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Deceptive Serve!!

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Fulanodetal View Drop Down
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    Posted: 02/05/2018 at 12:49pm
OK, I will ask the million dollar question since no one here has asked.....


What is your favorite deceptive serve to use and how does it work?
How effective is it?


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Fulanodetal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 12:51pm
I might have to add....LEGAL deceptive serve.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 1:08pm
Half long inside out serve with a lot of corkscrew spin on it.  By varying the contact a little, I can get it to bounce in different ways.  People who do not play me a lot tend to misjudge the bounce, so I just move more or less the same serve around the table until they figure it out.

The problem is that better players quickly figure out that this serve is heavy, so they just gently guide the ball back and make me deal with my own spin.  That's when I switch to simple short serves.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wilkinru Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 1:40pm
Honestly? The no spin/light backspin serve after establishing I have a heavy backspin serve.


Edited by wilkinru - 02/05/2018 at 1:41pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote igorponger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 5:12pm
    



What is the trick? The server seems to use cork-screw rotation on the ball and no-spin alternately?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GMan4911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 5:45pm
Originally posted by igorponger igorponger wrote:

    
What is the trick? The server seems to use cork-screw rotation on the ball and no-spin alternately?
Not being able to see the spin put on the ball makes the serve illegal, not deceptive.  


Edited by GMan4911 - 02/05/2018 at 5:46pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 5:52pm
crazy!

Although I think Yoshimura is hiding the ball contact a bit too much.
Thanks for sharing!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocketman222 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 6:07pm
My all time favorite goto serve is the long dead ball in to the elbow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hunkeelin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 6:21pm
Originally posted by Fulanodetal Fulanodetal wrote:

I might have to add....LEGAL deceptive serve.


FdT

Bro, you gotta stop this legal serve not legal serve thing. learning how to serve borderline legal serves is a skill every professional need to learn if they want to advance. If the umpire didn't call it, it's legal period. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 6:22pm
"Half long inside out serve with a lot of corkscrew spin on it.  By varying the contact a little, I can get it to bounce in different ways.  People who do not play me a lot tend to misjudge the bounce, so I just move more or less the same serve around the table until they figure it out.

The problem is that better players quickly figure out that this serve is heavy, so they just gently guide the ball back and make me deal with my own spin.  That's when I switch to simple short serves."

Thank you Ilya. I have been experimenting with putting corkscrew spin on my serves. However, not with the inside out serve motion though. But you do bring the point that advanced players will catch on pretty quickly. Which is why is good to have several good  (legal) deceptive serves. I indeed have had trouble with a very good player attacking my serves, even if short and low!!

I'll look into this inside out option. Thank you!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 7:05pm
Originally posted by wilkinru wilkinru wrote:

Honestly? The no spin/light backspin serve after establishing I have a heavy backspin serve.

This, because they pop it up for the easy 3rd ball.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fatt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/05/2018 at 7:39pm
The fast long corner to corner slight underspin makes people drive it into the net because they see a fast dead ball. Varying with the same motion putting slight top drives a lot of people crazy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote balldance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/06/2018 at 2:27am
Originally posted by fatt fatt wrote:

The fast long corner to corner slight underspin makes people drive it into the net because they see a fast dead ball. Varying with the same motion putting slight top drives a lot of people crazy.

This is my nightmare... the serve is fast to bh and i have little time to figure out the spin. I often have no answer for these serves, especially when two serves (underspin and topspin) look too similar. Sometimes people also hide the contact, it's the worst nightmare.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/06/2018 at 9:50am
I will share one of my favorites.

I believe I've seen He Zi Wen doing it and I know Mizutani uses it. Perhaps Ma Lin too.

You start by tossing the ball really high.(this is in fact the hardest part of the serve lol!)Sometimes I hit the light fixtures, oh well.

Before ball contact you swing the racket as in a regular pendulum motion. At the time of ball contact, the racket should be travelling at almost no speed! You let the ball hit the racket. No Brushing!! Racket open. After contact you fake racket motion to insinuate backspin. The idea is to make your opponent think there's some backspin on the ball, when in fact there's a little bit of topspin!! If the ruse has worked, the ball will either go too long, or it will be an easy kill!! Careful, this works only a few times.


FdT



Edited by Fulanodetal - 02/06/2018 at 9:51am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nachalnik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/06/2018 at 11:29pm
What's interesting is that Joo plays with LPs so, theoretically, he shouldn't be bettered much by any serve. Go figure...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote alphapong Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/07/2018 at 1:39am
Originally posted by nachalnik nachalnik wrote:

What's interesting is that Joo plays with LPs so, theoretically, he shouldn't be bettered much by any serve. Go figure...

I think you are overestimating what longpips can accomplish. They are helpful if you misjudge things a little. However, if you completely misread the serve you are still going to have problems. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/07/2018 at 2:31am
After doing a lot of cork, I go to a short forehand pure side with no top or back. The opponent usually nets it back lime a dead ball.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote man_iii Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/07/2018 at 3:38am
The most simple serves with deception is enough to fool most players. Variation between heavy spin and light spin messes it up pretty good.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote el luchador Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/07/2018 at 6:49pm


Edited by el luchador - 02/07/2018 at 6:50pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bbkon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/07/2018 at 8:52pm
Originally posted by igorponger igorponger wrote:

     



What is the trick? The server seems to use cork-screw rotation on the ball and no-spin alternately?


reverse corkscrew
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfolsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/07/2018 at 9:03pm
Originally posted by bbkon bbkon wrote:

Originally posted by igorponger igorponger wrote:

     



What is the trick? The server seems to use cork-screw rotation on the ball and no-spin alternately?


reverse corkscrew


There is also having a somewhat unique serve motion that can be either top or bottom and hiding the contact with your head.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote igorponger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/08/2018 at 7:12am


JAPAN SERVING TRICKS.   JAPAN TOKYO NATIONAL OLYMPIC ACADEMY.

Great manual dexterirty.
You're getting a true illusion of topspin on the ball, and you getting backspin in reality..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bbkon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/08/2018 at 11:45am
Originally posted by jfolsen jfolsen wrote:

Originally posted by bbkon bbkon wrote:

Originally posted by igorponger igorponger wrote:

     



What is the trick? The server seems to use cork-screw rotation on the ball and no-spin alternately?


reverse corkscrew


There is also having a somewhat unique serve motion that can be either top or bottom and hiding the contact with your head.


the master of serve deception is liu guoliang, waldner samsonov gatien roskopf.. failed to return liu s serves as many 5 in a row
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