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Principles of Finger Usage [Shakehand only]

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    Posted: 08/03/2017 at 5:23am
Hi everyone,Smile

While browsing various forums about technique, one the main topics that stood out to me was finger usage. There was a quote that went something like 'an elementary student uses the arm, high school student uses the forearm, university student uses the wrist, phd student uses the fingers' to that effect (apologies for the poor wording). Since i speak a little Chinese, and could not find any in-depth information regarding this notion i decided to do some research on Chinese websites. I stumbled upon an article that explains the concept quite coherently and thought it would be beneficial to fellow enthusiasts if I translated it. 

Disclaimer: Chinese, as many native speakers know, is not the easiest to translate to English especially when the direct literal translation is rarely understandable so i have made some adjustments in order for it to sound most natural and concise to English speakers. 

link to article: http://www.sohu.com/a/51852246_357128

Here goes:
[First of all, beginners and entry-level players alike do not necessarily, at the their present level, have to learn this technique. Instead, beginners should first get used to how the bat is positioned in their hand. The addition of finger usage may confuse them and do more harm than good. 

In order to learn how to correctly use the fingers to produce force, we must first understand the principles involved when striking the ball. In every single stroke, from a mechanics point of view, there are 2 forces produced between the ball and bat: 1. normative force (perpendicular to the face of the bat), which produces a ball that is 'struck' or 'hit' 2. tangential force (parallel to the face of the bat), which produces friction and puts spin on the ball. Based on adjustments of the two, you are able to control the arc of the ball.

To those who use the Shakehand grip, the object that has most potential for application, is most nimble and simultaneously the most difficult to utilise is -  the index finger. Do you know the reason why people extend the index finger out onto the rubber? Many people would say 'to hold up the bat for support'. Those who tout this as the reason do not grasp the essence of using the index finger - that is, to produce force. In fact >95% of amateur shakehand players do not know how to use the index finger to properly enhance their stroke. They see the professionals do it, so they follow blindly and do the same. All these years of playing, the index finger has been sitting comfortably on the back of the bat like idle furniture taking up space (I admit, i was guilty of this). 

Alright, since we know that 2 kinds of forces are produced with each stroke, the 2 forces outlined depend on your swing in an orbital motion and the direction of the swing. If you keep this in mind, the concept will become more clear. The application of the index finger also follows the same idea - it assists in producing the normative and tangential forces. Nothing more, nothing less.

Our index finger lies on the back of the bat. If you want to produce the normative force, the index finger must apply pressure to the bat to assist in producing the normative force. If you want to produce the tangential force with lots of spin, it might be slightly more difficult to explain. The index finger still needs to apply pressure, that way the finger and the rubber form a sort of 'static friction' or 'stationary friction'. Utilising this 'static friction' to support the wrist. For every loop, the index finger must do this and is especially noticeable when looping underspin and counter-looping. This important step is what most people don't know about.  In reality, all strokes produce a mixture of tangential and normative forces.

So what about the other usage of other fingers? On top of my head I can think of 2 reasons: 1 . to stabilise the bat 2. to support the index finger.

The Thumb: the application for the thumb follows the same principles as the index finger, except in the opposite direction. (mainly used for the backhand, not used for the forehand). It can also provide some stabilisation by applying pressure to even out the pressure exerted by the index finger. When playing backhand the usage of the index finger drops to about 50%, while the usage of thumb doubles.

Middle Finger/Second knuckle: wraps around the handle, can help produce a portion of the normative force in your strokes and also increase acceleration when 'brushing' the ball. A lot of players have already grasped this concept.

Ring and Pinky finger: cannot produce any force. Their main purpose is to help stabilise the bat when you play.]

Well, there's that and I hope you found it interesting. xD  LOL








Edited by LearnerDriverLicence - 08/03/2017 at 5:24am
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In my experience if you are able to hold the blade very lightly you can hit much better with more spin and power. This also true in all the other racquet sports. So I would have to disagree with this article about fingers being used. I do know some players (for fun) serve off their fingers to get funny spins!

Thanks for the article. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JacekGM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/03/2017 at 10:55pm
Nice, Thanks for your effort LDL.

IMO, however, the notion of the index finger being the key element in producing FH shots is incorrect. I would think that the middle finger is more important. It could also be that people's fingers and hands function a bit differently, depending on the person. 
A physiologist's opinion could be very interesting...
(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Juic SBA (Fl, 94 g) with Nimbus Soft (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm Curl P1R on BH.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/03/2017 at 11:45pm
Originally posted by JacekGM JacekGM wrote:

I would think that the middle finger is more important.

