New Triangle TT Club Policies Seem Better

Thank you Mark for clarifying the issues.  It's unfortunate that TTT got a lot of negative and inaccurate reports.

mjamja wrote: mts388 wrote: Thank you Mark for clarifying the issues.  It's unfortunate that TTT got a lot of negative and inaccurate reports. I think the initial report was correct based on what was posted on Triangle's website originally.  It seems the policies have been updated.  I do not know if they changed their minds on the policies or if the originals were poorly written and did not accurately reflect what they actually meant to do.  The new policies are clearer on most of the issues raised in the original thread. Mark

They were changed. What was on there yesterday was different than what is on there now. 

I started going there just after the whole ordeal, and I still can hardly believe it. The whole family is really quite pleasant. I’ve joked that maybe he has some hidden dragon inside him, but really from day one they’ve always gone out of their way for a friendly chat. Even at my first tournament, I had a payout dispute (given less than what the sheet said by the front desk person) and the owner took me at my word, checked the sheet, and fixed it right away. (I can’t remember if it was cash or check, if it was a check then he didn’t even ask to see it, I just remember being shocked that the ordeal was handled so smoothly). Obviously he could have checked the money on hand then or later to verify the difference, but being a new face and being trusted like that was cool. And it wasn’t a shady underhand on the first pay out, definitely an honest mistake, now knowing the person who handled it. The place was a zoo that day, and it wasn’t so much prize money to even be worth trying to be sneaky. I think I’ve told this story here before, but I’m sharing again just in case because they seem like good people and the club deserves longevity, imo.

Their posting the new policy was reason for starting this new thread.

ttforlife wrote: What are your thoughts on a business owner that could potentially go out of business soon but doesn't tell anyone, accepts $1000's in payments from well off parents for kids prepaid lessons without warning them of the situation, and says sorry you can't have your $1000's back because I (magically)  don't have it anymore! On the outside it seems like they're trying so hard to keep the club open, but the reality is the rent is too high compared to monthly memberships and the owner knows it. A lot of people will get burned soon and potentially will have no recourse on prepaid memberships or prepaid lessons. If anyone is going to play at TTT I highly suggest you do monthly memberships and do not prepay lessons. There is a badminton investor that is trying to convert the club and keep it alive, but I would not count on it.

I found it unusual that their recently announced Dec tournament is an under 2600 instead of an open. Seems like they don't want Jishan there.

The monthly rent is around 23k. Mid November they were behind rent by several weeks. A badminton investor injected 50,000 to save the club and they are trying to add additional badminton courts before a competitor opens next year. The nearby badminton club is always packed so they are hoping to gain some market share I guess.

As a local NC Table Tennis coach in the Raleigh area, I was one of the original people included in the ban. My ban came by way of a text message that the owner sent to my student, and he requested it be forwarded to me. I told my student that I don't want to be banned by way of a text message that was screenshot to me that shows his phone number. If he owned a business, then he would send it to me by way of his official email account at TTT. The other 2 people were sent official emails banning them.

Let me state that, I don't frequent TTT. Only for tournaments my students attend.

I worked at TTT from March 2017 to Sept 2018. I left TTT because it was bleeding tens of thousands of dollars of cash each month, and for the 18 months I was there I didn't have a positive or negative affect on the company's bottom line. At this same time the original owner was trying to get from under this money pit, and she offered the ownership to me and 3 other members on the management staff. Over time, all three of them declined because they knew it was the Titanic with the ice berg in sight.

So, I was the only one that was still in for being an owner. I considered it for about 2 months, and then I looked at the numbers with my lawyer that is a table tennis player. My lawyer informed me that based on how much money the owner was gifting me to take over, I would be out of business in 8 months. Plus, my reputation would take a hit as being the person that was the owner when TTT went out of business. So, I walked away from the job with no notice, but not without a plan. I wanted to jump ship while everyone was wondering why I would do such a thing, because all of this would come crashing down, and I want to make sure I had already created a soft landing spot for myself.

Because I signed a 1-year non-compete, I couldn't coach in the surrounding 4 counties, which make up the majority of all the table tennis lessons. So I created a regional coaching program where I would drive from Raleigh to Myrtle Beach, Charleston, and Savannah three days back to back as to not violate the non-compete. I was making the same amount of money in 3 days, as I was in 7 days at TTT. That meant I had 4 days off to really enjoy being a father, husband, and family man.

Let me state that, I don't frequent TTT. Only for tournaments my students attend.

One of the greatest gifts I could receive during that period is TTT not changing the email of the manager's account. That meant I knew everything that was going on. From which coaches that would take over my classes when I left. The private investigator that was hired to follow me (Yes, they have followed all the players that quit or got fired) to make sure that I was not coaching locally. To the current owner coming to TTT for an interview. I knew weeks ahead of time who would be the new owner. But he didn't know the numbers, the new area, the table tennis people, or how the Chinese controlled the table tennis terrain. He would learn pretty quickly.

