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Defective batch of XSF balls |
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DreiZ
Platinum Member Joined: 06/01/2009 Location: New York, US Status: Offline Points: 2574 |
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Posted: 05/21/2016 at 2:06pm |
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Bought two boxes on two separate orders from tt11 months apart. Stamped letters on boxes (XAAF, XGAE). All balls had soft spots (dents) 2 or 4 on opposite ends of each ball. Seems like QC issue. 4 balls broke within 5 minute of training. I inspected the second box later at home and noticed the same thing on all balls. And i just started liking these balls... |
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Ovtcharov Innerforce ALC 85g
FH/BH: Glayzer 09C 2.1mm USATT: 1725 |
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Egghead
Premier Member Joined: 09/05/2009 Location: N.A. Status: Offline Points: 4230 |
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It is a norm now . You can have one box lasted you over 30 sessions, then the next box will only last you 6 sessions.
Edited by Egghead - 05/22/2016 at 3:17pm |
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42andbackpains
Silver Member Joined: 10/05/2014 Location: NYC Status: Offline Points: 623 |
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The quality of production is sub standard for all balls. I myself still prefer the XSF or Nittaku Premium when they are fresh out of the box.
1. XSF cracks and 30 to 40% of the balls are not round. 2. Nittaku Premium and Butterfly G40 become wobbly after extended use. These two also become very slick after extended use, making the balls drop off the rubber quite often. 3. DHS also becomes wobbly after extended use.
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Mind is willing, but the back goes out too often :P
OSP Ultimate II 88 grams FH Dianchi D w/ Secret Sauce BH Butterfly T05 Red USATT rating keeps going down |
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DreiZ
Platinum Member Joined: 06/01/2009 Location: New York, US Status: Offline Points: 2574 |
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im disappointed that all 12 balls except maybe 1 or 2 were defected, if it was other way around i would be okay with that.
back to NP40+ i guess.
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Ovtcharov Innerforce ALC 85g
FH/BH: Glayzer 09C 2.1mm USATT: 1725 |
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Baal
Forum Moderator Joined: 01/21/2010 Location: unknown Status: Offline Points: 14336 |
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XSF has let their quality control slip.
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MLfan
Super Member Joined: 04/23/2015 Location: China Status: Offline Points: 486 |
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Perhaps they are fakes?
My XuShaoFa balls don't have that label, and I bought mine in China.
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DreiZ
Platinum Member Joined: 06/01/2009 Location: New York, US Status: Offline Points: 2574 |
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MLfan are you referring to the third picture?
Its not really a label, its part of the box in which they came in. I bought them at tabletennis11.com, i dont know if they are fakes because i only bought 2 boxes of XSF balls from them. Previously bought NP40+ 3pc box from them and they were real and good quality.
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Ovtcharov Innerforce ALC 85g
FH/BH: Glayzer 09C 2.1mm USATT: 1725 |
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MLfan
Super Member Joined: 04/23/2015 Location: China Status: Offline Points: 486 |
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https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a1z09.2.0.0.y9yPUc&id=520862059362&_u=m1ltlhe05842
These are what the balls look like in China
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Egghead
Premier Member Joined: 09/05/2009 Location: N.A. Status: Offline Points: 4230 |
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They are for Asian market, and they are the first batch (no ittf logo). The current one (for Asia market) is this I found my xsf boxes from tt11. The stamp is "XGAD". I remembered the balls were ok (each lasted 4~5 sessions), but they were not as durable as the balls from TTNPP. Anyway, if you want to play seamless 40+ ball, you can order them from zeropong. It is only 5 usd shipping, and 6 or 11 usd for 6 balls. Of course, you can order them from taobao too, and there are more bands there. Edited by Egghead - 05/22/2016 at 12:49pm |
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Baal
Forum Moderator Joined: 01/21/2010 Location: unknown Status: Offline Points: 14336 |
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As things stand now, there is only one factory in the world that can make the seamless balls, so I doubt they are fakes the way we normally think of the word. By the way, the ones with the red label that came in the tube instead of the box were the first ones I ever had, and they were really good balls! I think QC has declined since then. I find XSF balls with date stamps ending in AF are not very round anymore. XGAD balls are from 2014. My experience with balls of that age has been excellent. |
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Egghead
Premier Member Joined: 09/05/2009 Location: N.A. Status: Offline Points: 4230 |
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Actually, I think it is not the QC issue for the XSF balls. There have been many tt bands that have seamless balls, and I read somewhere that it may cost more for tt companies to ask for a higher std now. It is the $.
