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Improving serve and receive game |
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iamj8
Super Member Joined: 09/11/2009 Location: NZ Status: Offline Points: 429 |
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Posted: 10/28/2017 at 7:56am |
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While on the topic of service receive, does anyone have any tips on how to increase strength in the banana flick?
Tips in terms of both in-game (actual stroke) and out of game (exercises).
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Lightzy
Super Member Joined: 09/18/2017 Location: T-A Status: Offline Points: 345 |
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I bought a table just to practice serves on it. It's not that expensive either, no biggie.
Also for robot practice later on, but yeah.. |
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cole_ely
Premier Member Joined: 03/16/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6895 |
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I feel like the serve/receive game is the strongest part of my game and most agree. I've never had a good server to regularly practice against. I think it's just because I've played with serving so long that I know what to look for. I have an idea what you can do with each motion. I know that a high toss serve is easy to put top on, but takes a lot of skill to put backspin on and is unlikely at my level. Stuff like that.
maybe there's a bar or rec center or somewhere like that you can practice.
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Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b
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qpskfec
Silver Member Joined: 07/28/2011 Status: Offline Points: 516 |
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"Practicing serves at my club, for reasons mentioned above, just won't happen. That's just the way it works where I live. Even if I could find someone to practice with, the club owner and other members expect us to play a match when we get on the table. Just practicing serves would be frowned upon."
Is this a club where you pay to play? If two paying customers want to use their table time on drills, why is it the business of others? As long as everyone gets equal table time, nobody should care. I have never been a paying club customer and had the owner tell people what to do. If the club is crowded and there are people waiting, the owner will keep track of time and ask the players who have been playing the longest to stop after 15-20 min or so. btw, if you want a cheap diy solution for the basement, you can buy baltic birch plywood in 5' X 5' sheets. Cut 6 inches off an end and you have half a table. Put the halves on a 6 foot long folding table like the ones you can get at home depot. I did something like this when I was a kid. Works fine. |
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Tt Gold
Gold Member Joined: 10/22/2014 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 1302 |
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Swiff
Platinum Member Joined: 06/09/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2587 |
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It's tricky, to say the least.
Practicing serves at my club, for reasons mentioned above, just won't happen. That's just the way it works where I live. Even if I could find someone to practice with, the club owner and other members expect us to play a match when we get on the table. Just practicing serves would be frowned upon. I do agree with the general attitude "wherever there's a will, there's a way". Determination is everything. Maybe practicing at my club won't work. But I will buy a cheap table for the basement and just practice there. I'm not so poor I can't buy a cheap-o table.
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pgpg
Gold Member Joined: 11/18/2013 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1306 |
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I'm not sure if it counts as defending, but it's very useful to point out to some of advice givers that they have no idea what they are talking about: "get a key to the club", "find a practice partner", "get a table for yourself" does not work in most situations in the middle of TT desert areas, that is most of US. I suspect mjamja understands OP's situation much better than our esteemed TT gurus from Germany and elsewhere.
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Tt Gold
Gold Member Joined: 10/22/2014 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 1302 |
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Lightzy
Super Member Joined: 09/18/2017 Location: T-A Status: Offline Points: 345 |
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Buy one of those small cheap robots and have it serve you underspin ?
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smackman
Assistant Moderator Joined: 07/20/2009 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 3264 |
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Or just do copy and paste to make long threads
or copy the good servers and paste them with your new one's
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mjamja
Platinum Member Joined: 05/30/2009 Status: Offline Points: 2892 |
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I feel like I need to come to Swiff's defense. The situation in a lot of small clubs in the US is nothing like what exists in much of the world. The club has to beg for a few hours in some one else facilities. They often do not have enough members to financial compete with other groups for the space. Such limited playing time combined with a majority attitude of lets go have a little fun instead of lets work hard to get better means it is really hard to find practice partners. Put that together with the small membership in lots of clubs and it is even more difficult to find a reliable training partner. Currently there is only one player at my club that really wants to practice with me. Because of his schedule and club practices on table time and player rotation I get about 20 min with him once a week. Hard to do much serious training within those limits. I get some other players to drill with me in exchange for coaching them. But even then there is little real training time. Mark -A small time coach at a small time club
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Tt Gold
Gold Member Joined: 10/22/2014 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 1302 |
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Fulanodetal
Gold Member Joined: 06/28/2013 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1224 |
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"It's time to find another enthusiastic player in your club and start using your precious time for some serious practice...
