When will you use the new balls exclusively?

I was thinking about it myself...

NextLevel wrote: My answer is: whenever tournaments I play at start using them i.e. when my USATT rating is dependent on how well I play with them.  You don't play USATT tournaments which is why your choice is more personal. I expect that to be January 2015 as the Nationals is still committed to the old ball and that will likely influence the NA Teams, though the NA Teams and Nationals might have a change of heart depending on how the new ball plays at the World Cup and whether elite players coming to the Teams are using the new ball.

Sounds about right to me.  I think that is probably what most people will do, and I will follow the herd which in the US probably means holding off until around November or so. 

Once I can get the new balls locally, I will start using them exclusively.

If their playing characteristics stay like this, I will not use them, even when our league changes over to them. Also, their durability has to go up and the price down.

Baal wrote: One part of me wants to use them now, since that is the future

We can conclude from the past that plastic ball is not the future. The fact is however that some people inside the ITTF have been working to make it the future contrary to the reason and players interests.

In the past plastic balls failed on the market in 1970s and later also at tournament tests in 1980s.

After the well known BoD decision (2011) based on the "coming worldwide celluloid ban" lie the plastic balls were found bad by some top players who tested them and their introduction was delayed twice, till 2013 and then again till 2014.

Recently it has been practically delayed again, this time in a very clever manner. In the technical leaflet T3 someone added a temporary amendment allowing to make the plastic balls heavier that the rules allow. Note that after 01.01 2016 those heavier balls are not allowed any longer automatically. Apart from this decision being illegal, it demonstrates again that new plastic balls as designed by some ITTF people and manufacturers are crap, so they temporarily allow the plastic balls to be a little bit better and then, when people possibly switch to plastic, they'll introduce the real crap again.

http://www.ittf.com/stories/pictures/T3_Ball_forBoD2014_final.pdf, page 4

Tinykin wrote: Don't worry. Come 01.01.2016, the ITTF BoD will once again twist their interpretation of the rules to say that this heavier ball is now legal and permanent.

I do not think so. If they had wanted it permanent, they would have made it permanent already. As new "tolerances". They did not.

It must be clear that the purpose of the whole scam is not to provide us with gut balls. As I said, it has already been obvious for a long time that plastic balls are crap. Now after they increased the ball size without changing the weight, additionally the durability has become really bad. This is what they apparently wanted, so if they say heavier ball is gone after 01.01.2016, we have all reasons to believe they mean it.

I am totally confused. 

I currently use two types of balls. I don't mind it as I know it is a transitional period. But what bothers me is the poor durability of the plastic balls.

hithithit wrote: I currently use two types of balls. I don't mind it as I know it is a transitional period. But what bothers me is the poor durability of the plastic balls.

Is this transition period limited, or are they going to keep making celluloid ones?

Baal wrote: hithithit wrote: I currently use two types of balls. I don't mind it as I know it is a transitional period. But what bothers me is the poor durability of the plastic balls. Is this transition period limited, or are they going to keep making celluloid ones?

You would expect the transition period to be limited - up to 1st Jan 2016. To which, this would imply some celluloid balls would still be ITTF approved up until that date.

In regards to manufacturing, I did ask a reputable retailer a few weeks back, and as far as they know, manufacturers have scaled back the production of celluloid balls. They didn't know of any cessation date.

Putting things together, I would say there will be less supply of celluloid balls (at least well known brands). This could mean a possible rise in the prices of celluloid balls or worse still some models might become very hard to get. We are already seeing that in some markets.

Please let us know if you know more.

Mastermind, it doesn't matter what the ITTF rules say if manufacturers don't actually market a celluloid ball that you can use.  Plastic balls have been legal since the days of Halex but nobody for the last few decades actually sold one so it was a moot point.  So let me rephrase the question.   Does anybody know if manufacturers plan to continue to sell ITTF approved celluloid balls over the long run (i.e. once the current stock is sold)?  From hithithit's last comment it sounds like they won't.

I didn't care at all for the way ITTF brought about this change, but that train has left the station.

Baal wrote: Mastermind, it doesn't matter what the ITTF rules say if manufacturers don't actually market a celluloid ball that you can use.

Well, we could as well assume the food manufacturers would stop selling food.

Using Germany as an example, the overwhelming majority of teams did not choose the plastic ball for their competitions, they will use celluloid ball. So, why on Earth would manufacturers stop selling celluloid balls? This would be beyond reason. Maybe they can still be blackmailed to do that, I do not know. But just like that this is not going to happen.

Mastermind wrote: Maybe they can still be blackmailed to do that, I do not know.

Or bribed.  Look, people will have to use some kind of ball, and if they can sell a more expensive one, well that would be good for them.  There is no reason to expect that manufacturers will continue to make celluloid balls, indeed I would be very curious to know if major companies even continue to produce them now.

And how much do you want to bet that at some point not too long from now, the rules will be amended again to make the celluloid balls illegal?  Who would not find this implausible?

Like I said, the train has left the station.  (But when I play later today, I am going to use celluloid balls).

Baal wrote: Or bribed.  Look, people will have to use some kind of ball, and if they can sell a more expensive one, well that would be good for them.  There is no reason to expect that manufacturers will continue to make celluloid balls, indeed I would be very curious to know if major companies even continue to produce them now. And how much do you want to bet that at some point not too long from now, the rules will be amended again to make the celluloid balls illegal?  Who would not find this implausible?

Well, I certainly trust the perpetrators to keep doing what they have been doing one way or another, but we certainly should not run ahead of them. The outcome of the plastic ball swindle might be as well that it will be gone next year.

In the market economy there will be celluloid balls supply as long as there is demand.

Baal wrote: my best guess is that before too long, celluloid balls will no longer be made.

As long as celluloid balls are legal for the competitions and there is demand, there will be supply. At the moment the demand for the celluloid balls e.g. in Germany is almost 100%. But I respect your guessing .