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Aurora ST: Rhyzm / Talent OX
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Baal
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This makes pretty good sense given that only one factory can make seamless balls.
In other words, if there are only so many of the round ones to go around, and finite production capacity, the factory can charge more for them, so the various companies now marketing seamless are forced to accept an every higher percentage of lower standard balls or they would have to pay more for the round ones (and then pass on the costs to buyers). And now there are a lot more companies selling seamless. When they first came out it was pretty much only Palio and XSF. Presumably the factory always made a certain percentage of egg-shaped balls and maybe a year ago XSF would not sell them but now they do. Whatever the reason, the end result to the buyer is that quality of the ball they receive is reduced. That's simply another way of saying QC is reduced. |
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AndySmith
Premier Member Joined: 11/12/2008 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 4378 |
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This is a real shame. My club is still making its way through our early batch of XSF, and the quality is good. The only recent purchases I've made are a box of Joola Flash and a box of Xiom seamless, out of which only one Joola ball was out of round (so that's 1/12, much better than Dreiz's experience).
Shame! Shame! Shame!
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rosecitytt
Super Member Joined: 06/28/2015 Location: NA Status: Offline Points: 310 |
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@42andbackpains
You don't say. At the club tournament we have this week, I notices i can see the ball actually wobbling in the air. Man, My vision is not very good if i can see it that means the displacemnet is really big. These are XSF club balls (meaning 1 star and most recent directly from XSF), have not experienced this with any or our 3star premium balls. I thought my eyes have problem, I saw it several times while I was playing, i can't believe my eyes. back to lab to do more testing on ball roundness/ Edited by rosecitytt - 05/22/2016 at 3:40pm |
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Baal
Forum Moderator Joined: 01/21/2010 Location: unknown Status: Offline Points: 14336 |
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XSF 1-star are unbelievably bad. Not good even as a training ball.
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DreiZ
Platinum Member Joined: 06/01/2009 Location: New York, US Status: Offline Points: 2574 |
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Trained today again and broke 2 XSF balls but from a different badge which were round. It seems like if you clip the ball with the racket edge its 99% most likely going to be broken.
Switched to NP40+ and they do play as expected. No weird bounce, just feels abit like a rock compared to XSF, looping doesn't have a weird feel compared to the SHA or BTY40+, good sound as usual. |
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Ovtcharov Innerforce ALC 85g
FH/BH: Glayzer 09C 2.1mm USATT: 1725 |
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Egghead
Premier Member Joined: 09/05/2009 Location: N.A. Status: Offline Points: 4230 |
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I thought this was common knowledge.
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Aurora ST: Rhyzm / Talent OX
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sandiway
Gold Member Joined: 04/15/2010 Status: Offline Points: 1554 |
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One guy who visits my house has a special knack for killing Kingniks (same as XuShaoFa) 3 stars with his forehand loop when we practice. But I notice his boosted rubber significantly overlap the edge of the blade. Kingniks still die to the tune of a few each session. Seems obvious that the plastic material they're using simply can't deflect very far and snap back (like celluloid). Deflect and crack. And unless they change the material, I suspect that's always going to be the case and not really a matter of QC. (Roundness, on the other hand, is a matter of QC.) Luckily I have a hundred or more to spare...
Edited by sandiway - 05/22/2016 at 8:13pm |
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Baal
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Again, for most people durability of seamless is not an issue on average, even though they occasionally shatter on edges.