Yes! You need a training buddy... " And when you do find one, treat him/her better than a wife.....wives come and go but a Table Tennis sparring partner is one in a million!!!! FdT
Edited by Fulanodetal - 10/25/2017 at 8:03pm |
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chu_bun
Silver Member Joined: 02/22/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 821 |
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Get two full sheet of plywoods, cut to correct size, put on top of a folding table, and you have something good enough for practice serves. Or simply buy a cheap TT table on craigslist probably won't cost more a sheet of Tenergy.
(Sorry didn't see your other post about purchasing a table) Edited by chu_bun - 10/25/2017 at 7:31pm |
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mjamja
Platinum Member Joined: 05/30/2009 Status: Offline Points: 2892 |
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Well come visit my club some time and watch the 1300 and 1400 plays tie me in knots with alternating deep pushes to the wide Fh, short drops that I can hardly reach, and flips which just seem to freeze me. Mark
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Tinykin
Platinum Member Joined: 10/30/2003 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 2332 |
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Nope. Unless it's topspin, after 2 games it should be so tight (consistently good) that all the 1400 receiver can do is push back meekly. Try it. |
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mjamja
Platinum Member Joined: 05/30/2009 Status: Offline Points: 2892 |
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I have to second the suggestion to try using a single serve for an entire match or even for an entire night of play. It is especially useful if you find yourself playing mostly weaker players. After 2 games of seeing exactly the same serve even a 1400 opponent can start returning like he is 2000+. The real test comes in the 5th game when you are down 9-10 to someone who has never beaten you before. Do you have the confidence and fortitude to serve that same serve you have been giving him all the match and face the strong return with your best 3rd ball effort? Once you can do it without a second thought you will know you own that serve. I half to admit that I do not always stick to the high road in those situations. But even when I don't it is an interesting test of my serving ability to suddenly pull off a completely different serve than I have been hitting all night. Good luck with your practice. Mark
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Swiff
Platinum Member Joined: 06/09/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2587 |
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Not arguing with this. I'm arguing with others telling me to come early/stay late so I can have my own table to practice serves on. I'm very simply trying to point out that it's not possible in my situation. That's all.
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lgxb
Super Member Joined: 09/10/2016 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 297 |
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You will need to explain more detail.
1. when you serve long heavy underspin, how do the 2300 opponent attack? Do they loop? If it's really low heavy underspin, it's really hard to loop. Even they loop, it will not be high quality so you can counter attack. And if you can serve fast with good placement, then it's even harder for them. So maybe your serve is not low enough, not fast enough. Even you think it's heavy underspin, maybe it's not enough. 2. if it's short serve, what do they do? banana flick? I doubt many 2300 players have high success rate with it against heavy short. |
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CraneStyle
Silver Member Joined: 08/06/2013 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 786 |
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Well, do you think your case is so unique..? It's time to find another enthusiastic player in your club and start using your precious time for some serious practice... Could be a man, woman or child, but you will both have an interest in seeing each other get better... Practice what you need to improve, don't just play games... Yes! You need a training buddy... |
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1. Mizutani Jun ZLC, FH T80, BH T05
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NextLevel
Forum Moderator Joined: 12/15/2011 Location: Somewhere Good Status: Offline Points: 14822 |
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I have learned over time that in the absence of watching the specific player who you are giving advice to, rarely does general advice hit the mark as most players are not as self aware as they think they are.
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I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
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koshkin
Silver Member Joined: 10/30/2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 522 |
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Placement and keeping the ball low are ultimately more important than outright spin.