That post made my day.

Though it's true the middle finger plays a pivotal role in penhold FH.

Edited by zeio - 08/03/2017 at 11:46pm
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JacekGM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2017 at 11:43am
Originally posted by zeio zeio wrote:

Originally posted by JacekGM JacekGM wrote:

I would think that the middle finger is more important.

That post made my day.

Though it's true the middle finger plays a pivotal role in penhold FH.

After all, only the middle finger can play a pivotal role... you would not pivot around any other, would you...
(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Juic SBA (Fl, 94 g) with Nimbus Soft (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm Curl P1R on BH.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2017 at 6:56pm


Edited by zeio - 08/04/2017 at 7:11pm
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Suga D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2017 at 7:31pm
Originally posted by LearnerDriverLicence LearnerDriverLicence wrote:

Hi everyone,Smile

While browsing various forums about technique, one the main topics that stood out to me was finger usage. There was a quote that went something like 'an elementary student uses the arm, high school student uses the forearm, university student uses the wrist, phd student uses the fingers' to that effect (apologies for the poor wording). Since i speak a little Chinese, and could not find any in-depth information regarding this notion i decided to do some research on Chinese websites. I stumbled upon an article that explains the concept quite coherently and thought it would be beneficial to fellow enthusiasts if I translated it. 

Disclaimer: Chinese, as many native speakers know, is not the easiest to translate to English especially when the direct literal translation is rarely understandable so i have made some adjustments in order for it to sound most natural and concise to English speakers. 

link to article: http://www.sohu.com/a/51852246_357128

Here goes:
[First of all, beginners and entry-level players alike do not necessarily, at the their present level, have to learn this technique. Instead, beginners should first get used to how the bat is positioned in their hand. The addition of finger usage may confuse them and do more harm than good. 

In order to learn how to correctly use the fingers to produce force, we must first understand the principles involved when striking the ball. In every single stroke, from a mechanics point of view, there are 2 forces produced between the ball and bat: 1. normative force (perpendicular to the face of the bat), which produces a ball that is 'struck' or 'hit' 2. tangential force (parallel to the face of the bat), which produces friction and puts spin on the ball. Based on adjustments of the two, you are able to control the arc of the ball.

To those who use the Shakehand grip, the object that has most potential for application, is most nimble and simultaneously the most difficult to utilise is -  the index finger. Do you know the reason why people extend the index finger out onto the rubber? Many people would say 'to hold up the bat for support'. Those who tout this as the reason do not grasp the essence of using the index finger - that is, to produce force. In fact >95% of amateur shakehand players do not know how to use the index finger to properly enhance their stroke. They see the professionals do it, so they follow blindly and do the same. All these years of playing, the index finger has been sitting comfortably on the back of the bat like idle furniture taking up space (I admit, i was guilty of this). 

Alright, since we know that 2 kinds of forces are produced with each stroke, the 2 forces outlined depend on your swing in an orbital motion and the direction of the swing. If you keep this in mind, the concept will become more clear. The application of the index finger also follows the same idea - it assists in producing the normative and tangential forces. Nothing more, nothing less.

Our index finger lies on the back of the bat. If you want to produce the normative force, the index finger must apply pressure to the bat to assist in producing the normative force. If you want to produce the tangential force with lots of spin, it might be slightly more difficult to explain. The index finger still needs to apply pressure, that way the finger and the rubber form a sort of 'static friction' or 'stationary friction'. Utilising this 'static friction' to support the wrist. For every loop, the index finger must do this and is especially noticeable when looping underspin and counter-looping. This important step is what most people don't know about.  In reality, all strokes produce a mixture of tangential and normative forces.

So what about the other usage of other fingers? On top of my head I can think of 2 reasons: 1 . to stabilise the bat 2. to support the index finger.

The Thumb: the application for the thumb follows the same principles as the index finger, except in the opposite direction. (mainly used for the backhand, not used for the forehand). It can also provide some stabilisation by applying pressure to even out the pressure exerted by the index finger. When playing backhand the usage of the index finger drops to about 50%, while the usage of thumb doubles.

Middle Finger/Second knuckle: wraps around the handle, can help produce a portion of the normative force in your strokes and also increase acceleration when 'brushing' the ball. A lot of players have already grasped this concept.

