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More control without compromising on speed

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    Posted: 04/21/2015 at 5:12pm
I need some advice from experienced players:
It's almost 2 yrs that i have been playing w/ Stiga Carbo WRB 7.6 w/ Calibra LT Plus (2.0) on both sides. This is a very fast setup with no dwell time that suits my direct offensive style. I am happy with the blade when i am in control and the game is fast, but against players that slow things down and loop with high arc, I have a hard time being in control with feeling that my setup is too bouncy


A couple of weeks ago, I tried a Michael Maze that was moderately fast but had a soft grippier rubber (likely Accuda S2 or M1?) and I was surprised about the level of control i had...which resulted in winning against players i normally struggle against as described above. It was slightly slower than my setup but the ball pocketing made a world of a difference in terms of control. I also tried the Butterfly Amultart w/ Accuda S3 and did not like that combo bc although it had more control, it felt considerably slower then my setup. 

So i want to change things the following:

1. If the Calibra LT plus is rated as hard. Is a medium sponge w/ same properties the way to go? or should i go to soft? are the companies consistent in their ratings? Which of these will give more spin, steeper/higher arc WITHOUT compromise in speed?

here are some options:
1. Calibra LT Spin
2. Calibra LT Sound
3. Airoc M or S
4. Desto F1
5. Evolution EL-P or MX-P
6. Accuda S2, M2
7. Bluefire JP-01 turbo


2. Although i think i can only tell the feel of my paddle w/ a different rubber, i am willing to invest into another blade, likely an OFF+. I am considering the Maplewood NCT VII w/ either Tenergy 80 or Bluefire JP 01 Turbo but open to suggestions, i am also not hung on Stiga but I like the good build quality. So in comparison to the Carbo WRB 7.6 what blade will give me the same or better speed, and more feel?


1. Maplewood NCT VII
2. Carbonado 145
3. something else (recommend)
I hope you understand what I am aiming for... ;)


Edited by chicane - 04/21/2015 at 5:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/21/2015 at 5:43pm
Spin and speed don't really mix.  There has to be a compromise.

Don't go with Desto F1.  That thing is a relic of the past.  There is a reason it's called F1.  Everything else is fine.

You feel your current setup is bouncy yet you want an Off+?  Get yourself a piece of the classic - the Offensive Classic CR, the so called "looping machine".  You will get plenty of "feel".  Anything else is overkill.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/21/2015 at 6:02pm
Hi Zeio, 
I've read it in more than one spot that the OFF+ is overkill and that it's best to slow things down. That advice makes sense. Truthfully though, I am addicted to the speed in my setup and that's why I don't want to compromise too much on that front. The Carbo 7.6 is borderline OFF/+ and i sincerely don't think i need more speed (hence the Maplewood NCT VII, has slightly less/same speed but more control). But i am asking for more only to compensate for the loss i will get by going to a medium or a softer rubber. I do know that if i can get a little more dwell and arc then I can handle the other aspects. 

The way things are right now, i can only feel the blade in high pace hitting, everything medium or slow is purely the feel of the LT plus hardness which is simply difficult to control. 

Desto F1 is out of the picture. The LT spin is perhaps the strongest candidate but I am having a hard time gaging the hardness of the models i listed based on provided numbers alone as i don't think all companies use the same scale. what do you think?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/21/2015 at 7:00pm
No, it is not ideal to compensate for the loss of rubber speed with more blade speed.  That kills the whole purpose of going for a softer rubber.  What seems like an act of balancing is in fact what kills the balance, as you have tried first-hand with the Amultart/Acuda S3 combo.  Speed and spin are more or less exclusive to each other.  You don't want to achieve a similar speed with your new setup while hoping to gain more spin and arc.  That won't work.  Been there.  Done that.  What you want is a setup that suits your game.  Pick one to focus on among speed, spin and control.

