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Pink Rubber on Table Tennis Rackets - Yes or No? |
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BH-Man
Premier Member Joined: 02/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5042 |
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SW...
You cannot imagine to increased cost of inventory to stock 6 different colors of 4 different thicknesses of ONE rubber... for pretty much the same long term sales... and worry about selling all inventory and do it all over as new rubbers come out all the time if you stock more than one brand.
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skip3119
Premier Member Joined: 02/24/2006 Location: somewhere Status: Offline Points: 8257 |
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shoen_wong thinks that it is a bonanza for the dealers.
BH-Man thinks that it is hell for the dealers. I agree with BH-Man. |
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BH-Man
Premier Member Joined: 02/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5042 |
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Let's go to the simple math for stocking just 10 rubbers with a stock quantity of 10 per variant.
Before: 10 Rubbers X 3 thickness x 2 colors x stock of 10 = 600 rubbers overall 600 x $25-$60 a rubber = $15,000-$36,000 for rubbers alone After: Now that there are going to be 3-6 more colors available that means 3x to 6x additional cost to stock rubbers. 3x -6x times $15,000 - $36,000 means re-seller has to stock another $45,000 - $216,000 worth of rubbers just to ensure re-seller has 10 of each rubber, color, and sponge thickness variant (assuming only 3 thicknesses)... So reseller investment on inventory went from $15,000 - $36,000 smooth up to needing to invest $60,000 to $252,000 to keep a SMALL stock... There are only 2 resellers in USA capable of absorbing this additional investment without borrowing... and borrowing for a small reseller where the sales will not be there is an unacceptable risk. Reseller is NOT in mid or long term going to sell a significantly larger number of rubbers overall if no underlying business situation improves... So reseller is now forced to invest an unrealistically high amount of money in inventory for a small return. So now reseller must also face risk of not being able to sell their stock of rubbers before new rubbers come out... and new rubbers come out more often than before... So now resellers are under a lot more financial pressure to make the same sales. So basically the cost of entry to business, the cost of staying in business, and the financial risk go way up, just because ITTF wanted to pimp new colors for rubbers. This should have come from the business side (manufacturers/resellers) instead of ITTF. This move is going to put some resellers out of business or greatly reduce their business. The only way to cope with cost of inventory (given all other conditions constant) is to reduce inventory qty per rubber, color, and variant. That means a small reseller will lose sales there is lag between sell out of stock and re-stock... or increased per unit costs since reseller would make smaller orders, get less buying leverage, and increased per unit cost due to shipping. It think this move by ITTF sucks for a lot of reasons I just quantified in detail without my usual sarcasm. |
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BH-Man
Premier Member Joined: 02/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5042 |
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The manufacturers also have similar risks, but on a much larger scale.
- What if sales of a certain color suck? - What if the maker cannot sell wholesale the stuff they made before new version of rubber? - What if maker goes ahead and makes the rubber, but resellers are too hesitant to order? - Maker cannot make a small batch of 100 rubbers with any price efficiency, so they are under pressure to perform. - ESN is not gunna go for small batch - they demand you go big volume. Many makers are already stretched and leveraged with loans to make business, the new colors are now adding financial pressure on makers just to stay in business. - Some makers may not stay in the game.. or some makers are going to lose sales to makers who can absorb the higher costs/risks of business who decide to make all the colors - This is going to force makers to have a lower margin (margins at maker level are already thin tight) or it is going to make prices per rubber higher where the maker was not intending to raise prices |
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Fulanodetal
Gold Member Joined: 06/28/2013 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1226 |
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Responding to BH-Man
My dad used to own a store a while ago. We stayed in business for more than a decade. In short it's about supply and demand. I know....shocking! You do not have to stock every item equally. You get more of the items that sell out the fastest. For items that you have no idea how it's going to sell you buy an initial small stock of it and see what happens. It is the owners themselves who have a good intuition of what will sell and what might be a risk. Today with the help of the internet it is possible to gauge the popularity of certain items. There will always be a risk. But you balance the risk by buying more of what is sure to sell. Theres always certain items you can count on. FdT
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skip3119
Premier Member Joined: 02/24/2006 Location: somewhere Status: Offline Points: 8257 |
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For inventory modelling you need historical data. Initially neither rubber makers nor re-sellers know what colored rubbers sell and what do not. It will take time for them to find out.
