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Most successful European players vs. Chinese

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    Posted: 07/10/2023 at 7:50am
China has been dominating table tennis scenery for a long time. However, there have been plenty of periods of European dominance as well. In this video, we look at one of the statistical aspects of the World Championships history. Which European player has won the most games against the Chinese at the World Championships?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zzzuppp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/17/2023 at 2:47pm
Samsonov's four wins against Chinese were all achieved in the MS at the Manchester Worlds in 1997 ,  taking out Ma Lin, Wang Liqin, Ding Song and Kong Linghui in successive rounds (before being beaten by Waldner in the Final). That's a really impressive run. He only dropped two games.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/17/2023 at 7:14pm
Originally posted by zzzuppp zzzuppp wrote:

Samsonov's four wins against Chinese were all achieved in the MS at the Manchester Worlds in 1997 ,  taking out Ma Lin, Wang Liqin, Ding Song and Kong Linghui in successive rounds (before being beaten by Waldner in the Final). That's a really impressive run. He only dropped two games.

A bit unfortunate when your peak is so early.
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/17/2023 at 7:16pm
Originally posted by TTM TTM wrote:

China has been dominating table tennis scenery for a long time. However, there have been plenty of periods of European dominance as well. In this video, we look at one of the statistical aspects of the World Championships history. Which European player has won the most games against the Chinese at the World Championships?



Great video, it helps put Waldner and Persson in context and to some degree Boll and Dima as well. 
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/17/2023 at 9:17pm
The ages of European dominance of TT?  Sort of reminds me of the Roman Empire.  It's something we like to talk and read about, it had influence on the way things are now, and it happened a really long time ago.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/18/2023 at 9:40am
Waldner
WTTC 1983 MT F Waldner 1-2 Jiang Jialiang, Waldner 0-2 Cai Zhenhua | MS R16 Waldner 0-3 Wang Huiyuan | MD R16 Waldner/Lindh 2-3 Wang Huiyuan/Yang Yuhua | XD R16 Waldner/Eliasson 0-3 Fan Changmao/Shen Jianping
WTTC 1985 MT F Waldner 1-2 Chen Longcan, Waldner 1-2 Chen Xinhua | MS R32 | MD R64
WTTC 1987 MT F Waldner did not play due to stomach flu | MS QF Waldner 3-0 Chen Longcan, SF Waldner 3-0 Teng Yi, F Waldner 1-3 Jiang Jialiang | MD R32
WTTC 1989 MT F Waldner 2-1 Teng Yi, Waldner 2-1 Jiang Jialiang | MS R16-F Waldner did not meet any CNT players | MD R16 Waldner/Appelgren 0-2 Teng Yi/Hui Jun
WTTC 1991 MT F SWE 3-2 YUG, Waldner 0-2 Primorac, 2-0 Kalinic (FYI, QF CHN 2-3 TCH) | MS SF Waldner 3-1 Ma Wenge | MD R16 Waldner/Appelgren 1-2 Wang Tao/Lu Lin
WTTC 1993 MT F Waldner 1-2 Ma Wenge, Waldner 2-1 Wang Hao (1966) | MS SF Waldner 0-3 JM Saive | MD QF Waldner/Appelgren 2-3 YNK/KTS
WTTC 1995 MT F Waldner 2-0 Wang Tao, Waldner 2-1 Ma Wenge | MS R16 Waldner 2-3 LGL | MD QF Waldner/Persson 1-3 Gatien/Eloi
WTTC 1997 MT QF Waldner 2-0 KLH | MS SF Waldner 3-0 Yan Sen | MD F w/ Persson 2-3 KLH/LGL
WTTC 1999 MS QF Waldner 3-2 KLH, SF Waldner 2-3 MLin | MD R32
WTTC 2000 MT F Waldner 2-1 LGL, Waldner 0-2 KLH
WTTC 2001 MT SF SWE 1-3 BEL, Waldner 2-1 JM Saive | MS R16 | MD R64
WTTC 2003 MS R128 Waldner 3-4 Konstantinos Papageorgiou (Waldner had just recovered from a serious leg injury)
WTTC 2004 MT (unique stage 2 format) A2-B2 SWE 0-3 KOR (Waldner did not play throughout the entire tournament)
WTTC 2005 MS R32 Waldner 0-4 Samsonov | MD R32 Waldner/Persson
WTTC 2006 MT Grp SWE 0-3 CHN (Waldner did not play), R16 SWE 1-3 RUS, Waldner 2-3 Smirnov

