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The birth of modern table tennis?

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berndt_mann View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote berndt_mann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/13/2017 at 8:52pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

Actually I was just about to post this amazing video of WTTC from 1961 and 1963.  This was the state of the art of Chinese play (and world play) just before the Cultural Revolution when Chinese players disappeared from the world scene for awhile.

Fast play, great fishing, and the amazing lost art of hitting with a traditional penhold backhand.  When I was first coming up as a teenager one of my practice partners played in this style.  I am still amazed that they didn't get horrific tennis elbow problems, but apparently they didn't.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_ZLIBdIZ9c


Championship level table tennis from Zhuang Zedong and I presume Li Furong.  Makes you wonder why today's wonders need all the crap they need in order to stay competitive and win championships. 

Well, everybody's got to go sooner or later.  There was Chuang, then Hasegawa and Ito, then the one color magicians, then the Hungarian speed gluers, and so forth and so on. 

Good video.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/13/2017 at 8:56pm
Every question I would ever think of are already on the list. 
Good job!!!

Perhaps just send him greetings from us!! And a big thank you!!

ClapClap


FdT
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richrf View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/13/2017 at 9:02pm
Originally posted by Fulanodetal Fulanodetal wrote:

Every question I would ever think of are already on the list. 
Good job!!!

Perhaps just send him greetings from us!! And a big thank you!!

ClapClap


FdT


Thanks Fulanodetal. I certainly will convey our appreciation. His wife and business partner Angie Bengtsson has already indicated that they are very interested in this project. I actually hope that this may be the start of an even larger project to document the legend of table table history and their contributions.

Can't wait to hear what Coach Bengtsson has to say!

Edited by richrf - 11/13/2017 at 9:03pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/14/2017 at 2:23pm
regarding questions to Stellan, might want to ask him so many.  A simple one would be, how did you train coming up and did you feel like you were playing in a new way and who influenced you or coached you?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/14/2017 at 2:45pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

regarding questions to Stellan, might want to ask him so many.  A simple one would be, how did you train coming up and did you feel like you were playing in a new way and who influenced you or coached you?



Thanks Baal. I forwarded your question as the basic question that we would appreciate answering. I than added my own set and suggested that Coach Bengtsson and Angie Bengtsson can answer any they had time for our skip them all. Hopefully this works and doesn't impinge in their time since I know they are busy. I'm pretty excited since for the last 40 years I've been wondering. ☺
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/14/2017 at 3:28pm
I can't wait to hear what he has to say.  He is pretty humble.  It is not easy to get him to talk about his accomplishments.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote zzzuppp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/14/2017 at 7:27pm
This is my sort of thread!

I have a couple of questions for Stellan - 
1) Please talk freely about Ichiro Ogimura, his importance in your life and his greatness as a table tennis player, coach and administrator.
2) How's your record collection these days? Wink

Meanwhile, just before I found this thread, I discovered this video on a Swedish Film Archive, so I've uploaded it to YouTube. Footage of Stellan, Hasse Alser, Kjell Johansson, (and Birgitta Radberg, Eberhard Scholer, Jonyer...) including some training:-

(Can't get it to embed properly, but here's the link:)





Edited by zzzuppp - 11/14/2017 at 7:49pm
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richrf View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/14/2017 at 8:12pm
Originally posted by zzzuppp zzzuppp wrote:

This is my sort of thread!

I have a couple of questions for Stellan - 
1) Please talk freely about Ichiro Ogimura, his importance in your life and his greatness as a table tennis player, coach and administrator.
2) How's your record collection these days? Wink

Meanwhile, just before I found this thread, I discovered this video on a Swedish Film Archive, so I've uploaded it to YouTube. Footage of Stellan, Hasse Alser, Kjell Johansson, (and Birgitta Radberg, Eberhard Scholer, Jonyer...) including some training:-

(Can't get it to embed properly, but here's the link:)





Absolutely amazing video. SO much enjoyed it! Thank you!!

