tenergy 64 |
|||
silva7
Silver Member Joined: 03/14/2012 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 693 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
personally i think the Mark V is a slightly outdated rubber for beginners starting up now. reason being is that the "built in speed glue" rubbers on the market can produce better spin, speed and in some aspect control as well.
i think a beginner should start off with a 5 ply all wood blade like Stiga OC with desto f2/f3 or xiom vega europe both sides. these two tensor rubbers provide great control and feel.
|
|||
RSM Special Platinum T64
|
|||
Imago
Premier Member Joined: 07/19/2009 Location: Sofia Status: Offline Points: 5897 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
A $4 Donic Appelgren Level 100 bat is not worse than any old tempered Alser or Bengtsson as far as feel and touch are concerned. And certainly better for a beginner than TBS, Amultart, or T-1, T-2, T-3, etc. up to T-11+ self-mortars. Chinese clones are ridiculously fast.
|
|||
bluebucket
Platinum Member Joined: 02/20/2011 Location: 16 Status: Offline Points: 2882 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
I wouldn't take much advice from people using fast blades that have never progressed past beginner levels. There are three groups of people using the TBS.
Professionals, high level highly trained juniors and the perennial hopeless. That's it, everyone else that plays over us2000 long term uses all wood blades in the all to -off range. Table tennis is more enjoyable the more skill you have so you really want to do yourself a favour and not hamper your development with the wrong blade |
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Personally I question if this is a good idea. It kind of works at least in the US because the country's mid-tier is full of wonky players who've "mastered" their basement styles, and the easiest way to power past them is do so literally by learning the one shot and ignoring their spins. This puts people in this dilemma where they then have to go back to learn the basic touch shots, but that's not advantageous against others in their position because they can just counterrally between themselves rather than try out weak short game where they lose for a period before being able to use in tournament. It's just a bad situation all around IMO. |
|||
beeray1
Premier Member Joined: 07/03/2008 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 5169 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
this is a silly thread....
people who are using composite hyper blades that aren't that good, players that stand by the "slow blades are all you need" crap because it makes them feel superior for some stupid reason.. who cares? A blade is just a blade. Any blade you use is fine. Sure some are gonna damage development if they are absurdly fast, but who out of us is seriously developing and becoming a professional or top level player. But come on, you can't really think that players stuck in the mid range of under 2000 are there because of the fast blade they use. The same dudes are gonna be stuck there regardless because they don't get a chance to play enough, not because of their equipment. People who tote the slow blades or you're a chump campaign are no better than EJ's. It's like to be considered good by these guys you have to be an all around player like the last great white people of the sport. Yeah, you have to learn to earn the point if you are a serious developing player, and in that case, please use a slower blade with regular rubber. Any other case, an offensive player at 1600 is no fun to watch, but it's still a playing style. It wont change with an allaround classic. It's their playing style. Getting better is only on practice, that's it. Just like someone who blocks at the same level. Sure, the points are longer. But those guys can still get beat by a guy who can only play a few balls in a row really hard. It just depends. But becoming an all-around player doesn't automatically mean you're a superior player. It's just a different point of view.
|
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Yeah, if anything galaxy mc-2 stiga OC clone is better quality than real stiga OC. |
|||
AgentHEX
Gold Member Joined: 12/14/2004 Location: Yo Mama Status: Offline Points: 1641 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||
Here's the thing. A good ALL blade is not slow. It's only "slow" because of ridiculous new EJ fodder. Recall an OFF blade is designed for player with the skill to sustain attacks, not people piddling around at well under 2k which is the vast majority of players in the US. The average usatt rating (and most amateurs don't even play sanctioned tournaments regularly) is only 1400.
They are stuck at low level because they can't put the ball on the table with any regularity. Of course fast blades they can't even swing with are hindering their process. It's like they're not even playing table tennis but some "sport" where you try your hardest to
ALL blade does not imply all-round play, it just means you can put the ball on the table reliably enough to develop a game. I can guarantee that 1600 blocker is much less skilled than the 1600 attacker who often actually has a decent enough loop in practice, but shitty footwork and a touchy racket so never gets much of a chance to use it. At that point you're just wasting time developing "skills" that are useless, so the whole point of the slow racket crowd is to at least give you a chance to apply that aggression. |
|||
bluebucket
Platinum Member Joined: 02/20/2011 Location: 16 Status: Offline Points: 2882 |
Post Options
Thanks(1)
|
||
A blade is far far more important than most of you guys realise, it absolutely can make the difference between playing twenty years and being rated 1600 and playing twenty years and being rated 2200 with everything else being the same, it's not something you might see in a day or a week or even a year but over the long term the players using good blades will naturally rise higher up than those who have a bad blade. That might be the extreme example between a carbon blade and a "slow" blade but it's fact. Using a blade low on feel is like playing deaf and playing deaf is not far behind playing blind. Less sensors make you learn slower, more mistakes with shorter rallies make you learn slower, the game is ridiculously hard to learn as it is. Why deliberately make it harder just because some company trying to scam you out of money for stupid blade X has told you a large sweet spot (which almost doesn't even exist) is a good thing (it's not). How are you ever going to get decent variation unless you have a blade which can play both fast and dead slow
|
|||
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |
Forum Home | Go to the Forums | Forum Help | Disclaimer
MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd. |