It was official that TTT was sold (Really Gifted) to the new owner in the middle of December. It was like, "Here, take this money, and take this problem I created, and he took it. In the actual press release where the original owner explained the company was shifting hands, at the end of the press release, there was a link promoting the XIOM Ice Cream blade. Keep in mind, this is a BUTTERFLY....SPONSORED...CLUB. The new owner walked in wearing XIOM, while still under contract with Butterfly. That is the first sign of the type of person he would later become.

After the news, all my local students begged me to give the new owner a chance. They wanted their lessons, and they really didn't want to wait another 6 months. So, I contacted the owner and explained to him at the request of my students we should sit and talk. He was not interested in having a conversation with me about returning. He wanted to know my motive. If you don't know, the owner of Butterfly taught me how to play, and for that reason I have been “Team Butterfly” for my entire life. TTT is a Butterfly sponsored club at the time, and the owner knew he would not renew a deal with Butterfly. What he wanted to know from me is, would I be loyal to TTT when he ended the agreement. He wanted to know if Butterfly and I were going to be a threat to him by opening a club to compete. I told him I would NOT sell out Butterfly.

Let me state that, I don't frequent TTT. Only for tournaments my students attend.

I went back to Butterfly and explained that the owner was fishing to find out if we would get together and compete. So we decided to present something to the owner to let him know that we aren’t interested in being a threat and splitting the customers into two clubs. Butterfly agree to not open a club within 5 miles of TTT if Butterfly stayed on as club sponsor, and I would come back as an Independent Contractor, and my cut would 70% for me, and 30% of the hourly coaching.

At this same time the owner sent me a new contract, and this is when he really showed me his character. My old contract had a "1-year non-compete", and the new contract had a "2-yr non-compete". Strike One! The contract I signed with TTT in 2017, I still retained 100% ownership of my company, Dynamic Table Tennis, and I could still create projects for my site. The new contract stated that signing a contract with TTT would mean that they now own all the intellectual property that I have created before, and any other projects I created would now be owned by TTT. Strike Two!

Soon after Butterfly informed me that the owner rejected their first offer. He suggested I strongly try to come to a deal, because he really wanted me to still coach his father. So, I sent an email back explaining that if he eliminated the non-compete period to zero, and TTT would at no point own any of my intellectual property, I would sign with TTT. I got an email back rejecting my changes. The owner of TTT said he didn't want anyone coaching that would be loyal to equipment supplier.

So I took that back to my clients to let them know that I went over and beyond to try to come to a deal. But I wouldn’t sign a slave deal and give up my life’s work and put myself in a worst position if I left again. He instantly loss 15 to 20 members that I have slow brought them back to TTT because I am more concerned about my students progress as opposed to the owner offering such a sour deal, that they feel a need to stand with me. I told them to stand for your table tennis improvement.

The next scandal that loss the owner a huge amount of members was banning Jerred Miklowcic. This was a terrible move, backed up by even more terrible decisions. When TTT opened, Jerred won a raffle, and was TTT's first member. He was a model student, model club member, took lessons, attended tournaments, as well as his wife taking lessons and being a member. The owner banned Jerred because he complained on Facebook about not being able to use the balls he had just purchased to practice his serve. Then he did something worst after that. He forced the TTT Tournament Director to remove him from Cary Cup, which was ILLEGAL. Then he called Jerred a plant for Butterfly because I was training with him at University of North Carolina.

Let me state that, I don't frequent TTT. Only for tournaments my students attend.

After a firestorm of members leave, he wanted to sit with him. He told Jerred he could sit and talk, but he couldn't bring his lawyer, and he couldn't record the conversation. That means the owner was going to lie, and wanted no one to question him. That is the characteristics of a "Tyrant". You wondering if it stops, and the answer to that is "Not At All".

While all of this is happening, 2 employees quit, and on was fired in the span of 5 days. That was because the owner had loss half of the money he was gifted in 4 months, and he has to do something. But he did it in such an abrasive way that all the members turned on him. So TTT turned into what we see at a Chinese take out joint, family owned. Nothing wrong with, but he forced people out, lowered people hours to make them quit, and asked people to do things that were illegal. Tyrant!

I realize that some people can’t handle what power gives them. It gives them a sense of power over others. Because, I got a phone call that TTT was considering suing me. What! I was allegedly being sued for preventing TTT from making money. The story is a coach contacted me to ask if should take a job at TTT. My answer was "YES", but to not move in August, but to move in May. TTT has always made the most amount of money June-Aug because of the summer camps groups. My friend wanted to come in August, and I said that was a bad idea, because kids will be going back to school. That means the kids wouldn't get back into the swing of things until October after they had gotten their study schedules together. That is not a good time to come because the coaching would be low.

This was the only time that I called the owner up and chewed him out. I then realized he is tough behind the scenes, but not when I confronted him. It is the only time I have been overly animated, because he needed to know if you are going to come for me, you better have a good reason instead of throwing your weight around. He said it was a misunderstanding, backed down, and apologized. He got called out, and he showed he wasn't about what he was talking about. He was about that action.

Let me state that, I don't frequent TTT. Only for tournaments my students attend.

What the owner didn't like was people coming to him saying, "Brian said". I was giving advice to my friend, because I knew he needed a bigger headstart from August. The owner would be out of money in November and he needed to have his client list big enough to move those people away once TTT went out of business.

