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Blade Rubber Combination

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sumit.tbrl View Drop Down
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    Posted: 04/16/2017 at 3:35am
Hello All...
My question is about combination of blade and rubbers for intermidiates. And I've a long explaination for my query or may be say confusion.


Background.....

After knowing just basic TT at teenage, I started playing regularly (at a club) at the age of 32. I love playing but still an amateur in its technicalities. Get regular advices from a more pro player friend. Playing time is 4 to 6 hrs a week.
After playing for around 03 years with his second hand racket (Stiga Tube Carbo with donic rubbers), I gained fair bit of consistancy in most of common strokes except bh loop.

I then changed to a new racket as TB ZLC blade with t-05 / tibhar fx-p on fh / bh and its been around a year with this setup.

Though I knew TB ZLC is fast and wanted slow speed high spin rubbers.
Got 05 on fh cos I like to open at the first oppertunity and loop/brush the boll well with fair control.
Got fx-p on bh considering a softer rubber would help in learning loop and opening on bh also.


Issues/Problems.....

For fh, T05 looked good to me for all strokes with good control in regular practice when I know at what distance ball will come. But in game, ploblem is that while attacking a long back spin / push , the ball goes long more often or in net. Can't control the speed.
Secondly, for bh, fx-p seems ok in all aspects except that it feels like bottoms out while blocking hard drives of any pro player.


Queries....

1. Forehand...
I have thought of changing to 05fx for a bit more control. But will it have similar effect of bottoming out or any other issue. If yes, any suggestion​ for high spin hard sponge rubber with some what slow speed than t05, say el-s (I may be wrong). OR, its just a matter of improving footwork and stick to t05. Age also seems to be a factor in poor footwork.

2. Backhand...
Any suggestions for bh rubber with hard sponge (again not to be too fast).

3. Blade...
Is it worth/required to change blade from TB ZLC. Any blade somewhat slow and more control. I read that soft outer ply of Innerforce layer help players who like looping rather than power hitting.


I have thought of IF ALC (rather than ZLC which has more speed) with el-s fh and el-p bh. Being an amature in tt, I need advice as a person who just love to play and want to improve. Play office level tournaments also.


Suggest from
Butterfly blades/rubbers.
Tibhar & donic rubbers.
As these are popular here..

Thanks...
Sumit
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smackman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smackman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2017 at 8:09am
If the ball is going long or into the net you need to work on your problems
and maybe gear too fast for a office level player, you are just doing normal boy things get the fastest blade and high spin rubbers and,,,,, after a while, you now need a slower blade but high spin rubbers ,,,,then
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sumit.tbrl View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sumit.tbrl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2017 at 9:04am
Though I didn't expect such harsh words, but may be some times we need them for complete rethinking.

My only delema is to whether...
stick with the equipment and slowly keep on improving on my problems
OR just straightaway move to an all wood blade TB Control with Mk-V kind of setup
OR a mid course is possible...

I feel at my age of 35 yrs, there'll be limit to max. level and speed of improvement.

Need suggestions on ways to step by step improvements....
Sumit
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Hozuki View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hozuki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2017 at 1:36pm
Try training first and commit to a time period of sticking with this setup and evaluate after that.
If that doesn't work then you can either use more linear rubbers or use a slightly slower, more flexible blade.
You may also use the opportunity to ask other clubmates or your local shop to try out other setups and try to understand how they are different from yours.
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*_strataras_* View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote *_strataras_* Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/17/2017 at 1:03am
sumit.tbrl sorry for saying this my friend, but both the blades you had are space rockets in terms of speed considering the years of expirience and the hours you play per week. You should go to an all+ or to an off-, NO faster! If you go to an all+ blade, then you can play with 2 tenergy in fh and backhand but in 1,9mm sponge so you will have the desirable arc in your game.
I cannot image you playing with these 2 blades (stiga tube carbon, almost off+ and TB zlc, a fast off) and these 2 rubbers (tenergy 05 and evo fx-p). You will not have the chance to change yur game into better with these kinds of setups. Innerforce alc will be again too fast for you.
If you want a butterfly blade then go for a Boll allround or Boll control. Another blade that could suit for you is the Gurbba allround. If you want artificial fibers in your blade go for a gionis carbon all+.
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Tenergy 05(black 1,9mm FH)
Tenergy 05(red 1,9mm BH)

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sumit.tbrl View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sumit.tbrl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2017 at 9:44am
Thanks to both Hozuki and strataras for such good and precise suggestions,

I asked my clubmates and they also suggested to keep the same blade TB ZLC for some more time, and after the present rubbers life, try once with some controlled slow rubbers for a year or so. Then give a thought about changing the complete setup. Try to improve footwork also.

