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Have you switched to ABS ball ?
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mykonos96 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 10/09/2018 at 12:11am
Originally posted by vanjr vanjr wrote:

Originally posted by qpskfec qpskfec wrote:

Originally posted by BH-Man BH-Man wrote:

I call players who want to play ONLY with Nittaku 3* and NOTHING else NBS... Nittaku Ball Snobs.

Sure, the Nittaku Premium 40 is a great ball, I would be fine playing a match using one (as long as it isn't all used and smooth-shiny), but there are other true bouncing balls too.


A few weeks ago after hitting with my regular practice partner, a ball snob asked to hit with me.

I was using an almost new DHS D40+ and the player insisted on switching to Nittaku. Out comes an old, shiny grey ball, with almost all the lettering worn off. I was like ..... wtf? If you are going to be a ball snob, don't whip out a sh..ty one.



So did you hit with the old nittaku? I prefer any new or nearly new plastic ball over old bald balls. I would have said no.


An old and worn off nittaku is crap worse than other old balls
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Not from US, but it ships worldwide

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Bonus-Pack-10-Balls-Box-Newest-DHS-3-Star-D40-Table-Tennis-Balls-New-Material-Plastic/1019735_32802682381.html?spm=2114.12010612.8148356.2.57e84cf6I0Loa5


Edited by Simas - 10/08/2018 at 7:23am
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Originally posted by qpskfec qpskfec wrote:

Originally posted by BH-Man BH-Man wrote:

I call players who want to play ONLY with Nittaku 3* and NOTHING else NBS... Nittaku Ball Snobs.

Sure, the Nittaku Premium 40 is a great ball, I would be fine playing a match using one (as long as it isn't all used and smooth-shiny), but there are other true bouncing balls too.


A few weeks ago after hitting with my regular practice partner, a ball snob asked to hit with me.

I was using an almost new DHS D40+ and the player insisted on switching to Nittaku. Out comes an old, shiny grey ball, with almost all the lettering worn off. I was like ..... wtf? If you are going to be a ball snob, don't whip out a sh..ty one.



So did you hit with the old nittaku? I prefer any new or nearly new plastic ball over old bald balls. I would have said no.
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Originally posted by BH-Man BH-Man wrote:

I call players who want to play ONLY with Nittaku 3* and NOTHING else NBS... Nittaku Ball Snobs.

Sure, the Nittaku Premium 40 is a great ball, I would be fine playing a match using one (as long as it isn't all used and smooth-shiny), but there are other true bouncing balls too.
I hope this doesn't offend anyone, but I was always wondering what guys like the ones you describe are thinking. For example there were guys in my club that really didn't play better than someone playing in his garage. But whenever someone played with them and only had a two star celluloid ball they always wanted to play with a three star ball. I mean they couldn't even play table tennis, but are basically implying that a two star ball is not good enough for them? Especially in the celluloid era I didn't really care about the brand, as they were all just balls.

Now of course there are big difference between different brands. I've played with a lot of different balls, like joola ( the old shitty one), joola flash, tsp( the newest one), butterfly g40+, gewo p, gewo slp, the slp two star training ball, andro poly s training ball, 2s training ball, gewo slp( newest one), the two star version of that( which is really good actually), tibhar( the first one), dhs ( newest one), yinhe and xushuofa. And nowadays I don't care about the differences between the balls. If you have different people to play with and they all got one brand they always play, you'll just get used to the different brands and can quickly adjust.
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Originally posted by BH-Man BH-Man wrote:

I call players who want to play ONLY with Nittaku 3* and NOTHING else NBS... Nittaku Ball Snobs.

Sure, the Nittaku Premium 40 is a great ball, I would be fine playing a match using one (as long as it isn't all used and smooth-shiny), but there are other true bouncing balls too.


A few weeks ago after hitting with my regular practice partner, a ball snob asked to hit with me.

I was using an almost new DHS D40+ and the player insisted on switching to Nittaku. Out comes an old, shiny grey ball, with almost all the lettering worn off. I was like ..... wtf? If you are going to be a ball snob, don't whip out a sh..ty one.

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I call players who want to play ONLY with Nittaku 3* and NOTHING else NBS... Nittaku Ball Snobs.

Sure, the Nittaku Premium 40 is a great ball, I would be fine playing a match using one (as long as it isn't all used and smooth-shiny), but there are other true bouncing balls too.
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Originally posted by Jackcerry Jackcerry wrote:

In Italy it’s a mess... every team and every tournament is with a different ball... plastic xushaofa, joola flash/ abs Andro, abs tibhar, abs nittaku, abs dhs. Lots of clubs and for national tournaments there is the Stag abs ball
 

Situation Normal: Government a mess.

Ditto in USA. Literally every club tourney or sanctioned tourney has a different ball with wildy different properties. As long as the ball bounces true, I never really worry, but it isn't the case with each ball.
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Hi,

For those in the USA, where do you purchase the DHS D40+ balls?