Please spread the word around to other TT forums that you might visit with a link to this thread. Who knows what other fantastic videos that others may uncover.

Sorry. I already sent the questions to Coach Bengtsson but I'm keeping my fingers crossed that we have have further opportunities.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/14/2017 at 11:56pm
Wow. I lived in Sweden just before that (until 71). It made me incredibly nostalgic! I was one of those little kids.

Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


(also footage of Olof Palme).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote king_pong Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/15/2017 at 12:15am
Originally posted by richrf richrf wrote:

Hi everyone,

I prepared a preliminary set of questions fir Coach Bengtsson. How do they sound to you? We can add, subtract and edit. I suspect he may not be able to answer all of our questions, so I'll leave it up to him to pick and choose. Feedback?

1) You won the singles at the World Table Tennis Championships 1971, 3 World championships, 7 European championships and 65 International championships. Your contribution to the world of table tennis was immortalized when a bronze statue of the legendary Swede was raised in his hometown, Falkenberg, in 2006. What were the circumstances that inspired you to become a professional table tennis playeru are doing today to help develop future great table tennis players?


Don't forget Stellan's 13 Swedish Men's Singles Championships -- a feat not matched even by the great Waldner (who ONLY has 10). That is extremely an impressive record for the small ping-pong nation, not likely to be equaled any time in this generation.
Donic Waldner (FL): fh/bh - Yasaka Mark V HPS
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Magic_M Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/15/2017 at 1:24am
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

regarding questions to Stellan, might want to ask him so many.  A simple one would be, how did you train coming up and did you feel like you were playing in a new way and who influenced you or coached you?
I am sure, Ogimura was the person who influenced him and his kind of playing mostly.
Originally posted by Magic_M Magic_M wrote:

In the age of 16 he had the chance to go to Japan for three months. There he had some personal training with Ichiro Ogimura, who won twelve world champion titles in the 50`s and 60`s (later he became ITTF-president). This was a very important experience for him, because he learnt a lot from Ogimura ("I often think of him - he has changed my life").

Originally posted by Fulanodetal Fulanodetal wrote:

Every question I would ever think of are already on the list. 
Yes, it is already a wonderful list of possible questions. I hope, you guys understand, that I personally would ask him 2 more questions. Wink
  1. Do you still have the first Stiga Anniversary blade with the number A1, which you got during the world championship in 1985? And would you like to add this blade to this collection (http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=69217&PN=2&title=i-am-proud-to-present) ? Big smile
  2. Do you know any other Stellan Bengtsson blade which is missing in my collection?
It would be wonderful, if Stellan Bengtsson would answer to all these questions and someone could post the answers here.

By the way: wonderful videos. Clap This is a 5-star thread for sure. Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/15/2017 at 7:09am
Hi all,

Yesterday, I forwarded some questions to his wife Angie. Hopefully he finds some time to respond to the key question concerning the development of his style. I'll post anyb response when I get it. I also have Angie the link to this thread for their review.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zzzuppp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/21/2017 at 3:08pm
Interview with Stellan Bengtsson from Denis' TTWorld, 2011 (I asked a few of these questions Wink)

(By the way, I have 2 or 3 more Bengtsson Interviews from different stages of his career if anyone's interested)

DTTW: What is a good story or memory of Ogimura?

SB: I think of Ogimura every day. He changed my life.  Both as a player and as a person. I still have all of his advice very clear in my brain. He was way ahead of his time.  After I won the worlds he wrote a book about my game. I just found out about it a few years ago. 

 

 

 

DTTW: What was your mood before the 1971 Worlds began?  Did you think you could win?