Roundness, that is an issue. I use NP40+ for free play and my drill and multi-ball bucket is mostly XSF. I am pretty much content with this. |
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DreiZ
Platinum Member Joined: 06/01/2009 Location: New York, US Status: Offline Points: 2574 |
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I agree. I think I would be ok with them breaking against edges and such but balls with soft spots (dents) make the game unplayable completely. They also tend to just shatter in the air when hit normally.
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Ovtcharov Innerforce ALC 85g
FH/BH: Glayzer 09C 2.1mm USATT: 1725 |
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tabletennis11
Super Member Joined: 06/26/2012 Location: Estonia Status: Offline Points: 495 |
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Hello DreiZ, We are very sorry for this. Please email us at [email protected] and we will refund you the cost of defected balls. Please also keep me, [email protected], in email copy so your refund is probably going to be made faster. This all happened because some of the balls Xushaofa delivered to us were defected. We discovered this quality problem early and have now returned all defected balls back to Xushaofa. Please accept our apologies and contact us for refund. Annes Alex Org, Tabletennis11.com Marketing Manager
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Baal
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Dear TT11 people,
It's not just balls they shipped to you. A clubmate bought some balls with the same problem from another vendor. If everybody starts complaining and shipping balls back to XSF maybe they will improve the quality control. |
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DreiZ
Platinum Member Joined: 06/01/2009 Location: New York, US Status: Offline Points: 2574 |
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I'm in talks with tt11 about my last order of the balls.
I just noticed tt11 response on this thread.**** Thank you for sending me a reply, I'll write to you guys with all the details and cc you in the email. Thank you again! DreiZ Edited by DreiZ - 05/23/2016 at 12:23pm |
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Ovtcharov Innerforce ALC 85g
FH/BH: Glayzer 09C 2.1mm USATT: 1725 |
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42andbackpains
Silver Member Joined: 10/05/2014 Location: NYC Status: Offline Points: 623 |
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We had our tournament this weekend and used 2 dozen G40s. 2 to 3 cracked and maybe a couple were wobbly. I noticed the wobbly issue when some of the higher rated players came back to switch the balls. Overall i can say the G40s are in the middle of the pack. Not Great and Not Bad.
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Mind is willing, but the back goes out too often :P
OSP Ultimate II 88 grams FH Dianchi D w/ Secret Sauce BH Butterfly T05 Red USATT rating keeps going down |
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lineup32
Gold Member Joined: 12/06/2012 Location: Calif Status: Offline Points: 1195 |
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Early adoptee's of the plastic ball were positive about the seamless balls including ITTF that gave them the OK. Many players are still reading the early reviews and heard on the street how great these balls were many saying they were better then the old 40. Recently a club mate told me how the seamless ball had the same bounce as the Nittaku 40+ three star he read it somewhere but after a quick show and tell he changed his opinion.
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wturber
Premier Member Joined: 10/28/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3899 |
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I went to a fair bit of trouble testing this a while back, and there is no way that the seamless ball bounces the same as the NP40+. In my testing and pretty much by all other accounts, it bounces higher. I also tested to see if the seamless balls were pressurized. They were not. The NP40+ bounces the same as celluloid in the ITTF drop test, but it feels quite different than celluloid. Some people take the ITTF bounce test as evidence that the NP40+ ball is most like celluloid, but I think that is overgeneralizing from one rather limited characteristic. |
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Jay Turberville
www.jayandwanda.com Hardbat: Nittaku Resist w/ Dr. Evil or Friendship 802-40 OX |
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DreiZ
Platinum Member Joined: 06/01/2009 Location: New York, US Status: Offline Points: 2574 |
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Well hopefully Westchester TTC doesnt have too many of the bad ones. Got a tournament there this weekend and their ball sponsor is XSF.
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Ovtcharov Innerforce ALC 85g
FH/BH: Glayzer 09C 2.1mm USATT: 1725 |
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Baal
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My observations agree with Jay in every detail. |
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Baal
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They are ok when they are new. A little use, they get incredibly slick and shiny and then they slide on a lot of tables. Not very good at that point. |
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NextLevel
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The G40+ also dent without cracking. The uneven surface can have interesting side effects.
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I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
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