And that is exactly what happened. In late October people started contacting me saying the owner was asking for money to kick the TTT business down the road. It looks like a group had come together to give the owner an influx of cash, and it was because they wanted the club, NOT him.

An email was forwarded to me stating he had not paid the rent for November, and after paying the rent and payroll, he would have $2000.00 in the bank. Which means he is essentially "Out of Business". So I sent that screenshot to my friend and asked if he had an exit plan. My friend that is a coach there was NOT even aware that TTT was in dire financial straits. See, the owner was pulling the wool over his eyes because he needed the revenue generators in the dark about how bad it was, because they could walk, and he had no way to generate revenue.

So, on that day that he was begging the people to save him (Nov 15^th) from failing at being the owner, and forcing member to quit because of crude policies, I was moving into my new 4-bedroom home. That would have or could have been me, and exiting 14 months early before there was any rumbling of trouble is 35 years of table tennis wisdom on my part. Yes, I'm patting myself on the back.

I think I have stated many times to almost irritate you that I "Don't" frequent TTT. I only go there to coach my students, so why would I get banned, and what actually saved TTT.

An Indian Badminton Millionaire is how TTT got saved. The owner came in, gave an influx of cash. This cash is being used to raise the lights to make it building badminton compliant. Badminton has a list of 500 local players that may bring in a large influx of cash through membership and services. In addition, 2 badminton coaches are being hired. This is how TTT was saved. Not by the 30 members that had pledged $40k, because he didn't want conditions along with that money. He wanted more cash and a better profile to succeed, and that is what he got.

Now, if you got what you wanted in having your business saved, why would you create such a crude policy by banning people? The answer is, what has happened to him he took deeply personal. He treated people bad, and people treated him back bad. He brought this all on himself. I understand why he banned one of the outside TTT coaches. That player walked in the building, profiled himself there to train. That innocent thing had 2 things happen. People found out he coaches at another center, and the owner may have loss revenue. In the process of being there, 2 of the top 3 juniors in TTT left Triangle and started taking lessons with this coach. I don't know if that player meant for that to happen, but it did so I understand why he got a ban letter.

The other person is the owner of the only other club in the area that is open 7 days week. This person brings his daughter to TTT to get training with the other kids. What he did was innocent in nature, but he would indirectly have people leave TTT to support his club, especially if they are Chinese. I don't think this person did it on purpose, but I do understand why the owner of TTT sent a ban letter to him as well.

So why ban a person that doesn't even frequent TTT besides on tournament days? My guess is he is sick of me being involved behind the scene. The truth is, I don't want to be involved at any level. What he can't accept is people coming to me to tell me all this information that is suppose to be private. My advise to the owner is, STHU talking to so many people, because they are selling you out. Him banning me was a way to rage at me, because I haven't displayed myself in TTT to promote my coaching.

There is a reason that I left TTT the way I did. It is because I can build my client list anywhere, and I don't need to profile in TTT to do that. My non-compete was over Sept 4th, and since then I have built up a client list in town, and some of them are members at TTT. They are all people that I coached before the current person was owner. See, he believes those people belong to him. And the truth is, those people belong to "No one". All of my students have gone up to him to let him know that they are taking lessons with me. They didn't need to tell him that, because they don't owe him anything, so I don't either. I still travel to coach, and I’m going to keep that program, so I am not a local threat, but he still sees me as one.

Has the policy has changed back? YES. But to what, because that state is nothing, implicates no one? But, he is still the same person that wrote that policy. He did it from an extremely mean spirited place. There were so many conflicts in that first policy, that it wouldn't hold water. Jim McQueen, a local legend has a club that is open on Friday night. And he is on the advisory board at TTT. So, he would be banned, also? He didn’t think this out at all. He was impulsive like a kid making a fast decision. He has made enough fast decisions that were bad. Time to wise up.

He has taken down the policy, and he told one of my students that what he is going to do going forward is going to be on a "Case By Case" basis. So, don't give him credit for being a nice guy by taking the policy off the website. Give him credit when he finds a way to coexist with other players, coaches, and club owners that are entitled to the same piece of table tennis pie.

I haven't said anything about my leaving TTT, or my experience with the new owner since he took over. This has been my experience, and I wanted it to come from the account I have on this forum, so you would know it is not a person that is fake. I can tell by some of these responses I this thread that TTT put those people up to that to control the narrative. No one likes the owner, so the person that says he is nice, is flat out lying. What I will say is, the wife is a sweetheart. She smooths out his extremely rough edges, and it is main reason all the members haven't walked out.

I have created a beautiful life in this sport, and the reason I have had a long career is because I have been respectful of the table tennis terrain, and I have never had a corporate cutthroat attitude. I do apologize for this novel of a post on this thread (Get back to work now). Lol!

Keep Looping

Brian Pace

Thanks Brian.  So good to get much more first hand information.

Brian, thanks for the first-hand information.

Thanks for the info Brian.

My friend said there are less people.  He said he can park really close when he shows up whereas before he had to park near the end of the lot.

Brian,