Hardness is a complicated issue in table tennis rubber.  There're several scales employed by the few major manufacturers and they're not compatible.  The sure fire way to know is to try it in person.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JacekGM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/21/2015 at 7:02pm
more control at high speed... only the best can boast that
so, practice practice practice - I wish I could walk my talk
(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Yinhe T7 (Fl, 87 g) with Bluefire M3 (red 2.0) on FH and 0.6 mm 755 on BH.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/21/2015 at 10:55pm
Zeio, 

The Amultart combo was playable actually, the rubber sponge might have been a little old and it was very soft/mushy enough that i was feeling the impact/stiffness of the Amultart...and found it too stiff/dead on the feedback. When hitting thru, the tackiness of the rubber, followed by almost a dampened hollow sponge, coming to impact with a very rigid surface didn't flow for me, the dwell was too long that it did not feel like a one unit. But it had the potential and better control then my setup so i can see others liking it. My conclusion is that it was the polar opposite of my setup...and mine actually flows together, except that i never get to feel the blade fully unless it's top speed play. So i think they compensate each other...just not in a linear fashion as the technique of the stroke and other factors come into play...that's why it's both tricky to get it right and thus important to get advice from various players. 

I know it's hard to achieve Zeio & JacekGM but it's doable for someone like me who is competitive and is always improving, Afterall it is a game that rewards the attacker and thus one is always active in creating effects and constructing points. I am not just chasing the latest and greatest, i just want the best balanced setup for what i want to do...even if i have to work at something to improve and reach my potential. The 2nd blade i tried (M.Maze/ Accuda M2) was well balanced actually and I would be happy to just order that setup. The M.Maze is similar to the Carbo 7.6 in many aspects (w/ Carbo being slightly faster and has a better feel) but Accuda M2 felt just right. So that's why most of my next rubber choices on the Carbo 7.6 will be around medium hardness. one of them will surely blend well. And in coming to the market, i figured why not also find a similar balance that is upgraded in every aspect. i find it hard to believe that it does not really exist.

I don't know if either of you are familiar with the tennis industry...but it used to be like this. Recreational players used to wonder how could pros hit it so hard and keep it in. The predominant pro string used to be natural gut. it was very elastic and ridiculously difficult to control unless you had top techniques and either a sponsor or lots of money ($40-60 that can last you less than an 1 hr of play). Then polyester (Luxilon) technology hit the market with durable strings that are explosive in power while maintaining control. All of a sudden the whole world switched to polyester, with only the pros tweaking it for more feel, then both racket & strings industries caught up now by compensating for the lack of feel that generally comes with the polyester strings. 

The thing is that for a new tennis racket & strings, i can go online and demo any combo i want for the price of shipping.  In PP unfortunately, i have to compare and rely on subjective opinions and experiences because trying all the options might just be too costly. Or is there a demo program that i should know about? Thank you for sharing your experiences with me! Smile




Edited by chicane - 04/21/2015 at 11:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CraneStyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 5:17am
Originally posted by fatt fatt wrote:

This is all about me...i play bad with fast setups but I enjoy killing underspin and smashing with them; killing a ball with a slower blade is still possible with even more commitment and placement and...thinking and ? Patience.
Slower blades are good for the thinker.
I am thinking about going back to a violin between 88 and 90 grams. My mjszlc is for somebody better than me.


Well... I have an 86g MJZLC that plays like a dream...

... and a 91g MJZLC that plays me...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 9:35am
Do those 4 grams really make that much difference? Weight has never been an issue for me but I do see it being a problem for the short game. Why is the ZLC so expensive? How does it play?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CraneStyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 10:29am
Originally posted by chicane chicane wrote:

Do those 4 grams really make that much difference? Weight has never been an issue for me but I do see it being a problem for the short game. Why is the ZLC so expensive? How does it play?


The 91g MJZLC is more head heavy, a bit stiffer and a lot more solid to be honest...

The 91g inertia aids BH loops play for me, but FH is more muted (very M. Maze like)...

I suspect the veneers are thicker on the 91g blade. ...

Generally, I love ZLC blades because I like a more direct feel which is excellent for short game touch...

TB ZLC has a harder feel (koto) and more direct when driving the ball. MJ ZLC is it's softer (limba) cousin...

Both blades loop and feel great in the 85g region (I use ST handles)...

Weight does matter if you become accustomed to a distinct feel in your hand...

Consult Butterfly about the price. I'm just a consumer...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 10:39am
Chicane,  you seem to be able describe what you want quite well so on the surface you are an experienced player with some experience with equipment but on the off chance that the  impression is not accurate - how long have you played?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 11:07am
I am not sure what you mean by " on the off chance" Tom?