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hangdog
Member Joined: 10/13/2016 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 34 |
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Certainly it presents more of a production and inventory headache. But if it’s only 2 new colours, then in each rubber:
1) You’re going to sell the same number of the compulsory black colour. 2) You’re probably still going to sell mostly red for the other side. If manufacturers and distributors stipulate large minimum order quantities per colour/thickness, then smaller retailers will be reluctant to try green or orchid, at least unless an obvious market preference develops, and even then they won’t want to stock less popular thicknesses. I think you’re also going to see a fair bit of people changing rubbers for the hell of it, because they want the new colours.
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Fulanodetal
Gold Member Joined: 06/28/2013 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1226 |
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Manufacturers and distributors stipulating order quantities?!??
Sorry, count me as skeptical of this. Not knowing how business are run in other countries I would have ask if this is remotely how bussiness is run in those other countries? Maybe in some countries but I cant see how a manufacturer is going to demand minimum quantities in each order. Perhaps there are other bussiness models I'm not aware of. Let's hear from bussiness owners shall we. FDT
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BruceShwnoswicz
Beginner Joined: 12/28/2019 Location: Ontario Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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I am just a casual player and usually do not join forums. . BH Man makes some very good points.But i have to agree with Fulanodetal on this Limiting rubber colors is like saying all cars made in Canada should only be red or black, as if there is not already enough price-fixing & collusion (both very illegal) among car dealers / manufacturers etc. In a free market economy, yes there are serious problems of inventory management. A small car dealer has to compete with large franchises and this is reality in any business. This is why modern business models talk about JIT (Just in time) inventory management, which are all of course impractical for small or even medium sized businesses, but that does not justify large dealers buying of the controlling organization, I assume it is the ITTF here ? I am not sure In communist countries or dictatorships, disguised as "socialists" and socialists disguised both as communists and capitalists as need suits them LOL, the political leaders can dictate what color cars or anything else be. So overall in the long run a free market economy benefits all, though it is of course far from a perfect system but is best available.
Edited by BruceShwnoswicz - 12/28/2019 at 6:47am |
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hangdog
Member Joined: 10/13/2016 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 34 |
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Minimum order quantities (MOQs) from manufacturers are extremely common. Unless they are shipping sample quantities, manufacturers will typically make distributors buy per carton or some other packaged multiple. Now, maybe a distributor won’t set a MOQ for a retailer. But some distributors probably would, for some items.
Edited by hangdog - 12/28/2019 at 9:16am |
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BruceShwnoswicz
Beginner Joined: 12/28/2019 Location: Ontario Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Please help me understand a few things.