七�£中国名将打造乒坛老瓦神话-搜狐体育
https://sports.sohu.com/s2005/0488/s225425323.shtml

Boll
WTTC 1997 MS R128 Boll 1-3 Korbel | MD R32 | XD R128
WTTC 1999 MS R32 Boll 1-3 KTS | MD R32 | XD R16
WTTC 2000 MT QF Boll 1-2 Waldner
WTTC 2001 MT QF Boll 2-0 WLQ | MS R32 Boll 3-2 Zhan Jian (before representing SGP), R16 Boll 0-3 Chiang Peng-Lung | XD R32
WTTC 2003 MS R64 Boll 2-4 Qiu Yike | MD R16 Boll/Fejer-Konnerth 1-4 WLQ/Yan Sen
WTTC 2004 MT (unique stage 2 format) A1-B1 Boll 1-3 MLin, F Boll 0-3 WH
WTTC 2005 MS R16 Boll 3-4 Liu Guozheng | MD SF Boll/Suss 4-1 MLin/CQ, F Boll/Suss 1-4 WH/KLH
WTTC 2006 MT SF Boll 3-2 MLin, Boll 2-3 WLQ
WTTC 2007 MS QF Boll 0-4 RSM | MD QF Boll/Suss 2-4 Chang Yen-Shu/Chiang Peng-Lung
WTTC 2008 Did not play due to injury
WTTC 2009 Did not play due to injury
WTTC 2010 MT F Boll 3-2 ML, Boll 1-3 MLin
WTTC 2011 MS QF Boll 4-1 CQ, SF Boll 1-4 ZJK
WTTC 2012 MT F Boll 2-3 ZJK
WTTC 2013 MS QF Boll 2-4 ML
WTTC 2014 MT F Boll 0-3 ML
WTTC 2015 MS QF Boll 2-4 FZD | MD R32 Boll/ML 2-4 XX/ZJK
WTTC 2016 MT Grp Boll 0-3 Lebesson, 2-3 Gauzy
WTTC 2017 MS QF Boll 2-4 ML | MD R16 Boll/ML 1-4 FZD/XX
WTTC 2018 MT F Boll 0-3 ML
WTTC 2019 MS R16 Boll 0-4 W/O JWJ (withdrew due to injury) | MD QF Boll/Franziska W/O 0-4 Apolonia/Monteiro (withdrew due to injury)
WTTC 2020 Not held due to COVID-19
WTTC 2021 MS R64 Boll 4-1 ZQH, SF Boll 2-4 Moregard | MD R32 Boll/Franziska 0-3 FZD/WCQ
WTTC 2022 Did not play due to COVID-19 restrictions
WTTC 2023 Did not play due to injury

Edited by zeio - 07/19/2023 at 12:25am
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stiltt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/18/2023 at 11:25am
The ball was always not round enough or outright broken.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/18/2023 at 1:44pm
Waldner managed to beat at least 1 CNT player between 1987-2000, that is 8 WTTC consecutively (2 CNT players at '87, '89, '95 and '97).

The notion that China was weaker during that era should be put to rest now.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykonos96 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/19/2023 at 9:36pm
Originally posted by stiltt stiltt wrote:

The ball was always not round enough or outright broken.
China was so weak in 1991 that they couldnt reach the final , almost all players were fired.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Simon_plays Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2023 at 4:07am
Originally posted by zeio zeio wrote:

Waldner managed to beat at least 1 CNT player between 1987-2000, that is 8 WTTC consecutively (2 CNT players at '87, '89, '95 and '97).

The notion that China was weaker during that era should be put to rest now.

That is an amazing statistic. To put it in hyperbolic form: Waldner dominated Chinese players at the World Championships over 3 decades!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2023 at 7:28am
Another way to look at the stats is the number of times the said player has played against China.

Waldner
WTTC 1983-2000
12/22=54.5%

Boll
WTTC 2001-2021
6/19=31.6%
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Simon_plays View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Simon_plays Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2023 at 7:53am
Originally posted by zeio zeio wrote:

Another way to look at the stats is the number of times the said player has played against China.

Waldner
WTTC 1983-2000
12/22=54.5%

Boll
WTTC 2001-2021
6/19=31.6%

Making Boll the second most successful player against the CNT in living memory.
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