I've played since I was a kid intermittently. Then played for about a year straight in college where I participated, and won some in whatever university tournaments there were at that point the opponent never mattered, regardless of how much spin was coming i was playing with a cheap dead racket that neutralized just about everything. Then i stopped again for few years, now i am playing weekly in veterinary school against some very skilled players. As it's regularly competitive I got my Carbo 7.6 & Calibra LT plus which I selected based on my style of play and to be honest I was not that far off with my choice. Now I need to adjust my game because if i am not on the front foot against more developed players, I struggle to get out of the dinky/chop/loop spin game. I know i am improving fast, but as someone pointed my setup has little room for error. There are days when i am able to do well, but on a regular day i have to put much more efforts to control the point. I played collegiate tennis, I am athletic, I can construct a point, i understand depth, angles, positional awareness, etc, but I am still learning a lot about ping pong thru play and practice. I am aware of what tweaking your equipment can do, I also understand what i want from my paddle. The problem is that I do not have experience with equipement and i do not have access to ample choices that i can try before deciding, so i am relying on other people's feedback and online descriptions and ratings. i hope that helps
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 11:23am
Originally posted by CraneStyle CraneStyle wrote:

 


The TB ZLC sounds quite similar to my Carbo 7.6. Did you ever play w/ it to compare? 

Talking blade alone, the Carbo is borderline OFF / OFF +. I know it will be good for me w/ something like the Calibra LT Spin, Accuda S2 or even Tenergy 05 or 80. That's going to be confirmed when I make the order soon. 

The right way of doing things is adjusting the rubbers on my crabo 7.6 and reassess. But i want a 2nd setup that is similar or better...And i know there is an OFF+ somewhere that will feel right for me. 

Any thoughts on the Maplewood NCT VII? is it being discontinued? does it really have a great control with the speed it offers? Which gives you more feel, all wood or carbon layered? What about the Carbonado 145 anyone?

I would go for the butterfly but everything they produce seems to be at a different pricing level which is hard to justify...The right balance for equipment performance should go parallel with the price/quality...balance...otherwise i am really just buying expensive brands. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 11:55am
Chicane,

not that it matters, but what I meant by" on the off chance" is in case the impression is wrong, though unlikely.

From reading your initial post, you would be better off to change your blade.  If the M. Maze improved your control and results right away then your blade is too fast.  Personally I find the Maze great when I am ripping fast loops but too much catapault in a game.  The rubber could only compensate so much the blade.
With the price of rubbers nowadays I think it makes more sense for you to experiment with couple of blades as you could sell the ones you ultimately don't want (they will keep their value better than rubbers).  I could vouch for the 145 but it might not be fast enough for you preferences as described.  If you want something faster, the 190 might fit the bill better, but I have not tried it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CraneStyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 12:00pm
Originally posted by chicane chicane wrote:

Originally posted by CraneStyle CraneStyle wrote:

 



The TB ZLC sounds quite similar to my Carbo 7.6. Did you ever play w/ it to compare? 

Talking blade alone, the Carbo is borderline OFF / OFF +. I know it will be good for me w/ something like the Calibra LT Spin, Accuda S2 or even Tenergy 05 or 80. That's going to be confirmed when I make the order soon. 

The right way of doing things is adjusting the rubbers on my crabo 7.6 and reassess. But i want a 2nd setup that is similar or better...And i know there is an OFF+ somewhere that will feel right for me. 

Any thoughts on the Maplewood NCT VII? is it being discontinued? does it really have a great control with the speed it offers? Which gives you more feel, all wood or carbon layered? What about the Carbonado 145 anyone?

I would go for the butterfly but everything they produce seems to be at a different pricing level which is hard to justify...The right balance for equipment performance should go parallel with the price/quality...balance...otherwise i am really just buying expensive brands. 


You don't have to buy new...

You could buy used that could be mint condition...

There's a gazillion blades out there and if you can't test them personally in the end you have to jump in and buy...

I couldn't test what I thought I wanted in my club, so I correlated reviews from all over the net including this forum...