1. First of all, why does one side of racket has to be black. I was told that Para players cannot see other colors. But that does not seem fair because wouldn't para players have trouble with the other side rubber (which won't be black) ? Why should non-para players suffer because para players cannot see in regular events ? Why can't para players have just black one side and another color that is best for them for other side but only in para events ? Aren't para players competing on an equal basis in regular events ? Wouldn't they not want to be treated as equals or would they ask for special privileges in regular events ? This also brings up the ethics of serving really short and wide to a para player in a regular event. There are many other do's and don't etiquette I would like to understand about playing against a para player in a regular event. 2. Even before that I was told that, in tournaments now, one side MUST be red and other black. I was told I cannot have both black or both red. That makes no sense to me at all. Please explain Sorry if I sound stupid about this as I do not know the full story and history behind this rule & I don't understand rubber selection completely. I remember when I was young I used to play with rackets of all colors and I thought rubbers had to be of same color and cannot be different. Am I wrong ? when did this rule change take place ? Now it looks like we have gone not full circle but 180 degrees after many years . Edited by BruceShwnoswicz - 12/28/2019 at 11:26am |
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Fulanodetal
Gold Member Joined: 06/28/2013 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1226 |
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Thanks hangdog. I can imagine boxes of 5 or 10 or by dozens. That would make sense. But the minimum would not be in multiple of hundreds. About 10 years ago Fender made a replica of Eddie Van Halen's "frankenstrat" guitar. It was an exact copy of Eddie's famous guitar. Which took many many hours to get exact. To the point where the final selling price was a whopping 25 thousand dollars. Yes, $25 K for a guitar. A local store had 2 of them. After a couple of years they were no longer on display so I asked one of the guys at the store about it. They just shipped them back to the manufacturer. I guess there are not that many guitar collectors out there willing to part with a measley 25k for a guitar. So I suppose that this would be a different bussiness model. I wonder about luxury car dealers as well. Some of those Ferraris are on display for several months. In any case, if enough ppl ask about a certain item I would invest a minimum amount and see how it sells. Some items will not sell out. That's just how it is. FdT
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darucla
Super Member Joined: 07/30/2017 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 115 |
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I don't expect that many rubbers will be available in all colours. Most current rubbers will probably stay the same, with new ones introduced in maybe another colour for whatever reason. But who cares really enough to demand that their favourite current red rubber be available in green? Or Orchid (dumb name for a colour)?
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hangdog
Member Joined: 10/13/2016 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 34 |
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Yeah, I think many of us expected a more dynamic and unrestricted colour palette instead of the two new permitted ho-hum colours.
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BH-Man
Premier Member Joined: 02/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5042 |
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All the Jokers thinking it is a piece of cake to with new colors can open a TT reselling business themselves and learn firsthand what goes on.
Even if one can order a very small quantity, which a reseller CAN (big distributors not so) my example used a VERY SMALL stock quantity... my math shows that the dollar amount needed to be invested just to make sales of a fraction of that is a ROI (Return on investment) of single digit proportion. Low single digit works only when there is high sales volume and inventory turnover... TT business in USA is way different than that. Resellers pretty much cannot sell majority of what they order before it is obsolete by new models... only a few articles and sell quickly enough. |
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Dream1700
Super Member Joined: 12/02/2017 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 410 |
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The best thing about the new colored rubbers is that one should be able get them for 20-30% off one year after launch.
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BH-Man
Premier Member Joined: 02/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5042 |
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Yup, then the mainsteam product sales suffer... the new colors are not going to a sustained 25% increase in sales year to year. All they are going to do is increase the costs and risks of manufacturers, large distributors, and resellers.
Guess who has the most risk? |
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JacekGM
Platinum Member Joined: 02/17/2013 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 2356 |
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I had to give myself a pinch...
Anyone, what is this thread about? |
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(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Yinhe T7 (Fl, 87 g) with Bluefire M3 (red 2.0) on FH and 0.6 mm 755 on BH.
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1dennistt
Silver Member Joined: 03/03/2010 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 533 |
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Oh, pretty colors. Uh, for me no not really, we had this before, it will become a mess over time. But who knows it might get a few players interested? What happens when no one has the color someone wants in stock and they have to make do with something else? At least black will be safe (for now anyway). I already have some old Feint that is pretty much pink lying around somewhere. Maybe I need to look it up, and take it out for a spin when this goes live. Would like to compare it to the new color pallet and see how it matches up. My thoughts are that this will drive up prices yet again, since the costs to stock these new colors are going to raise the cost of doing business for everyone distributes and/or retails TT products. This might help cover the cost of discounting last years colors when new colors invariably get approved. |
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Donic Waldner World Champion 1989 ZLC (Inner), Donic BlueStorm Pro (Red) Max, ????? (Black) 1.8 mm)
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alexuganski
Super Member Joined: 01/28/2011 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 232 |
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I'm thinking, why will rubbers come out in a multitude of colors? They don't sell enough to warrant that.