SB: We thought we would have a good chance in the team event. Als'er, Johansson, and myself were all top 10 in the world ranking. We lost to China 3-5 after Liang Geliang made his debut with long pips. Before The worlds I had not thought too much about it. Mind you I had never won an open championship. I kind of grew into the tournament. After two matches I faced the best Chinese player Li Ching Quang who took three matches in the semis against us. I was down 8-15 and 11-16 in the fifth. I came back to win 21-19. After that I got confident, specially at the end of the games. My coach Christer Johansson made sure I was not happy after every match. A very pepping note from Ogimura before the final made me feel great. When you look at the clip from after the match I looked shocked.  The focus was total.

 

 

 

DTTW:  Which players did you least like to play against? Gomozkov perhaps?

SB:  I did not like to play Eberhart Scholer the German defensive player. My record with him was no good.  He was a great player reaching the Worlds semis 63,65,67 and final in 69 in which he was very close to winning. Apart from him it was more up to me to play my best. When you play the best in the world all of them are very good. I played every men's singles WC from 1961-1993. I beat all of them except Jiang Jialiang. None of them were WC when I played them but I have faced some great players in my career. 

 

 

 

DTTW: What were your strengths and weaknesses as a player when you were playing at the highest level?

SB: When I played my best I was very fast on my feet and gave my opponent very little time. Serve and 3rd ball attack won me a lot of points. My return of serve was also ok so I was good at the four cornerstones. When I was playing well my weaknesses were minor but my patience with defenders early in my career and wide hard balls to my forehand did give me problems. 

 

 

 

DTTW:  If you were 16 again today, how would you develop your game differently to get to the top?

SB: The game is so different today so I have to make changes. You have to have a strong backhand roll/loop. The game to 11 would fit my style. I wish they would have changed the color/show the serve contact rules when I was playing. 

 

 

 

DTTW: I believe that you used short pimple rubber on your backhand some time in your career? If so, why? Would you recommend it today?

 

SB: I started with short pips in '79 after Hungary became team WC. I did not have a strong backhand topspin so pips was a good choice.  I used it to change the depth of the ball to set up my forehand. For me at the time the change was very good and I had great results playing pips. Now with the 40mm ball I would not recommend it for a male player.

 


DTTW: Your old team-mate Kjell Johannsen was famous for his 'hammer' forehand.  For those of us who never saw him, how did he do it?  Was it a flat kill? Are you still in touch with him, if so what is he doing nowadays?

SB: Kjell had a great forehand smash. It was flat and very fast and hard. His elbow was in front of him at impact and he had a good body turn. He could hit it with a short backswing which meant it was hard to detect. We don't have so much contact these days but we are good friends. He lives in Sweden. He has had serious physical problems with his back and knees.

 

 

DTTW:  Describe your memories of the world semi v. Cai Zhenhua in 1981. Could you have won if Cai wasn't using a disguised bat/stamping on service etc?

SB: My match with Cai in '81 was a great battle. I had won against him in the Swedish Open, 3-2 21-19 in the fifth and in the team event in '81 so I knew how to play him.  He was very aggressive the first two sets and won easily. I fought back to win the third and fourth AND was winning 10-4 in the fifth when he changed some things. He made a great comeback and won. I sometimes think of that match today, a tough loss.

 

 

DTTW: In your opinion what is the level of imagination and genius in today's table tennis compared with past decades?  Do you agree with Waldner that table tennis is becoming more robotic due to the 40mm ball and other rule changes?

SB: The game today is even more physical and is going towards tennis. More power and less finesse. I agree with JO to some degree even if I can enjoy some of todays game/players. The game has become more 'simple'. 

 

 

DTTW:  Are you in favor of additional rule changes and if so what would you like to see?

SB: I think we need a better service rule. Now the rule is very 'grey' and the umpires are not calling most of the fault serves. MANY players are hiding the ball and are challenging the umpires often at the end of the sets. The rumor of the plastic ball makes me worried. We played some tournaments with a plastic ball and that was awful.

 

 

DTTW: When, if ever, did you start using speed glue, and in your opinion who was the first to use it?