It still might take a few goes till you find "Your" setup. That's why I recommended buying used first...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote frogger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 12:24pm

I feel your pain. Went through the expense of trying all the big tensors and composite fast blades. Want fast speed, great control, and nice spin then get yourself a stiff fast blade and Mark V Max and call it real good. If you have fast arm speed and good technique you will land more winners. Simple formula that's great for non pros...like 99% of us here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Victor_the_cleaner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 2:00pm
I cannot play with a slow blade vs people better than me. It is just not possible. It requires more backswing and more follow through but vs better opponents I am always short on time. There is just no time to open your arm and swing. Even for the blocks, you barely have time to move your paddle to the ball and do a little twitch. With slow blade you have to actively carry the ball over the net. 

However at work my friends are 3-400 lower, and sometimes i use their paddles and I even enjoy the extra dwell time, but the time... There is just so much time for everything.. step around, open up, look which way he is leaning, and then go the other way. It is a luxury I never have with better players. 

But I digressed. If you want to keep the speed but make the blade less bouncy move from hinoki and limba outers to koto outer ply. Also from wood to carbon. Also if the carbon is the third layer, to one where carbon is the second layer. All of those make a blade less bouncy. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 2:06pm
Can you explain the koto outer ply? Also can you drop specific blade names to consider?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 2:32pm
Originally posted by chicane chicane wrote:

Zeio, 

The Amultart combo was playable actually, the rubber sponge might have been a little old and it was very soft/mushy enough that i was feeling the impact/stiffness of the Amultart...and found it too stiff/dead on the feedback. When hitting thru, the tackiness of the rubber, followed by almost a dampened hollow sponge, coming to impact with a very rigid surface didn't flow for me, the dwell was too long that it did not feel like a one unit. But it had the potential and better control then my setup so i can see others liking it. My conclusion is that it was the polar opposite of my setup...and mine actually flows together, except that i never get to feel the blade fully unless it's top speed play. So i think they compensate each other...just not in a linear fashion as the technique of the stroke and other factors come into play...that's why it's both tricky to get it right and thus important to get advice from various players. 

I know it's hard to achieve Zeio & JacekGM but it's doable for someone like me who is competitive and is always improving, Afterall it is a game that rewards the attacker and thus one is always active in creating effects and constructing points. I am not just chasing the latest and greatest, i just want the best balanced setup for what i want to do...even if i have to work at something to improve and reach my potential. The 2nd blade i tried (M.Maze/ Accuda M2) was well balanced actually and I would be happy to just order that setup. The M.Maze is similar to the Carbo 7.6 in many aspects (w/ Carbo being slightly faster and has a better feel) but Accuda M2 felt just right. So that's why most of my next rubber choices on the Carbo 7.6 will be around medium hardness. one of them will surely blend well. And in coming to the market, i figured why not also find a similar balance that is upgraded in every aspect. i find it hard to believe that it does not really exist.

I don't know if either of you are familiar with the tennis industry...but it used to be like this. Recreational players used to wonder how could pros hit it so hard and keep it in. The predominant pro string used to be natural gut. it was very elastic and ridiculously difficult to control unless you had top techniques and either a sponsor or lots of money ($40-60 that can last you less than an 1 hr of play). Then polyester (Luxilon) technology hit the market with durable strings that are explosive in power while maintaining control. All of a sudden the whole world switched to polyester, with only the pros tweaking it for more feel, then both racket & strings industries caught up now by compensating for the lack of feel that generally comes with the polyester strings. 

The thing is that for a new tennis racket & strings, i can go online and demo any combo i want for the price of shipping.  In PP unfortunately, i have to compare and rely on subjective opinions and experiences because trying all the options might just be too costly. Or is there a demo program that i should know about? Thank you for sharing your experiences with me! Smile


That's it.  The ever-elusive "gears" that is sought after by everyone.  You'll be hard-pressed to find a setup that performs well in every aspect over the entire range of speed and hence distance.  We want our setups to respond as linearly as we hope for.  So we go pair a stiff blade with a soft rubber thinking if we add here and subtract there, then voila, things will even out.  Just when we think we've got the best of both worlds, reality comes striking hard.