Tenergy might be the only rubber that could come out in multiple colors and still make that worth it. Once everyone gets over the whole "red is best and professional" schtick, companies will start to offer rubbers in black and an off color. As is, you'll only be able to buy Stiga DNA Rx Pro Super Hard in black and green. I see Igor mentioned only RED, GREEN, and ORCHID as approved off colors. This can't be the case going forward, right? I need more options. 😁
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Harimoto Innerforce ALC
FH: Dr Neubauer Killer Extreme 2.2 BH: Butterfly Dignics 05 2.1 Embrace the Dark Side. |
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ZApenholder
Premier Member Joined: 03/04/2012 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 4804 |
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2022 and BH Man is right. The take on from brands and resellers are minimal. The take on from Pros is minimal It is insane for models to come out in many colours. Many brands has not release color rubbers and even if they do, it is limited colors. Production nightmare, inventory nightmare, and supply and demand is easy to say, but from production to retail shop is too many months They should of focus on hobby bats first |
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igorponger
Premier Member Joined: 07/29/2006 Location: Everywhere Status: Offline Points: 3252 |
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MANY COLOURS -- MANY TROUBLES.
We have now got into mess. Let's view a possible scenario as follows -- Some one wants to play with a penhold bat having BROWNISH paper sheet on the non-playing side. In response to umpire's call, he can easely contend that this is a true, statutory colour. Umpire on duty will fall into the trap of uncertainity on such occasions, for statutory colours still undefined by the Rule. This would be an absurdic situation difficult to resolve, if at all. Edited by igorponger - 05/22/2022 at 12:36pm |
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vanjr
Gold Member Joined: 08/19/2004 Location: Corpus Christi Status: Offline Points: 1368 |
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How can anyone be against Bernadette Szocs playing with pink rubber? What is wrong with you people???
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mjamja
Platinum Member Joined: 05/30/2009 Status: Offline Points: 2895 |
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Bernadette uses a racket? I never noticed. Mark
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Eric Fountain
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Still waiting for the brands/rubbers I use to get some colors going. A couple guys here that use Grass D.Tecs both tried and and didn't like Green (and they claimed to try it long enough for proper break in) - certainly there are challenges with differences as even Black vs. Red show for many/most rubbers. Red is pretty boring though and I'm ready as soon as the rest of the manufacturers hurry up and take my money already.
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cole_ely
Premier Member Joined: 03/16/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6898 |
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That's a good point about making their red obsolete. My guess is a lot of it will be put on premades or on sale
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Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b
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ZApenholder
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well, another correct and already seen - price is on the increase. There will be new price hikes in June/July |
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YoAss
Super Member Joined: 05/15/2017 Location: Tiel, NL Status: Offline Points: 165 |
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"The surface of the covering material on a side of the blade, or of a side of
the blade if it is left uncovered, shall be matt, black on one side, and of a
bright colour clearly distinguishable from black and from the colour of the
ball on the other."
Not all that unclear to me (although "matt", "black", and "bright" and the tolerances for these are left undefined). Still not liking it much, if only because ruling out the option to use the exact same rubber on both wings just seems stupid collateral damage. Such undoubtedly good intentions pave the road to hell, and as a bard wrote, great crimes are committed by people whose conscience is clear.
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DonnOlsen
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A couple guys here that use Grass D.Tecs both tried and and didn't like Green (and they claimed to try it long enough for proper break in)
Wowzer! There is now a break-in period for table tennis rubber COLOR!? [How long does it take for pink?] I don't think even Mjamja has reached that level of subtlety. Thanks.
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Tenergy: Two weeks of heaven, followed by three months of excellence, then, a nice rubber.
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cole_ely
Premier Member Joined: 03/16/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6898 |
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I'm curious what color they had used? Did they say if the pips felt softer or harder? It's quite possible red might be harder and slicker than the other colors, but also black too if they're used to red
Edited by cole_ely - 05/23/2022 at 8:26am |
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Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b
Please let me know if I can be of assistance. |
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