Ring and Pinky finger: cannot produce any force. Their main purpose is to help stabilise the bat when you play.]

Well, there's that and I hope you found it interesting. xD  LOL









Thanks LDL. Very good post. This technique is also known by Timo Boll and Helmut Hampl.
I've also posted this on TTD, so please forgive for quoting myself from there.

Thanks a ton @Der_Echte who made me read your post.

Great topic.

I'm quite sure not many people have heard of this.

This technique is also well known by Timo Boll and Helmut Hampl, the Coach that made him big.

This actually came up last january but somehow got burried fast.

I think Carl was the only one who acknowledged the post to that time.
Actually all i did was repost and quote from a thread that was back from 2015. If i find it, i'll post the link here.

So here we go:

Originally posted by Baal;178574 Baal;178574 wrote:



Timo Boll keeps his forefinger really high when he returns serve and then slides it back down...




Actually it´s a technique his coach Helmut Hampl has taught him...



Originally posted by Baal;139178 Baal;139178 wrote:

When Timo pushes and returns serve, his forefinger seems higher up the blade than most other players. Has he always done that and is their an advantage to it and does he recommend that?

Also, what is the most common mistake he sees in serious amateur players? What is the best way to improve without training 6 hours per day?


Originally posted by MaLongPower;139336 MaLongPower;139336 wrote:

This an invention of the Trainer Helmut Hampl called "Druckpunkttechnik" (tl: pressure point technique).
It is a controversial technique even in DTTB. Patrik Franziska uses it too.





Originally posted by Suga D;139421 Suga D;139421 wrote:

@MaLongPower: Good One.
This is really interesting. I also hope Timo can elaborate on this.
I know a few players who have practiced under Helmut Hampl, like Christian Dreher, Jochen Kaiser, Philip Butterfass, Tobi Beck, Thomas Keinath or Arash Momeni, but none of them ever mentioned that term in front of me. Sounds like a well kept secret. ;)
I know the term 'Druckpunkttechnik' from Martial Arts and others, though. First time I hear this related to tabletennis.

Well anyway, here are my questions:

Firstly i'd like to ask Timo what he thinks would be necessary to uplift the image of tabletennis in europe away from a playground activity more to a professional sport.

2nd) since his Game is based so much on rotation, shouldn't on major events the best P-Balls available be used instead the ones from the company that sponsors/pays most?

Last question: if the top players were forced to use non boosted standard equipment does he think the world Ranking list would look different?

All the best, strength and health to him for the Olympic Games and the Future.
Thanks a lot for bringing us so many beautiful moments in tabletennis.


Originally posted by MaLongPower;139336 MaLongPower;139336 wrote:

This an invention of the Trainer Helmut Hampl called "Druckpunkttechnik" (tl: pressure point technique).
It is a controversial technique even in DTTB. Patrik Franziska uses it too.


Originally posted by MaLongPower;139531 MaLongPower;139531 wrote:

You can see the use clearly when Timo is receiving with the forehand. The indix finger is pointing upwards and is planted in the middle of the backhandrubber. This allows much more control while flicking and pushing. The downside is you need to adjust the grip afterwards.The grip in generel needs to be really lose and relaxed(racket pointing upwards in the starting position). Timo also has a special made thicker straight handle on his ALC which makes adjusting eazier.

Here is the reference form the book:Timo Boll My China
[ATTACH=CONFIG]9523[/ATTACH]


@Der_Echte: Thanks again
[Emoji2]

Edited by Suga D - 08/04/2017 at 7:32pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2017 at 7:56pm
Reminds me of the video that Emrat Thic posted.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2017 at 8:20pm
FWIW, the Zhuang Zedong is credited for the quote.

Quote 'an elementary student uses the arm, high school student uses the forearm, university student uses the wrist, phd student uses the fingers.'
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JacekGM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2017 at 8:32pm
I will take some risks here, just for the fun of it, why not...
Let's for a moment assume that different people may have comparatively different levels of functional prowess in different fingers in their playing hand. This seems to be a safe assumption to make... Here comes my personal experience: my FH shots are many levels of playing class better than my BH shots. I have been playing regularly more than two decades. Basically, without my FH I would be much, much less of an interesting opponent.Wink People in our leagues know it very well, unfortunately, and therefore I have to play my BH most of the time, or I have to blame my clumsy footwork... I have spent some time thinking about it and came to the conclusion that the power in my FH comes both from how I distribute body weight and how I feel the ball on the FH side. In general, I could comfortably play without the index finger because all the sensing, feel and power comes via the middle finger. Sometimes the index finger feels just out of place. The exception is when the ball is comfortably high and to the right, in such case I will pull the index finger up to support the blade additionally during the hit. 
Could well be, though, that this is just another physical imperfection of mine. I do know other players who have said similar things about how their index finger is sometimes in the way. 
I sincerely used the IMHO acronym in the post ridiculed by zeio...
zeio, you have access to powerful imaging techniques Thumbs Up ...