Although its sufficient time till then, need some suggestions...
1. Some controlled rubbers for bh & bh for present blade to slow it down.
2. A few more options similar to gionis carbon all+ with artificial fibre in case i don't get the same blade.
3. Rubbers to keep on new blade. I love to loop on fore hand and always try to attack in game. Every one in club says my drives are good. Learning bh loops.

Again kindly suggest from butterfly, tibhar or may be donic.

Regards.
Sumit
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote *_strataras_* Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2017 at 4:10pm
sumit.tbrl your clubmates told you to keep the same blade and just change your rubbers. BUT when you are at the level in which you improve your level and try to learn the movements, then a slower setup will HELP you do your job easier!!! You say about your weak spot, the backhand...you think you will learn looping with easy from bh faster with your timo boll zlc or you would learn it easier and faster and with more precise with an all+ blade?
Well it is only up to you, we ocan only give you sugestions and say our opinion here, you are the boss.
My opinion...if you have money to spend, then spend to get an all+ blade and a new pair of rubbers.
As the rubbers regards, a good choice would be a tenergy 05 fx in 1,9mm for your forehand and a roundell soft for your backhand also in 1,9mm. I think roundell would be a great choice to improve your movement and help you learn looping from bh easier!
As for the blade, I already mentioned the gionis carbon all+ (perfect chice for me), but also tibhar drinkhall allround classic or tibhar allround classic. From donic blades, you could choose the appelgren allplay, the waldner allplay or the persson powerallround. Personaly, I wouldnt choose donic for my blade cause of the bad craftmanship.
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Tenergy 05(black 1,9mm FH)
Tenergy 05(red 1,9mm BH)

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Kapmirch View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kapmirch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2017 at 4:36pm
leave your set up the way it is. keep in the bag..
get a new blade something like a primorac , or a yasaka extra,
rubbers:
 fh :to5 
 bh: sriver or flextra.

work your way to the faster set up. feel the difference in setups, feel the ball. caress it.  

you will be able to tell what you want to  use after a few sessions and drills. 

in my experience from using  a flextra kind of rubber, you get out what you put in. which helps adjust your strokes. your stroke form is more important than what a set up can do for you.


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you cant buy happiness, but you can buy a TT table. And that's pretty much the same thing.
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jt99sf View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jt99sf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2017 at 4:43pm
Get some good coaching. Tape the sessions so you can refer back to them later.
TBS Black Tag: T25(FH)/Attack 8 pips(BH)

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Hozuki View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hozuki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2017 at 5:52pm
I think you should never change blade and rubbers simultaneously, as you won't understand anything about what has changed and why it did. If you think a change is necessary, then use same blade with different rubbers, or use same rubbers with different blade.
Also, the slower the rubbers, the faster the blade can be. The slower the blade, the faster the rubbers.

The way I view this is that it depends on your preference, either you want the fast blade to provide your base speed or your fast rubbers. The slower counterpart then should be much more linear and will generate more speed during more powerful shots.

Mathematically, it could be something like
Speed S = (b + r)*p +B +R,  with
b= power dependent speed increase of blade,
r= power dependent speed increase of rubber
B=power INdependent speed of blade
R=power INdependent speed of rubber

Okay this is just a linear approximation but I think it gets the idea across.
It should be more like a natural logarithm curve for hard, fast and stiff blades and soft, fast and bouncy rubbers. And more like a exponential curve for the opposite setup with eventual transition to linear curve.

However, I think for european style looping game, you need the sponge sinking.
You can achieve this dwell by choosing one of two setups: (I am mainly refering to FH strokes here)

1) hard and fast rubber + slow blade
best short pushing, but openers need effort. great at mid distance counterlooping, needs fast anticipation and power to penetrate the hard sponge, giving the most powerful shots. The choice of the Chinese.
2) soft and moderate speed rubber + fast blade
most middle gears, very easy to use. short game sucks, needs continous well placed loops to win the point, cannot generate enough power and spin to hit winners, gets overpowered by opponent using 1)
The choice of the average player.

However, I am currently trying to use
3) hard and fast, but linear rubber + fast stiff blade

This is a setup one would usually recommend to hitters and blockers. Not enough dwell to generate good spin and almost no feeling for touch shots. I compensate for the former by brush looping with tacky rubbers using chinese technique and for the latter by training more. But it eliminates the weaknesses you get from the other setups: won't get overpowered in topspin rallies or struggle with opening loops, also good quality pushes (with training) which makes it awesome.

Well this has become somewhat lengthy and it might not be 100% accurate as it just reflects my personal experience, but I think it might be useful for many players to think about the concept.
Therefore feel free to add or critcise!



Edited by Hozuki - 04/18/2017 at 5:55pm
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