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Estimate the Rating of Small Korean Boy

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heavyspin View Drop Down
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    Posted: 12/01/2015 at 11:22am
One of my matches at the Butterfly teams vs unrated Korean boy. I thought the estimated rating given to him (I won't say) was fair but on the low side.

 


Edited by heavyspin - 12/01/2015 at 11:33am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 11:36am
At first I thought 2000 to 2100, but as the match progressed I'm thinking more like 2200.  He rallies 2200 if you let him, but his short game is 2000.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 1:05pm
The kids definitely done some training, looking at his legs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LOOPMEISTER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 1:07pm
Counter attacking 2300.

Server return 1800.

(2300+1800)/2= USATT Rating 2050. QuestionTongue



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 1:14pm
I hesitated to dock him that much for serve return because I know Heavy is probably a pretty tricky server.

I noticed after the first game (maybe his coach advised) he started pushing for the extreme forehand side in an attempt to make heavy move.  He missed a lot, but when he got them on (even weakly) it was pretty sound strategy and allowed him to get into the return game a little.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mjamja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 1:57pm
Not sure of the actual rating.

But I am sure that the "rating points/pound" factor is very high.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocketman222 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 2:34pm
Originally posted by mjamja mjamja wrote:

Not sure of the actual rating.

But I am sure that the "rating points/pound" factor is very high.

Mark



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 3:12pm
I thought that too when I first read it.  That isn't what he was saying.

I'm sure he was saying the kid had a high ratio of points to size...hearkening back to the OP title "small korean boy"



Edited by cole_ely - 12/01/2015 at 3:13pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Canadian Bacon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 3:26pm
I would say he was rated U1800/O1500 probably mid 1600s, he has a really good serve though.


Edited by The Canadian Bacon - 12/01/2015 at 3:29pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AcudaDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 4:05pm
Hmmm...since you lost to him he's pretty good. He looks like a 2200 player, but I'm guessing he was only rated about 2000.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocketman222 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 5:05pm
Originally posted by The Canadian Bacon The Canadian Bacon wrote:

I would say he was rated U1800/O1500 probably mid 1600s, he has a really good serve though.

may be if he was in california lol
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 5:45pm
When I first started watching the first game, I thought that too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 6:09pm
The estimate was probably provided by a forum member given everything that has been written so far.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ThePongProfessor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 9:46pm
1750-1800 ?

Edited by patrickhrdlicka - 12/01/2015 at 9:47pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 10:43pm
Nah. Tbs most common guesses are correct but the kid even out performef those.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kurokami Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 11:02pm
Originally posted by LOOPMEISTER LOOPMEISTER wrote:

Counter attacking 2300.

Server return 1800.

(2300+1800)/2= USATT Rating 2050. QuestionTongue




interesting calculation. i came up with the same result initially by comparing the same techniques used to amy wang's (i'd say she's better) and overall play to some similar aged kids. 
his serve return is a little weaker, yes, but playing a completely new opponent or being off-guard, it's reasonable to allow a game for adjustment. korea also likely uses age divisions so he wouldn't have come across as heavy spin before. 
after seeing the latter part of the match, i revised my estimated upwards to 2130 - 2180.

 


Edited by kurokami - 12/01/2015 at 11:03pm
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http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=65345&KW=&title=feedback-kurokami
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote skip3119 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 11:15pm
My guess is that they gave him an estimated rating of 1800, since he beat heavyspin, so the kid is probably worth 2200.

The kid's service return remains much to be desired.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2015 at 11:34pm
Everyone, heavyspin thought the kid's estimated rating was fair - his estimated rating wasn't radically low!

Here is another data point in case people need one.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kolev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 6:25am
Wow. This kid has a lot to offer. The only serious downside is his push - too long and easy to attack, but I guess that will change with time
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote heavyspin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 9:38am
Instead of finding out the given estimated rating, I think we should just wait until the his rating gets processed. He must've played 15 or so matches over the weekend. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 10:01am
My guess is that he should end up closer to .2300   He beat a lot of good players. I find it interesting that no one made specific mention of his serves. I misread them a lot and while I am a bad serve returner, I actuallyguessed the orientation right most of the time and consistently missed the amount of spin.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mhnh007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 10:10am
Kids with regular training are very hard to estimate.  If you let the them rally, play at their tempo, then they can look like a million bucks, even the ones at a lower level.  However, I think this kid is a real deal, his footwork is excellent.  I don't know enough about rating to estimate, but I think neither HS, nor NL will have a chance to beat this kid, the kid is simply better.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote heavyspin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 10:23am
Here's a scary thought. This kid was easily the weakest of the group of Korean kids who participated at this tournament. He was relegated to a 3rd division team while the other kids formed a team in division 1 and held their own against 2600 level competition.

Edited by heavyspin - 12/02/2015 at 10:28am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vanjr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 10:55am
Originally posted by Kolev Kolev wrote:

Wow. This kid has a lot to offer. The only serious downside is his push - too long and easy to attack, but I guess that will change with time

I think some of his pushes looked good. Plus I think he wanted his opponent to open to punish it!Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote skip3119 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 3:35pm
I think they gave this kid an estimated rating of 1800.
Since the kid beat HS, so the kid is probably worth 2200.

His service returns remain much to be desired.  If he improves on that front,
that may very well add 200 more points to his rating.


Edited by skip3119 - 12/02/2015 at 3:36pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kolev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 5:03pm
Originally posted by vanjr vanjr wrote:

Originally posted by Kolev Kolev wrote:

Wow. This kid has a lot to offer. The only serious downside is his push - too long and easy to attack, but I guess that will change with time


I think some of his pushes looked good. Plus I think he wanted his opponent to open to punish it!Smile


Ha ha. C'mon man....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kolev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 5:26pm
Seriously, I think if this little fella don't lose motivation to play, very soon he'll become one hell of a scary player to play against, regardless of his American rating.
BTW I didn't get it, what means Korean kids exactly? Kids coming from Korea to participate in this competition, of they are American from Korean origin.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote danseemiller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 5:31pm
They came from Korea- 4 of them. Their #1 team only had 3 players so this youngster joined up with 
 some other Korean players from New Jersey. The 13 year old bookish looking junior on the # 1 team was amazing. Incredible power for someone who could not have weighed more than 100 pounds.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 5:42pm
Dan, do you have any idea what the coaching tools are that give kids this kind of power?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mjamja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2015 at 5:52pm
Baal,

How could you ask such a question? 

On this forum we all know it has to be the equipment Big smile

Mark
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