Thanks,
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Hi,

[Nittaku 3* 40+ premium is an ABS ball, indeed it was the first one on the market (2014).]

I find it interesting that I missed this.  I think I know the source of my deficiency: I spoke with the top Nittaku representative at the Paris Worlds who had the ball on display but not for sale, as there were not the quantities then.  I recall him saying that Nittaku's goal was to be the premier ball on the market, as they were in the celluloid era.  He stated the material composing the ball was proprietary, patented, and no other manufacturer would be able to use this formula for their balls.  He didn't mention ABS, but ABS was not in the sport's vocabulary broadly then.  It did not dawn on me later that it was an ABS ball, I suppose due to this discussion.

Thanks for the update.
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I can't believe that someone living in Germany and playing regularly table tennis has hit an ABS ball only in last July. Yes, crazy is the right word.

Edited by Makelele - 10/05/2018 at 7:59pm
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In Italy it’s a mess... every team and every tournament is with a different ball... plastic xushaofa, joola flash/ abs Andro, abs tibhar, abs nittaku, abs dhs. Lots of clubs and for national tournaments there is the Stag abs ball
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I think it's crazy that the leagues in Germany still haven't made strict regulations about the new ball. We always talk about how the us is so far behind, but they at least switched to plastic balls years ago. The first time I played with abs balls was in July and I really liked them. They don't break as quickly and are actually round.
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Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

Originally posted by Hozuki Hozuki wrote:

our league is a mess, we play with ABS, seamless AND celluloid, depending on the club and it sucks.


That would drive me insane.  Take heart though.  This can't go on like that forever.  Although to be honest, I am surprised you still find celluloid balls.

Where I live it is 100% ABS.  Nittaku or D40+ for the most part.


I am trying my best to endure it... This is the last season celluloid is allowed, after that, I hope ABS will prevail. More and more clubs are changing to Gewo Pro Select ABS around here.

Some more detailed thoughts on the balls:
Although the CA / seamless balls retain more spin during flight and on contact with the table, they are bad for brushing the ball and are inconsistent in bounce. ABS is much easier to brush, but weird in the way it interacts with the table. On grippy table surfaces, slow sidespin loops curve away like crazy. Topspin and backspin become much less relevant. In clubs that play with ABS for some time now, hardly anyone pushes with pure backspin any more. The table would just eat it and make the ball bounce high and empty. Sidespin is the new backspin. Choppers will now always chop with sidespin, and sometimes add some back- or top-component to it.
Also, the durability of ABS is not good IMO, because after 2-3 training sessions the ball becomes shiny and non-grippy, producing much less spin - that's when some choppers would throw them in the trash and grab a new one.
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Originally posted by Hozuki Hozuki wrote:

our league is a mess, we play with ABS, seamless AND celluloid, depending on the club and it sucks.


That would drive me insane.  Take heart though.  This can't go on like that forever.  Although to be honest, I am surprised you still find celluloid balls.

Where I live it is 100% ABS.  Nittaku or D40+ for the most part.
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our league is a mess, we play with ABS, seamless AND celluloid, depending on the club and it sucks.
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Originally posted by PythonMonty PythonMonty wrote:

Originally posted by pgpg pgpg wrote:

Westchester is now using GEWO ABS ball...

Does this ball (Gewo Select Pro 40+) play like D40+ and other similar ABS balls?


I haven't played with this particular one, but the odds are great that it is made in the same factory as either D40+ or the Double Fish V40+.  However, Gewo (and the other companies that sell ABS) can stipulate the production standards they will accept for weight, roundness, etc.  By the way, this has been true for a long time now.  Stiga, Tibhar, Donic, etc. etc. don't own their own ball factories (not in the celluloid era and not now).  In fact there are a relatively small number of places where these things are made.  Nittaku has their own facility in Japan (but they have always had a deal with DHS to have them make a cheaper Nittaku ball in China). 

What this all means is that they will probably play pretty similar, but, since Gewo always sells a quality product, there might be a lower percentage of bad ones among the Gewo.

I have posted a lot on this thread and forgot to mention one thing.  A really big advantage of D40+ vs Nittaku is durability.  They last a really long time.  The Nittaku Premium ABS does get shiny on the surface sooner (this was also a feature of their celluloid balls).  So Nittaku starts of playing better (IMHO) but D40+ will stay good longer.
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Originally posted by DonnOlsen DonnOlsen wrote:

Hi,

So, with the Butterfly announcement of the A40+, it appears, at the 3 star level, we have before us a bicameral world:  Nittaku 3 star 40+ Premium and the ABS space.

Thanks.


Nittaku 3* 40+ premium is an ABS ball, indeed it was the first one on the market (2014).
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Originally posted by patelaaaa patelaaaa wrote:

I had purchased butterfly a40+ and played with them. Although they are seamed, bounce is very much similar to Yinhe 3 star seamless. Considering the lightness of these balls, several players at the club have a second opinion to go on a match on A40, and instead opted for nittaku. Good for training, but not so good for a game.   

