Alex Table Tennis - MyTableTennis.NET Homepage
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Maze/Freitas Alc, viscaria and innerforce.
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Maze/Freitas Alc, viscaria and innerforce.

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Tt Gold View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/22/2014
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1007
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tt Gold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Maze/Freitas Alc, viscaria and innerforce.
    Posted: 12/09/2018 at 2:41pm
IMPORTANT QUESTION IN 3. PARAGRAPH: in the beginning of this season I decided that I want to switch from my viscaria to something more controlled( more dwell). I bought a carbonado 90 as a test experiment, since I was thinking about getting an innerforce alc. Now that half of the season is over it is time to sell my carbonado 90 and look for a new blade. I really liked the dwell on the carbonado, but I didn't really like the Limba outer ply. The blade felt soft since I'm coming from a koto outer ply. So I thought about my two options, which are either buying an innerforce alc or creating my own blade.

I thought about various combinations and these were the ones I was thinking of:
1. Koto-Limba-alc-kiri-alc-Limba-Limba
2. Limba-alc-limba-kiri-alc-limba-limba
I wanted more dwell than with my viscaria, so I thought I could just put the alc to the core. But I think the outer ply is the deciding factor when it comes to dwell. So what I was expecting was the crisp feel of a viscaria with longer dwell. But that wouldn't work with koto and the alc close to the core.
So I thought about it and came to the conclusion that Limba-alc-Limba would probably do the job, since I get the crisp carbon feel but with a lot of dwell.

If anyone has played with the maze and viscaria, can you contact me? I'm trying to find out if the maze has the same crisp feel like the viscaria. And I also wanna find out if the Limba is really the cause for longer dwell. And if someone has played with innerforce alc and viscaria or maze/Freitas, can you also please get in touch with me.

Edited by Tt Gold - 12/09/2018 at 2:41pm
Back to Top
jackass22 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 04/24/2009
Location: Slovakia
Status: Offline
Points: 195
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackass22 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/09/2018 at 3:03pm
Tried viscaria and now i play with btf freitas alc.
It has better dwell, more contro, better spin. It isnt soft-same like viscaria. I know, that viscaria has koto and freitas limba, but freitas seems to me very precise and not soft-medium.
Tha freitas is almost the same like newer maze(5.9mm). Be carefull, older maze had 5.5. mm and was harder(maybe thinner top ply of limba).



Edited by jackass22 - 12/09/2018 at 3:04pm
Back to Top
Magic_M View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 05/31/2012
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1789
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Magic_M Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/09/2018 at 3:20pm
DHS H301 could be your choice: koto outer ply and ALC-layer over the core (Innerforce).
Back to Top
Kolev View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: 10/04/2004
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 1405
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kolev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/09/2018 at 6:01pm
Why not going for a blade with a hinoki outer?
OP:Is it really possible to have a blade with a chrisp feeling and longer dwell? Sounds contradictory
Foco OFF+
FH: T64
BH: Rakza X
Back to Top
TT newbie View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 11/25/2011
Location: Far Far Away
Status: Offline
Points: 918
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TT newbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/09/2018 at 6:04pm
More dwell? Ma Lin Carbon.
Back to Top
Pr1nc View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 05/11/2018
Location: TT world
Status: Offline
Points: 136
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pr1nc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/09/2018 at 7:23pm
Because you dont like limba I suggest Timo Boll ZLF.

Edited by Pr1nc - 12/09/2018 at 7:59pm
Blade: Jun Mizutani ZLC
FH: Victas V > 15 Extra
BH: Victas V > 15 Extra
Back to Top
jpenmaster View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: 12/24/2008
Location: Chicago
Status: Offline
Points: 1665
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpenmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/09/2018 at 7:25pm
Try Timo Boll ZLF
Kenta ALC T05H/T05
Back to Top
SmackDAT View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 01/01/2012
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 1946
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SmackDAT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/09/2018 at 7:56pm
Try Mizutani ZLC for crispness, or DHS H301

Freitas/Maze will be not what you described 
Butterfly MJ SZLC FL
Tibhar K1 European Edition
Tibhar Evolution MX-P
https://goo.gl/bFWoxW
Back to Top
Tt Gold View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/22/2014
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1007
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tt Gold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 8:02am
I actually have a Timo boll zlf and I hated it.
Back to Top
Tt Gold View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/22/2014
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1007
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tt Gold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 8:04am
Originally posted by Kolev Kolev wrote:

Why not going for a blade with a hinoki outer?
OP:Is it really possible to have a blade with a chrisp feeling and longer dwell? Sounds contradictory
maybe I think of something different when talking about crisp feeling. I guess I mean the feeling of having a carbon layer. When playing with viscaria, whenever I hit a forehand topspin I had this hard feeling of carbon which I liked.
Back to Top
jackass22 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 04/24/2009
Location: Slovakia
Status: Offline
Points: 195
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackass22 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 8:26am
Go to alc carbon- freitas. I have never had so big crisp feeling with zlc like with alc. Limba will add you better dwell,  but you will not loose crisp feeling.
Back to Top
pingpungpeng View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 12/14/2017
Location: chaila
Status: Offline
Points: 345
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pingpungpeng Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 8:30am
donic persson power play could be a good option.
try to find someone who has it and try it.
seven ply wood with outer ply koto.
it has some nice crispitus.


Edited by pingpungpeng - 12/10/2018 at 8:31am
Back to Top
Pr1nc View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 05/11/2018
Location: TT world
Status: Offline
Points: 136
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pr1nc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 10:00am
Then wait a little for a new Harimoto blade, maybe that blade will answer to your demands.
Blade: Jun Mizutani ZLC
FH: Victas V > 15 Extra
BH: Victas V > 15 Extra
Back to Top
jpenmaster View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: 12/24/2008
Location: Chicago
Status: Offline
Points: 1665
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpenmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 3:16pm
To me Freitas isn't crisp like Viscaria it also felt stiffer but softer. Why not just learn to control Viscaria ?
Kenta ALC T05H/T05
Back to Top
TT newbie View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 11/25/2011
Location: Far Far Away
Status: Offline
Points: 918
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TT newbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 3:29pm
Just to your knowledge, Matsudaira is the only BTY ALC blade with limba outer ply and kiri core. 
All others ALC blades have koto or hinoki surface, or another core.
Back to Top
Tt Gold View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/22/2014
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1007
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tt Gold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 4:41pm
@jpenmaster I need more dwell. I don't have problems with forehand topspins shooting off the table or anything. I just need more control in the short game and spinny open up. It was just too fast with tenergy 64
@tt newbie maze and Freitas also have Limba. Even innerforce alc has Limba.
Back to Top
Mickael View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/30/2011
Location: World
Status: Offline
Points: 704
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mickael Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 4:58pm
i played all these blades even the carbonado. freitas has lot of dwell and cripiness but with right rubbers. i play now 64 forehand and bluefire M2 backhand. control and spin and speed is the best among the others. be aware what i really like is the high throw due the huge dwell that you dont find it the other blades. innerforce is too slow , viscaria/timo boll are low throw.
Butterfly Zhang Jike ALC FL
Tibar Evolution MX-P Max FH/BH
USATT Level around 2300
Back to Top
juanma4080 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 01/15/2017
Location: Lima
Status: Offline
Points: 261
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote juanma4080 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 5:02pm
Originally posted by Tt Gold Tt Gold wrote:

@jpenmaster I need more dwell. I don't have problems with forehand topspins shooting off the table or anything. I just need more control in the short game and spinny open up. It was just too fast with tenergy 64
@tt newbie maze and Freitas also have Limba. Even innerforce alc has Limba.

Hey Jonas! if you want more dwell time, go for innerforce alc, no doubt! Harimoto blade will cost a lot of money and he used innerforce alc composition(source, here on the forum). 

regards!
Back to Top
Tt Gold View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/22/2014
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1007
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tt Gold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 6:00pm
I thought about my forehand a lot the past few days and decided I definitely want koto again. I know it's kind of contradicting to want koto and more dwell, but I'm not asking for a lot of dwell. I'm only asking for a bit more dwell than the dwell of the viscaria, so that I can play my open ups with a little more spin. Maybe I should actually get a blade with inner alc but koto outer plies. Would that have more dwell than viscaria?
Back to Top
TT newbie View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 11/25/2011
Location: Far Far Away
Status: Offline
Points: 918
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TT newbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 7:12pm
Originally posted by Tt Gold Tt Gold wrote:

@tt newbie maze and Freitas also have Limba. Even innerforce alc has Limba.
Read my post again. They do have limba outer but not kiri core.
Back to Top
FruitLoop View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 09/20/2018
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 277
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FruitLoop Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 7:16pm
Probably. There aren't many innerforce koto blades. I actually can't think of any and googling is not throwing anything up. Closest might be Rossi Emotion which is a raved about blade and might be worth a test.
Back to Top
pingpungpeng View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 12/14/2017
Location: chaila
Status: Offline
Points: 345
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pingpungpeng Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 7:22pm
Originally posted by FruitLoop FruitLoop wrote:

Probably. There aren't many innerforce koto blades. I actually can't think of any and googling is not throwing anything up. Closest might be Rossi Emotion which is a raved about blade and might be worth a test.