SB: I started speed glue sometime in the beginning of 1980. Tibor Klampar was the first one using it, that is a fact.

 

 

DTTW: Why isn't Sweden as powerful as it used to be? It was quite a powerhouse during the Bengtsson era, even more so in the Waldner era.  What went wrong?

SB: This issue makes me very angry. The wrong people at very important positions for many years has been very bad.  Neglected youth education has changed our system. Shame, now it is a long way up again.

 

 

DTTW: Which of your contemporaries did you particularly admire during your playing career?

SB: As a kid my idols were Ogimura and Chuang Tse Tung. I had the pleasure to be coached by Ogi and to play Chuang. Gou Yao Hua was an awesome player. When he did his last Worlds he wanted to change shirts and spare racket. That was a thrill...

 

 

 

DTTW: Were the loops of players like Surbek, Jonyer and Klampar more powerful than the loopers of today?

SB: It is always hard to compare players from different eras but with today's rackets those players would hit some great loops that is for sure. 

 

 

 

DTTW: Who had the best serves you faced? (Hsu Shaofa maybe?)

SB: Hsu Shaofa had a great serve. Guo  Hoa Hua, Li Ching Quang, Waldner and He Zhe Wen all had fantastic serves. To read their serves, no wonder I needed glasses later in my life ha ha.

 

 

 

DTTW: Who was the best lobber you faced? (Alser, Hasegawa, Surbek, Secretin?)

SB: It is hard to name one lobber. Their style fit my game pretty good but you sure needed patience to get through them. Appelgren, Alse'r, Hasegawa, Secretin, and Johansson sure could bring back some balls.

 

 

 

DTTW: You are still active in the table tennis community. What would you say is the highlight of your career as a coach thus far?

SB: The highlight of my coaching career was the WC in Chiba in '91. Sweden won all three men titles. I had the pleasure to coach JP in all his matches on the way to the final to play JO.  I had many great coaching moments but that was the best. Also to have followed some players from young age up to the world level has been fun.

 

 

DTTW: How has working with Angie changed your approach to coaching?

SB: Angie and I are blessed that we can work together. I don't think that has changed my coaching. 

 

 

 

DTTW:  Do you adapt your coaching of technique to suit the student or is there one 'best' way for each stroke that you teach?  If you do adapt it could you give us one or two examples of how?

SB: I always put the player in center of my coaching. I have to look at physical ability/eye hand coordination/movements/touch etc. It also depends of his style of play/age/rubber/racket how I coach them.  There are some basics that are important. My task is to bring out the best in every player. I also have to find the player's natural talent and reinforce that.  I coach a very good six year old boy. For him I have to give him a good form that fits his body. I am also working a lot on his footwork to give him a solid ground to play on. He can already do 150 balls at Falkenberger without missing...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/21/2017 at 3:23pm
@zzzuppp Absolutely wonderful!! Thanks!!!

Maybe we can dig up other interviews of other great players during that time? This one was fantastic and pretty much answered all questions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/21/2017 at 7:21pm
Zzzzupp. Awesome. Post more! So many answers to our questions. A thousand thanks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ohwell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/21/2017 at 8:10pm
Wow! Great read! Keep those coming!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zzzuppp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 hours 5 minutes ago at 5:55am
OK, here's another one, an interview from TTTopics, 1986, in two parts. 
Shame they can't spell his surname - makes a change from 'Bengsston' anyway, which is what you usually get. 
As ever, he comes across as very modest, shrewd - and with a sense of humour.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 hours 38 minutes ago at 9:22am
Originally posted by zzzuppp zzzuppp wrote:

OK, here's another one, an interview from TTTopics, 1986, in two parts. 
Shame they can't spell his surname - makes a change from 'Bengsston' anyway, which is what you usually get. 
As ever, he comes across as very modest, shrewd - and with a sense of humour.




Marvelous! Thank you very much!
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