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NEW BH Topspin Tutorial!

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bzdz View Drop Down
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    Posted: 10/06/2020 at 12:05am
Here's a good video on the fundamentals of the backhand counter topspin. Please watch and share with friends!

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blahness View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2020 at 4:30am
You didn't touch on the squatting/unsquatting action for BH (hinge action from the hips) which was absolutely crucial to power generation :(
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bzdz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2020 at 12:23pm
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

You didn't touch on the squatting/unsquatting action for BH (hinge action from the hips) which was absolutely crucial to power generation :(
 

I did mention that you need to rotate your hips into the ball for power. Probably could’ve talked about it in more detail. What exactly do you mean by squat/unsquat? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2020 at 1:26pm
I have enjoyed both posts and have recommended the fh vid to a couple of players

Maybe if you twerk right before impact it could be  a new technique.


Edited by cole_ely - 10/06/2020 at 1:28pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2020 at 7:33pm
Originally posted by bzdz bzdz wrote:

Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

You didn't touch on the squatting/unsquatting action for BH (hinge action from the hips) which was absolutely crucial to power generation :(
 

I did mention that you need to rotate your hips into the ball for power. Probably could’ve talked about it in more detail. What exactly do you mean by squat/unsquat? 

Literally the action of squatting down, and then coming back up and bringing the stomach forwards. Pretty much all modern players have this action....
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Back to normal shape bats :(
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bzdz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2020 at 7:37pm
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

Originally posted by bzdz bzdz wrote:

Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

You didn't touch on the squatting/unsquatting action for BH (hinge action from the hips) which was absolutely crucial to power generation :(
 

I did mention that you need to rotate your hips into the ball for power. Probably could’ve talked about it in more detail. What exactly do you mean by squat/unsquat? 

Literally the action of squatting down, and then coming back up and bringing the stomach forwards. Pretty much all modern players have this action....

I don’t agree that this is a correct stroke. Could you link me a video where you see the squatting? I think hip rotation is much more important than going down to up.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2020 at 8:15pm
Hmm I found that without this movement it's super hard to add real quality on the BH topspin (especially heavy spin)...coz the legs are after all the most powerful part of the human body. It's probably the most evident from Timo Boll's BH stroke...





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bzdz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2020 at 8:22pm
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

Hmm I found that without this movement it's super hard to add real quality on the BH topspin (especially heavy spin)...coz the legs are after all the most powerful part of the human body. It's probably the most evident from Timo Boll's BH stroke...






I see, I agree that your legs should be engaged during backhand. Especially to drive the ball forward, and use your legs to help rotate your hips. I just don't think this corresponds to "squatting/unsquatting." The power in timo's stroke is from legs to rotate hips and core, not from the squatting motion. I think I may have misunderstood what you meant by squatting because I definitely agree that we should be using legs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2020 at 8:30pm
Hmm I think some players forego the rotation (for eg Harimoto) for more speed (to allow them to take the ball earlier), but still use the squat/unsquat movement...

But yeah for max power you want everything (squat/unsquat + hip rotation)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ghostzen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2020 at 6:13am
Legs, hips (some use a lot some not so much) and core for me with a free flowing relaxed stoke. As a general rule I've found power comes from the ground up if this makes sense. Legs, (Some use alot of hips) core and arm. If you mean drop your weight to the seat while using your legs I can understand but I not so much the other sorry to say on this one. It's a nuance at best.


