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FITeT: Cheaters No Passaran !!

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andras View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote andras Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/15/2018 at 3:32pm
exactly my provocation wanted to get to this.
The first ones who should claim an effective test are regular LP players 
so they can not be attacked on their rubber.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Egghead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/15/2018 at 4:19pm
Originally posted by LUCKYLOOP LUCKYLOOP wrote:

You guys are making a mountain out of a mole hill, there are only a few Frictionless long lips players. I play with long pips, don't like the feel of frictionless, too limiting.
May be in your club only LOL
You need to change your style if you want to play with frictionless or treated LPs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LUCKYLOOP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/15/2018 at 4:27pm
Originally posted by Egghead Egghead wrote:

Originally posted by LUCKYLOOP LUCKYLOOP wrote:

You guys are making a mountain out of a mole hill, there are only a few Frictionless long lips players. I play with long pips, don't like the feel of frictionless, too limiting.

May be in your club only LOL
You need to change your style if you want to play with frictionless or treated LPs.


I welcome the challenge, my friction pips vs them, let the games begin.

Edited by LUCKYLOOP - 04/16/2018 at 12:14am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pushblocker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 7:55am
Originally posted by Tassie52 Tassie52 wrote:

Note:  I am not necessarily disagreeing with Pushblocker's distinction between Rules and Regulations and the absence from the Laws of the Game of any reference to change in playing charaacteristics over the course of time.  However,
Originally posted by Pushblocker Pushblocker wrote:

Rules are written in the English language and the sentence of that rule is clear and not ambiguous. It says what it says and not what someone would want it to say.
The clarity of the sentence is not as unambiguous as Pushblocker would have us believe as he himself is failing to state its meaning.  In an earlier post (and consistently throughout) he claimed:

Originally posted by Pushblocker Pushblocker wrote:

Applicable rules:

2.04.07.01 Slight deviations from continuity of surface or uniformity of colour due to accidental damage or wear may be allowed provided that they do not significantly change the characteristics of the surface.


The word "they" clearly refers to deviations of continuity..Therefore, the 2nd part of the phrase only applies if there ARE deviations.. If there are no deviations, the part regarding playing characteristics does not even come into play.. If you don't believe me, ask a professor of the english language. THEY clearly refers to the damage.. If it does not refer to damage, what does it refer to??


There are two sets of conditions linked by the conjunction "or" in Rule 2.04.07.01:
1.  There are two kinds of slight deviation: continuity of surface, uniformity of colour
2.  There are two kinds of cause for deviation: accidental damage, wear.

"They" refers to both kinds of slight deviation - either deviation in continuity of surface or deviation in uniformity of colour.  Pushblocker only states the first of these, when in fact either can be a factor for disqualifying a rubber.

Plus, "they" refers not only to damage.  It also refers to wear.  So there are in fact four sets of circumstances under which a rubber might be disqualified:
1.  Deviation in continuity of surface caused by damage
2.  Deviation in uniformity of colour caused by damage
3.  Deviation in continuity of surface caused by wear
4.  Deviation in uniformity of colour caused by wear.


I don't disagree..   If a rubber that is worn does not have deviations of any kind and looks uniform, it does not meet the criteria. If I rubber shows no deviations in continuity or color (colour as the british write), this does not apply.. That's the point I have been making in 10+ posts in this thread. If the wear is uniform across the rubber, it is not illegal under the current rules. As I said before, I had several legal professional look at the wording of the rules and all came to the same conclusion.
IF THE SURFACE AND COLOR OF THE RUBBER IS UNIFORM, this rule does not apply. If there are deviations, it can be disallowed.

Deviations in color means that there are certain spots that are darker or lighter than the rest..

Deviations in uniformity means that there are spots with more grip than others.. It could also mean that the wear caused inconsistent spacing between pips etc... Anything that would make the rubber no longer uniform. If a rubber looks just like a new one with uniform wear across it's surface, the rule does not apply.



Edited by Pushblocker - 04/16/2018 at 8:00am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bbkon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 10:09am
Originally posted by Pushblocker Pushblocker wrote:

Originally posted by Tassie52 Tassie52 wrote:

Note:  I am not necessarily disagreeing with Pushblocker's distinction between Rules and Regulations and the absence from the Laws of the Game of any reference to change in playing charaacteristics over the course of time.  However,
Originally posted by Pushblocker Pushblocker wrote:

Rules are written in the English language and the sentence of that rule is clear and not ambiguous. It says what it says and not what someone would want it to say.
The clarity of the sentence is not as unambiguous as Pushblocker would have us believe as he himself is failing to state its meaning.  In an earlier post (and consistently throughout) he claimed:

Originally posted by Pushblocker Pushblocker wrote:

Applicable rules:

<div style="margin: 0px 5px 10px; padding: 5px; border-color: rgb169, 184, 194; border-width: 0px 1px 1px; border-style: solid; font-size: 13px; line-height: 1.4em; font-family: "lucida grande", "trebuchet ms", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; : rgb250, 250, 250; color: rgb75, 92, 119;">2.04.07.01 Slight
deviations from continuity of surface or uniformity of colour due to
accidental damage or wear may be allowed provided that they do not significantly change the characteristics of the surface.
<br style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; color: rgb75, 92, 119; font-family: "lucida grande", "trebuchet ms", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px;"><br style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; color: rgb75, 92, 119; font-family: "lucida grande", "trebuchet ms", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: rgb75, 92, 119; font-family: "lucida grande", "trebuchet ms", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; : rgb250, 250, 250;">The
word "they" clearly refers to deviations of continuity..Therefore, the
2nd part of the phrase only applies if there ARE deviations.. If there
are no deviations, the part regarding playing characteristics does not
even come into play.. If you don't believe me, ask a professor of the
english language. THEY clearly refers to the damage.. If it does not
refer to damage, what does it refer to??</span>


There are two sets of conditions linked by the conjunction "or" in Rule 2.04.07.01:
1.  There are two kinds of slight deviation: continuity of surface, uniformity of colour
2.  There are two kinds of cause for deviation: accidental damage, wear.

"They" refers to both kinds of slight deviation - either deviation in continuity of surface or deviation in uniformity of colour.  Pushblocker only states the first of these, when in fact either can be a factor for disqualifying a rubber.

Plus, "they" refers not only to damage.  It also refers to wear.  So there are in fact four sets of circumstances under which a rubber might be disqualified:
1.  Deviation in continuity of surface caused by damage
2.  Deviation in uniformity of colour caused by damage
3.  Deviation in continuity of surface caused by wear
4.  Deviation in uniformity of colour caused by wear.



I don't disagree..   If a rubber that is worn does not have deviations of any kind and looks uniform, it does not meet the criteria. If I rubber shows no deviations in continuity or color (colour as the british write), this does not apply.. That's the point I have been making in 10+ posts in this thread. If the wear is uniform across the rubber, it is not illegal under the current rules. As I said before, I had several legal professional look at the wording of the rules and all came to the same conclusion.
IF THE SURFACE AND COLOR OF THE RUBBER IS UNIFORM, this rule does not apply. If there are deviations, it can be disallowed.

Deviations in color means that there are certain spots that are darker or lighter than the rest..

Deviations in uniformity means that there are spots with more grip than others.. It could also mean that the wear caused inconsistent spacing between pips etc... Anything that would make the rubber no longer uniform. If a rubber looks just like a new one with uniform wear across it's surface, the rule does not apply.








manika batra pips are not straight and they re dirty its obvious she cant get new one that pkay like the old pip they look altered
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Egghead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 1:50pm
Originally posted by bbkon bbkon wrote:

 

manika batra pips are not straight and they re dirty its obvious she cant get new one that pkay like the old pip they look altered
Don't mind him, he just tried to channel the debate into "rubber uniformity and consistency" Dead

Players can play with dirty and wear off LPs as long as the deviations do not significantly change the characteristics of the surface Wink




Edited by Egghead - 04/17/2018 at 11:08am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pushblocker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 3:05pm
Originally posted by bbkon bbkon wrote:

 

manika batra pips are not straight and they re dirty its obvious she cant get new one that pkay like the old pip they look altered
Her pips are clearly not uniform and therefore they can be disallowed.. Not arguing that point..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pushblocker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 3:10pm
Do those pips look uniform or not?


 




Edited by Pushblocker - 04/16/2018 at 3:16pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LUCKYLOOP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 4:11pm

Those long pips look normal and uniform to me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Egghead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 4:33pm
Pushblocker, you want to cheat; no one will stop you, and no one will mind as well; just you shall act like those boosters. May be you have a bad camera, the rubber at the stamp area and the pip heads at the edge are not uniformity.

The bottom line is that we are discussing the test tool and how to apply it here, not the prerequisites. With that, I believe we all assume either one of rules will apply already.


Edited by Egghead - 04/16/2018 at 9:37pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LUCKYLOOP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 6:52pm
Edge area, it is very difficult to cut long pips to make it look picture perfect, all mine look like that, some better some worse. Plus you get dings there too.

Edited by LUCKYLOOP - 04/16/2018 at 7:06pm
Hntr Fl / 4H & BH Xiom Sigma Pro 2 2.0
Yinhe T-2 / 4H Xiom Sig Pro 2 2.0 BH Xiom Omega IV Elite Max
Gam DC / 4H DHS Hurricane 8 39deg 2.1 BH GD CC LP OX
HARDBAT / Hock 3 ply / Frenshp Dr Evil OX
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Egghead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 7:19pm
Originally posted by LUCKYLOOP LUCKYLOOP wrote:

Edge area, it is very difficult to cut long pips to make it look picture perfect, all mine look like that, some better some worse. Plus you get dings there too.
I rest my case  Wink


Edited by Egghead - 04/16/2018 at 7:23pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pushblocker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/16/2018 at 11:07pm
Originally posted by Egghead Egghead wrote:

Pushblocker, you want to cheat; no one will stop you, and no one will mind as well; just you shall act like those boosters. May be you have a bad camera, the rubber at the stamp area and the pip heads at the edge are not uniformity.

The bottom line is that we are discussing the test tool and how to apply it here, not the prerequisites. With that, I believe we all assume either one of rules will apply already.



That is the shade of my hand that makes part of the logo area look darker..

Edited by Pushblocker - 04/16/2018 at 11:08pm
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Dr. Neubauer Firewall Plus Blade with DHS G666 1.5mm on forehand Giant Dragon Talon OX with removed glue sheet on backhand
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