EDIT: After writing that from memory, I took a racket in hand and checked how it really is. Well, it is not just the middle finger, it is the three remaining fingers with the middle being the leader there... in my case.


Edited by JacekGM - 08/04/2017 at 9:53pm
(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Juic SBA (Fl, 94 g) with Nimbus Soft (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm Curl P1R on BH.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/05/2017 at 12:25am
I'm flattered.

Originally posted by JacekGM JacekGM wrote:

In general, I could comfortably play without the index finger because all the sensing, feel and power comes via the middle finger.

That actually makes sense as the 1st bending mode once excited would cause the entire handle to vibrate the strongest where the middle, ring and pinky fingers are. For the 1st torsional mode, which gets excited upon off-center shots, the thumb and index fingers would be where the vibration is strongest. Basically, the grip of the hand(palm and fingers) serves as damping adjustment - loose, tight, shallow and deep.

Similar discussion in mickd's thread.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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My thumb plays a bigger role with my grip adjustments.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JacekGM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/05/2017 at 12:41pm
Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

In my experience if you are able to hold the blade very lightly you can hit much better with more spin and power. ...
...

Yes, I agree with this.

(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Juic SBA (Fl, 94 g) with Nimbus Soft (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm Curl P1R on BH.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote berndt_mann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/05/2017 at 9:20pm
Originally posted by zeio zeio wrote:

FWIW, the Zhuang Zedong is credited for the quote.

Quote 'an elementary student uses the arm, high school student uses the forearm, university student uses the wrist, phd student uses the fingers.'

Yes.  I remember Lee Dal Joon telling me substantially the same thing when I was taking lessons from him back in 1970.

It should be borne in mind that Zhuang and Lee were classic penholders, but I would think that that advice would be apropos for an advanced shakehand player also.




Edited by berndt_mann - 08/05/2017 at 9:22pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/06/2017 at 2:35am
For me, the idea that the ring and pinky finger do not produce any power is not true. But maybe I just hold the bat differently or have bigger fingers.
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/06/2017 at 3:05pm



Can't find one for table tennis, but the principle is the same.

When one hits the ball, the racket moves and recoils.(Duh!) The forces exert on the hand in different amounts and places, as illustrated.

For FH shots that hit through the racket:

F2(middle/ring/pinky fingers) is strongest when hitting near the tip. The middle/ring/pinky fingers work together to provide a reaction force to prevent the racket from "jumping out" of the hand. Note that F2 is greater than F1. This implies the three fingers together actually exert more reaction force than the index finger.

F1(index finger) is strongest when hitting near the throat.

F1 and F2 are roughly the same in magnitude when hitting near the COP.

The opposite is true for BH shots. F1 would be where thumb is, and F2 would be in the palm.

For spin shots, the racket would also try to jump out of your hand in the plane of the blade head, like a frisbee.

In a nutshell, the higher your level, the more you hit near the tip on active shots.





Here you can see Matsudaira cocks up his index finger ~50ms before impact and extends it
upon(right before) and through impact to exert additional force on the racket through friction.







Edited by zeio - 08/06/2017 at 3:08pm
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slevin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/06/2017 at 4:58pm
was that a cum-face in that last GIF?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/06/2017 at 5:24pm
Originally posted by slevin slevin wrote:

was that a cum-face in that last GIF?

So lewd, so violent.

He has much to learn from the masters.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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This is a great thread, lots of zen!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Victor_the_cleaner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/06/2017 at 10:17pm
i use the finger all the time. Mostly to let opponent know he is hiding the ball. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LearnerDriverLicence Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/07/2017 at 6:21am
LOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLMAO 

Edited by LearnerDriverLicence - 08/07/2017 at 6:23am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LearnerDriverLicence Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/07/2017 at 6:22am
Originally posted by zeio zeio wrote:



Nice meme xD
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