Focus one one serve each game and try to move it around to hit specific spots. Ilya |
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Swiff
Platinum Member Joined: 06/09/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2587 |
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That's still not enough. I should be able to practice my serve while laying in bed watching TV without a paddle or ball just swinging my hand.
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lgxb
Super Member Joined: 09/10/2016 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 297 |
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actually you can practice your serve while sitting on a couch.
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Swiff
Platinum Member Joined: 06/09/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2587 |
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I'm 1800. The people at my club tell me my rating should be closer to 1900-1950, but I don't perform well in tournaments. This is good advice. I should practice serves in games.
I don't have any videos of myself playing, unfortunately. I could give more details about my play style. I'd classify myself as a pretty straight forward hitter. I'm a right handed player and shakehand. Fast and spinny rubber on both sides. My stroke is pretty textbook (I've been told) and my footwork is average, I guess. I often step around to my forehand for looping, although I loop from both sides. I play somewhat aggressively and attacking early. I can generally loop backspin to get into the point and continue hitting to finish it. My club mates recently told me that instead of developing my serve, I've focused on perfecting my 3rd ball to the serves I already have. They seemed optimistic about it.
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GMan4911
Silver Member Joined: 08/31/2012 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 830 |
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As a last resort, practice your serves during matches. Instead of mixing up your serves like normal, only serve one serve, focusing on quality and not so much on winning. The advantage of practicing serves this way is you get immediate feedback on whether the serve is good or not, something which you do not get when practicing serves alone. There were times when I needed to practice my reverse pendulum serve so I've played matches where every single serve was the RPS. Try it!
What is your level? Edited by GMan4911 - 10/24/2017 at 11:20am |
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bard romance
Gold Member Joined: 02/18/2016 Location: FL Status: Offline Points: 1181 |
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Hey man if you're trying to compete with players at the 2300+ level as you mentioned in your first post you're gonna need a table to practice your serves. The thing is, you may think you need deception in your serves to improve your game and this may not actually be the case. Simple but effective serves can go a long way. Do you have video or more details about your game? Just curious.
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ZingyDNA
Platinum Member Joined: 09/19/2008 Status: Offline Points: 2373 |
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Well, you need a table to practice your services. So you either use the club table or you find another table yourself. To use the club table you need to talk to your clubmates, either to let you use a table alone or, even better, to get someone else practice service/receive with you. You two can even serve from both ends of the table at the same time
If the above cannot happen, you either need to find a table that can do the above somewhere else, or, buy a table at home.
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Swiff
Platinum Member Joined: 06/09/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2587 |
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Please understand. This cannot happen. I'll try to explain in more detail.
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berndt_mann
Gold Member Joined: 02/02/2015 Location: Tucson, Arizona Status: Offline Points: 1719 |
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As I'm not a mind reader, I don't know how bad Swiff wants it, but I want it bad. Real bad. Bad ass bad. Three ball killer bad.
And now that I can't play D very well anymore, and don't have a lot of a life other than singing and playing old time lonesome country music with my good buddies Ron Riggs and Rick Garcia, I'm just about prepared to spent the rest of my day practicing underspin/sidespin ghost serves that'll bounce back over the net and into my generously comfortable Starter shorts. I'm even willing, and I never thought I'd be writing this, to try out, now that my cash flow has been ebbed, some of that there Grandson of Tenergy on my bh and Hurricane Neo Rank Amateur on my fh. Plus a liberal soaking of whatever booster the pros are using these days. Legality. Who cares about legality? Nobody but me in southwest Tucson knows anything about tt serve legality. I may have to wait till Gordy and the USATT decide to have an O-85 event, but if singing, playing my digital electronic keyboard and service practice don't kill me with my new illegal boosted unreturnable serve (don't know of any 85 year olds with a decent banana flick) I should be ready to not only be the O-85 National Champ but also take home the gold at the 2027 World Vets' in Novosibirsk.
Edited by berndt_mann - 10/23/2017 at 10:39pm |
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bmann1942
Setup: Mark Bellamy Master Craftsman blade, British Leyland hard rubber |
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