Not in 2,0mm though.  That's probably want caused the question.

Will have 2.0 mm in stock early/mid Feb.

I've used my set of rubbers (one M and one M+) for about 3 weeks - approx 35 hours of playing time.  So far, there are noticeable but minor sings of wear on the topsheet, but no noticeable loss of grip or sponge performance.

I'm typically very happy if I get more than 50 hours of play from my rubber sheet.  So far Karis looks promising in this aspect.

Perhaps long pip players, especially 'pushblockers' should switch to Karis, ha-ha

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So do I - one of the top players in a league I play at asked me whether I was using Chinese rubber since I was using Karis M on an OFF- blade - he kept wondering how I was able to keep some of his balls on the table.

I never played with Yasaka Visco, but used Yasaka Mark V for few years, and my vague recollections from over three decades ago (when I used Mark V) point to meaningful similarities in feel and playing performance between Karis and glued Mark V.

Having said so, like Mark V, I believe that Karis M is very versatile, predictable/controllable attacking rubber suitable to a wide variety of players of different skill levels.  It's also grippy enough to allow for generating very good amount of spin, while not being particularly sensitive to incoming spin, especially in short game.

It can generate more than enough spin on serves at 2250-2300 level. Here are raw clips, uncut of real match.

Start at 2.40 - I started using no spin/underspin serve and took control of this match from this point.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDHNt-gCZ80

Took many easy points from "simple" serves.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndZAix3DQ24

Wow - I used to play with Visco (loved it) and speed-glued Mark V (also loved it). If what you are writing is correct, you'll see one giddy guy out on the circuit.  

I enjoyed using Airoc M when it first came out on my BH side, but its odd shiny topsheet didn't suit my brushy FH at all.  Most of what I liked about it came from the sponge - it's really interesting in comparison with many other porous sponges.  If you detach the topsheet from the sponge (from a cut-off obviously), the sponge doesn't have huge elastic strength but it does stretch on and on for a long time before it breaks.  Unlike most ESN and tenergy sponges which feel brittle in comparison and break up easily.  It gives a very smooth feel - no unexpected jumpiness, very linear delivery.

Airoc's downside for me was that topsheet - better than Calibra Tour for sure, but it just wasn't spinny enough for me in comparison with other options.  This suits other players more of course, but not for me.  The Samba 19 had a different topsheet feel and was more matte and had some better early grab, but had a grainy, rough texture which reminds me of budget rubbers (it actually reminded me of Joola Zack's topsheet in many ways, and I don't mean in a good way).  Top-end spin was poor on that one.

And here comes Karis.  These sponges are all good IMO, and bring some interesting qualities - all it needs to do is bring better topsheet grip and I'm sold.  Early signs (by finger-poking only so far) are good, and I'm looking forward to giving them a proper run-out.  The pips definitely look very short in comparison with the others (and with most rubbers in general), and the topsheet material looks much improved (no plastic-y initial slip like Airoc, a very smooth texture unlike Samba).  So it's all positive so far.  I'll be back with at-the-table impressions as soon as I can.

I know you are a blade expert but Baal likes Koto, I like limba.  You figure it out and let us know. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqm2Ehi3a6c

You applied the glue and the rubber shrunk? how is that possible?

You can get almost all the same results with Donic Varioclean.  And you don't need to leave it out a full night either.

No, you didn't commit a crime.  You only got what you asked for.  And I have played around with 4 sheets of M and 4 sheets of M+ - I have never even felt they were capable of shrinking, though I am obviously biased.

It is not about cost - it is about absolute ease of use and consistency.

How do you apply it? I use this and it works fine:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003BMGAFI/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I have no problems paying more for branded glue - I have 2 tubes of Nittaku Finezip that shall stay unused. I tried it and went back to TM. Finezip takes small bits of sponge out when you remove rubber from blade.

I don't get the 'too many layers bit'. Nowadays, even on Spruce outer blades, I use max 2 thin layers of TM on blade and 2 thin layers on sponge. That is not too much.