Table tennis has undergone a similar transformation in the 60s with the advent of sandwich rubber, giving rise to the Chinese fast-attack style and the European topspin style.  For the inverted rubber camp, there were only two factions - Chinese tacky and Japanese grippy.  True to this date, the former is superior in spin due to the tack while the latter has the upper hand in speed thanks to an extremely lively sponge.  Some Chinese then had the thought of what if we pair up our tacky topsheet with the Japanese sponge, that way we can keep the spin and get more speed, right?

Heck no!  It didn't come out as expected.  It turned out the tack of the topsheet was working against the resilience of the sponge.  It didn't work then, it doesn't work now and it still won't work in the future.  The only way for the resilient sponge to work is reduce the tackiness of the topsheet, which DHS has done with the Neo version of the Hurricane series.  The catch?  The spin will never be the same.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 2:55pm
So what's the big difference between chinese tacky and grippy in both their surface effect, and their underlying sponge layer? does grippy mean elastic while tacky is more of a sticky effect that relies much more on the friction and less on the whole action of the ball on impact?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote frogger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 4:11pm

Koto seems to give more "bite" to the rubber than Limba. Limba loads top spin very well and is better for longer strokes. Ply, composition are all part of the formula so each player must decide for themselves. Everyone wants gears so it's tricky to find a fast blade/rubber combo to cover all the bases. What works for player A will be unacceptable for player B even with similar styles. There is no such thing as a perfect setup...but we can get close.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ericd937 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 4:24pm
Almost any blade is going to have more feel then that Stiga Carbo 7.6. I played with one for a few months. I didn't like it. No dwell time and no feel. Just try some of your friends blades when you go to the club. Donic Waldner Senso Carbon is a really nice one. Try one of the two blades in my signature. Both are really good. Have you started playing with the new 40+ ball yet? I actually prefer a slower blade with the new ball. You could also try going to a thinner sponge  instead of max sponge. You might be surprised how much better control and feel you will have. 

Edited by ericd937 - 04/22/2015 at 4:27pm
Current Setup: TBS FH T80/BH D80
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ericd937 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 4:25pm
Chicane, do you have a USATT rating? 
Current Setup: TBS FH T80/BH D80
Official USATT Rating 1815
Current estimated level: 1800-1900.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 7:30pm
No I don't Eric, i am not familiar with how the ping pong rankings work. I hope it's not like the USTA rankings because they are very subjective. 

I think the Carbo 7.6 has a good feel. I wonder what the blades you are suggesting will play like. 
I would go to a thinner rubber if i wasn't aiming to sustain the speed, and more importantly they take away from the dwell time as well. Maybe with a softer sponge?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ericd937 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 9:35pm
Chicane, are you a garage player or do you go to a club? Have you ever taken a lesson from a coach? I'm trying to get an idea of what your playing level is. 
Current Setup: TBS FH T80/BH D80
Official USATT Rating 1815
Current estimated level: 1800-1900.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2015 at 11:04pm
There are no clubs where i am at. Small island! I play in a gym. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/23/2015 at 12:15am
Originally posted by chicane chicane wrote:

So what's the big difference between chinese tacky and grippy in both their surface effect, and their underlying sponge layer? does grippy mean elastic while tacky is more of a sticky effect that relies much more on the friction and less on the whole action of the ball on impact?
More or less.  You may have read it on the web, that tacky rubber is described as producing topsheet spin and grippy rubber as producing mechanical spin.

Anyway, there are some guidelines you may want to read up on to get a general understanding of how various combinations work together for different goals.


Edited by zeio - 04/23/2015 at 12:25am
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chicobo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/27/2015 at 6:00pm
What is the weight difference between Calibra and mx-p?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/28/2015 at 11:04pm
Hi Chocobo, 

I don't know as i have never experienced the mx-p. I can tell you though that the Calibra is on the heavier side of things. Weight has not been an issue for me thus far. There is a rubber's mass database here http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1128

Hope that helps
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chicane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/28/2015 at 11:07pm
Hey Zeio, 

What could one expected with a hard sponge and a sticky top sheet vs something like the Calibra LT plus which hard sponge but is grippy?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/28/2015 at 11:41pm
Other than speed and spin, I'd say the great divide is that peculiar sensation of dullness, mushiness and hollowness for Chinese tacky rubbers, Japanese grippy rubbers and German grippy rubbers, respectively.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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