Being said, my preference goes to DHS D40+. Pretty good for the price, heavier than A40, just a tad little lighter than nittaku, durable with thicker seam and spinwise, as good as nittaku. Probably, you might find one/two eggs in a pack of 10 balls, but $7 for pack of 10 balls is worth it. 


If you actually weigh them on a balance, the D40+ is a bit heavier than Nittaku Premium (average if 2.73 g vs 2.68 gram for Nittaku).

D40+ is a good ball, especially for the price.  I prefer Nittaku but am perfectly happy to play with D40+.  Nittakus are more consistent in their production quality.
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Originally posted by Stavros Stavros wrote:

I find ABS balls much better. 
Unfortunatelly ,on most official tournaments here , we use old plastic balls instead of ABS balls. 

Have you switched to ABS ball ?




Yes.  They are infinitely better.  Especially the Nittakus.
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Rather stick to the usuals yo. Not so sure about these new thingsSmile
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Originally posted by Tinykin Tinykin wrote:

Originally posted by vvk1 vvk1 wrote:

Same here in UK. Tournaments are sponsored by local TT vendors so, alas, until such vendors sell out their non-ABS ball inventory, we're stuck.


Not for all UK tournaments. For English tournaments, this was announced by TTE on 15 Aug 18:

The London-based company were chosen following a tender process and will supply Sanwei ABS Pro 40+ 3*** balls for the following competitions:

  • PG Mutual National Championships
  • PG Mutual Cadet & Junior National Championships
  • PG Mutual U10-U13 National Championships
  • Senior British League
  • County Championships
  • National Junior League and National Cadet League
  • National Cups (U12, Cadet and Junior)


IMO, that's not enough and is irrelevant to the over-21 of TTE competition/player members (don't they constitute the majority of TTE's membership?). That list excludes Gran Prix, senior/vets rating 1-2* tournaments. All these still use non-ABS seamless balls. Same most likely applies to the majority of local leagues. Some tournaments still use the old crappy seamed balls precisely because that what the tournament sponsor was magnanimous enough to spare :-(
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I had purchased butterfly a40+ and played with them. Although they are seamed, bounce is very much similar to Yinhe 3 star seamless. Considering the lightness of these balls, several players at the club have a second opinion to go on a match on A40, and instead opted for nittaku. Good for training, but not so good for a game.   

Being said, my preference goes to DHS D40+. Pretty good for the price, heavier than A40, just a tad little lighter than nittaku, durable with thicker seam and spinwise, as good as nittaku. Probably, you might find one/two eggs in a pack of 10 balls, but $7 for pack of 10 balls is worth it. 
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DOUBLE Fish V40+ is the cheapest. We like them so much.
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Originally posted by DonnOlsen DonnOlsen wrote:

Again, it seems, the USA stood out just when it shouldn't.

Not quite. In Europe, smaller federations such as Belgium or England have switched very early on, with the first new balls tournaments being played in 2014.

Larger federations like France or Germany took longer, likely due to inertia and logistics involved within the many clubs.
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Hi,

So, with the Butterfly announcement of the A40+, it appears, at the 3 star level, we have before us a bicameral world:  Nittaku 3 star 40+ Premium and the ABS space.

Thanks.
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Originally posted by vvk1 vvk1 wrote:

Same here in UK. Tournaments are sponsored by local TT vendors so, alas, until such vendors sell out their non-ABS ball inventory, we're stuck.


Not for all UK tournaments. For English tournaments, this was announced by TTE on 15 Aug 18:

The London-based company were chosen following a tender process and will supply Sanwei ABS Pro 40+ 3*** balls for the following competitions:

  • PG Mutual National Championships
  • PG Mutual Cadet & Junior National Championships
  • PG Mutual U10-U13 National Championships
  • Senior British League
  • County Championships
  • National Junior League and National Cadet League
  • National Cups (U12, Cadet and Junior)
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Originally posted by PythonMonty PythonMonty wrote:

Originally posted by pgpg pgpg wrote:

Westchester is now using GEWO ABS ball...

Does this ball (Gewo Select Pro 40+) play like D40+ and other similar ABS balls?

I was told it's the same ball as DHS D40+, made in the same factory. Color was a bit different, IMHO, with a yellowish tint, but it played similar, at least to me. 
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Originally posted by pgpg pgpg wrote:

Westchester is now using GEWO ABS ball...

Does this ball (Gewo Select Pro 40+) play like D40+ and other similar ABS balls?
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I feel that decision is more or less made for me by tournament organizers: Westchester is now using GEWO ABS ball, Joola Teams is going with Joola Prime flavor of it, so it kind of makes sense to use it in club play as well...
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I´ve changed to DHS D40+ but 1 star ball is terrible. I only play with 3 star D40+.
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