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Rubbers With a Hard Topsheet.

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Mickael View Drop Down
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    Posted: 11/06/2018 at 7:54am
Lately I discovered that the rubbers I played with and I liked more are rubbers with a hard topsheet. So to narrow down my search I started this thread. Anyone who knows about which rubbers have a hard topsheet please include in this list:

Butterfly Tenergy (all).
Tibhar Mx-p Elp Fxp.
Stiga Mantra H M S.
Donic M1 M2 M3.
Dhs Hurricane 3.
Rakza X.
Nittaku G1 C1.

I know nothing about Xiom, Joola, .....
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Tenergy 05 2.1 FH/BH
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Pr1nc View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pr1nc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/06/2018 at 9:08am
Only T05 Hard from all Tenergies has hard sponge, others are medium hard rubbers and FX versions are medium-soft. From your list I think only Mantra H and Hurricane 3 are hard sponge rubbers, all other are medium.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nightsky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/06/2018 at 9:35am
Originally posted by Pr1nc Pr1nc wrote:

Only T05 Hard from all Tenergies has hard sponge, others are medium hard rubbers and FX versions are medium-soft. From your list I think only Mantra H and Hurricane 3 are hard sponge rubbers, all other are medium.


I'm not 100% sure, but I think that Mickael is talking about topsheet hardness and not (only) the sponge hardness. That being said, Mantra H and Fastarc G-1 have the same sponge hardness (47.5 ° on ESN) and similar hard topsheet (the one of G-1 being slightly more elastic in my opinion and therefore resembles more T05 while Mantra H is more like MX-P (faster, lower arc/longer trajectory).
And in regards to the Tenergys: only the T25 has a hard topsheet; topsheet of T05 is very similar to Fastarc G-1 (definitely softer than T25!); topsheets of T80 and particularly T64 are almost soft/medium-soft mainly due to the thinner pimples.

Topsheets that I found relatively hard are that from Yinhe Big Dipper and Xiom Vega China; Xiom Vega Pro also has a relatively firm topsheet (similar to T05 and Fastarc G-1).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hozuki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/06/2018 at 12:30pm
Tibhar EL-S and EL-P have the hardest topsheet of about two dozen rubbers that I know.
Other than that, H3 prov BS (non-neo) comes close.

mx-p or vega pro topsheets are much softer.
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Mickael View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mickael Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/06/2018 at 4:33pm
no i mean the topsheet of the rubbers not the sponges. els has the same soft topsheet of mxs so it is soft. yes tenergies has hard topsheet disregarding the pimple structure. i am not saying that feels hard. i am saying dense topsheet that lasts longer. holds the ball at high speed and goòd for all kind of flicks but they are not as spinny as thin or light or soft topsheet that has less control at high speed. but thin topsheet are usually better for serves. however the complete rubber performance is due to the sponge and the topsheet. i like the harder ones they are more cotrollable when you engage into the ball. a good example are the latest thin topsheet rubbers like bryce highspeed, rasanter , rhyzer , omega 7 , blestorm that are completely uncomfortable at very high speed.
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slevin View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote slevin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/06/2018 at 7:37pm
Originally posted by Mickael Mickael wrote:

a good example are the latest thin topsheet rubbers like bryce highspeed, rasanter , rhyzer , omega 7 , blestorm that are completely uncomfortable at very high speed.

IMHO, stroke needs to be recallibrated using the new-gen rubbers - I had to do that when I moved from MX-P to Bluestorm Z1 (a while ago). What I eventually found is that a key to optimally using the new thin topsheet / thick sponge rubbers is to go a level up in sponge hardness relative to the hardness you select with conventional, older-gen rubbers.

So, for example, if one was using a 47 deg rubber before, my advice would be to try using 50 deg sponge hardness in the new 'thin-topsheet' range. If one was using 45 deg sheets before, use 47 deg 'thin topsheet / ultramax sponge' sheets. In fact, the reason why we have a slew of 47 deg thin topsheet offerings is because we used to have a slew of 45 deg old-gen topsheet offerings.

Now, when you hit hard, there is less dwell than before (due to harder sponge that you selected) but the thinner topsheet needs less dwell to generate good spin. Of course, elements like throw angle, etc shall differ and adjustments shall have to be made. But once your stroke is properly recallibrated to use this new rubber, you won't have that unstability at all. In fact, you shall likely have more stability and a bit more power from the harder and thicker sponge.

Also, quite a few of these thin topsheet offerings give me better feel of the ball.

Of course, the pros use both - old-style thicker topsheets AND harder sponges (than commercially available).


Edited by slevin - 11/06/2018 at 7:39pm
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