Edited by ghostzen - 10/07/2020 at 6:27am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Valiantsin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2020 at 9:20am
Originally posted by ghostzen ghostzen wrote:

Legs, hips (some use a lot some not so much) and core for me with a free flowing relaxed stoke. As a general rule I've found power comes from the ground up if this makes sense. Legs, (Some use alot of hips) core and arm. If you mean drop your weight to the seat while using your legs I can understand but I not so much the other sorry to say on this one. It's a nuance at best.
Nuance or not but such little jumpy gives tempo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ghostzen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2020 at 10:34am
Originally posted by Valiantsin Valiantsin wrote:

Originally posted by ghostzen ghostzen wrote:

Legs, hips (some use a lot some not so much) and core for me with a free flowing relaxed stoke. As a general rule I've found power comes from the ground up if this makes sense. Legs, (Some use alot of hips) core and arm. If you mean drop your weight to the seat while using your legs I can understand but I not so much the other sorry to say on this one. It's a nuance at best.
Nuance or not but such little jumpy gives tempo



From the engaged legs and upper muscles,core and hips I can see 100% to create quality.


Edited by ghostzen - 10/07/2020 at 10:57am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2020 at 10:43am
It's not really important to the point, but I think our strongest muscle may be our jaws or maybe our diaphragm.  I can find those on the internet, plus tongue and heart.

I don't think it's the legs. It TT terms I bet it's the diaphragm. Glutes are also listed, which go to legs.




Edited by cole_ely - 10/07/2020 at 10:53am
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One of them is the Masseter if i've spelt that correctly! Thumbs UpThumbs Down  Heart for dynamic strength i guess and calf with the glutes. knowledge from me on this... who would have guessed!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BH-Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2020 at 12:13pm
It all depends on how you define strong.

Is it overall ability for total amount of power? Then likely legs

Is it power per size? Jaw sounds like a great candidate

is it resiliancy and ability to endure? Heart sounds like it there. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BH-Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2020 at 12:21pm
There are so many different BH shots and possible from different distances and all require differnt ways to do them.

I can be at the table and use such a short stroke, that it almost looks like I am just getting the bat to position, yet make a powerful counter.

I can be at table use a 6 inch stroke to counter topspin without leveraging the body or squating or ground up power thing. (I will still need a stable platform though - which involves some crouch and leg spread like most shots)

I can be off the table for a 12-14 inch stroke that makes a powerful opening against a slower or medium ball... that shot requires me to generate and transfer kinetic energy, which I do using a small squat down and up.

Similar shot vs incoming topspin off the table with a litle shorter stroke using less squat...

Many differnent ball situations, distance from table and expected result of shot require different ways to use body and strike the ball.

A little more further from table and I go several inches longer on stroke and use more body to generate and transfer power.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davidsyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2020 at 4:51pm

I watched the video. I think you are doing great content and  details which a lot of others
miss.  Keep up the good work.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bzdz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/2020 at 3:41pm
Thanks! I'm probably gonna do a blocking video next, and then I'll do a footwork video, so stay tuned Big smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ghostzen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/2020 at 5:21pm
nice keep up the good work ClapThumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bzdz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/2020 at 12:24pm
sometimes I feel like we over complicate technique. The ideas are usually not as complex as we make them seem, and I try to make it easy to understand
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ghostzen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/2020 at 1:06pm
Easy to understand is Clap Thumbs Up I enjoy your videos so far my friend. 

Best way to give lots of people a clear and understable idea of how improve and train better to get stronger in their games.

Complex works if you are a top top player and working on fine margins or highly cerebral. Very few people if any get paid to play on this forum or have won any national titles or even regional to be honest. Most people are looking for good and straightforward ways and tips to improve to a nice level for them.

A good coach friend on mine said to me once "sometimes you just have to call a brick a brick" He won alot of titles as a player and has coached teams and players to medals all over the place with this mentality. Others have a highly cerebral way of looking at things. This isn't a bad thing but doesn't always work for the masses who can get bogged down with it a bit.

Always great to chew the fat with both btw.








Edited by ghostzen - 10/09/2020 at 1:10pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bzdz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/2020 at 1:13pm
totally agree, I think TT gets pretty cerebral sometimes. A lot of times, we should focus on how we feel when we’re doing a stroke, not how it looks. Many players try to look like ma long, but should actually be wondering how to get the feeling he has during his shots
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