729 v6 is innerforce with kiri core.
in general many chinese cheaper blades come with kiri core.

joola rossi emotion and aruna off are both ayous core.

dhs 301 has koto and innerforce but ayous core.


Edited by pingpungpeng - 12/10/2018 at 7:42pm
Back to Top
juanma4080 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 01/15/2017
Location: Lima
Status: Offline
Points: 261
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote juanma4080 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 7:32pm
Originally posted by Tt Gold Tt Gold wrote:

I thought about my forehand a lot the past few days and decided I definitely want koto again. I know it's kind of contradicting to want koto and more dwell, but I'm not asking for a lot of dwell. I'm only asking for a bit more dwell than the dwell of the viscaria, so that I can play my open ups with a little more spin. Maybe I should actually get a blade with inner alc but koto outer plies. Would that have more dwell than viscaria?


I guess Viscaria without those two layers of Lima in the middle, could be close but if you want a handmade blade maybe will not feel the same, I play tournaments just with regular brands, definitely the master of the wood need to be a very good one, I guess here on the forum robin still doing blades for special orders, but I have a friend here who plays with inner force alc and have videos on tournaments in Germany if you want I can share the links, maybe will be more clearly in how it’s the performance on service,fh topspin, bh topspin, etc..
Back to Top
Tt Gold View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/22/2014
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1007
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tt Gold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 7:36pm
Yes that would be great. Do you know where he plays and how many points he has? I found a blade named hurricane 301 which has koto and inner alc. Thinking about getting it. I'll play with my viscaria again on the 28th and see how it feels. Selling my carbonado 90 now
Back to Top
juanma4080 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 01/15/2017
Location: Lima
Status: Offline
Points: 261
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote juanma4080 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2018 at 8:51pm
Originally posted by Tt Gold Tt Gold wrote:

Yes that would be great. Do you know where he plays and how many points he has? I found a blade named hurricane 301 which has koto and inner alc. Thinking about getting it. I'll play with my viscaria again on the 28th and see how it feels. Selling my carbonado 90 now

TTVN/Verbandsliga Süd

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFJ92Q5M-8g   minute 9:54 (villavicencio)

innerforce alc (T05 both sides)
Back to Top
jackass22 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 04/24/2009
Location: Slovakia
Status: Offline
Points: 195
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackass22 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/20/2019 at 2:54am
Has anybody tried tenergy 80fx on freitas on bh?
Michael: Domyou play close to table? Donyou play still with freitas?

I play with freitas close to table and i struggle little bit with my bh. I need suitable rubber for first spinny loop to backspon and than good control and speed for driving and countering near the table.
Thank you
Back to Top
kolevtt View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: 06/13/2011
Location: European Union
Status: Online
Points: 2093
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kolevtt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/20/2019 at 3:56am
I have excellent (selected) innerforce ALC ST for sale, if someone is interested just to send me a message.



Edited by kolevtt - 01/20/2019 at 3:57am
Back to Top
Mickael View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/30/2011
Location: World
Status: Offline
Points: 704
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mickael Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/20/2019 at 9:26am
I am searching for the same. Freitas is a little hard innerforce layer Alc little soft. I am thinking about nittaku king power it has koto outer and ayous alc ayous and 5.8 instead of 6.0 should be cripier spinnier and more control dwell. Nb timo boll zlf is great but koto not limba so be aware.
Butterfly Zhang Jike ALC FL
Tibar Evolution MX-P Max FH/BH
USATT Level around 2300
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.063 seconds.

Become a Fan on Facebook Follow us on Twitter Web Wiz News
About MyTableTennis.NET | Forum Help | Disclaimer

MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd.

Copyright ©2003-2019 Alex Table Tennis Ltd. All rights reserved.