The keys are:

For the majority here for whom Karis is the final answer, 

Apparently some top CNT guys have adopted it as well (Fang Bo and Yan An).

Have you used Karis, slevin?

I was pretty surprised that Baal liked Karis, to be honest, but it seems that what stood out for me with Karis also had value to him.  I can see why it might lack value to a player who is essentially in need of short stroke speed and spin (in which case, there is always the Tenergy series or one of many ESN variants).

I never felt that way when using Razka X.  And it wasn't that I needed a faster blade for Karis as I Was mostly beating people I beat and losing to people I lost to - I was still playing at 2000 level with Karis and my old Yasaka Extra.  I just realized that I could clearly use one as I understood what the rubber was doing.  No, it's not just a speed thing, but a connection of thought and action.

The first time I used Karis M+ on a faster blade, I used it on an Innerforce ALC.  A 2200+ player I beat for the first time in over a year said I had gone to a slower blade.  Obviously I hadn't.  But what he found interesting was that I wasn't putting his spinniest loops into the sky and off the table.  He thought I might be using a Chinese rubber but as I have said elsewhere, I don't have the stroke for those things or I would use them.  So no, Karis is not a slow rubber.  And if I am trying to spin, I am not that concerned about speed usually.  It's just that why should you give up the opportunity to add more speed when you have that much control?  

I played with a Garaydia ZLC for the first time the past two days.  I was able to play at the same level with Karis with it that I do with other blades.  The balls were faster, but I never felt I was confused as to what was happening when I missed the ball long or failed to get arc.  I don't remember making shots like this with any carbon blade before:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZKrMIR-YSY&feature=youtu.be&t=2390

NL: no, I have not tried Karis. But I get de-sensitized by some who proclaim whatever they use currently is the bestest and the greatest (whether it is Baracuda, Hexer, MX-S, T05 or Big Dipper or whatever else is new).

However, in today's day and age of $30 new-gen Tensors that are, frankly, pretty good, I find it difficult to pony up $50 + shipping.

So, my not trying Karis is not because it would not be a good rubber (I believe in Baal's recommendations). I am hesitant to pay the premium cost though.

Either ways, I am a Nexy supporter - they fill a void and I like their marketing style that is penetrative without being expensive. My suggestion is to price it similarly to their competition - if I can buy 4 new-gen Tensors for $30 each, I hope that we all should be able to buy 4 Karis for the same price. 

Same for the blades - I love where Donic priced their Ovtcharov True Carbon and also their 'WC89 series. I hope Nexy follows suit.

Sigh - so my criticism of your EJing without your disclosing your level to keep context really gets to you so much that you describe my EJing that way?  Oh, well...  

I think I do a fairly good job describing the rubber accurately at my level.  I liked the rubbers you listed enough to switch to them, but I never considered them the bestest and often described them in terms of the particular problem I was trying to solve vs the prior rubber I used.  There are lots of other rubbers that I give good, objective or invisible reviews without ever switching to them or talking about my switching to them : EL-S, FX-S, EL-P, OVT,  Rakza X, Rakza X Soft, Donic Bluefire, Rasant Grip etc.

Personal attacks and other motivations aside, if you want a slightly lower price with first class mail or a drive by delivery, you can PM me.

KAris claims to be innovative and prices itself in the same range as Airoc and Regalis Blue - I think you as a freemarket advocate supports people pricing and getting rewarded freely.  If they just piggybacked on another ESN derivative, I would get your POV though.

re: Karis - IMO, it is good if Karis represents another type of rubber besides the ones that we have that can mostly be categorized into 4 kinds {(1) Mark V - like or slightly souped up, (2) Tenergy (3) new-gen ESN variants and (4) Chinese}.

As I said, I like Nexy - I sometimes like his thought process and have tried out his blades in the past. I just don't think I need to try an alternative to types 2 and 3 from the list above as they work for me (as they do for a vast majority of the populace).

re: my EJism - 

SLevin, you need to somehow try and fall in love with Karis, so you can sell me your tenergy 05 at throwaway price, just kidding :)

Guys we are all the same level pretty much, amateurs who like different equipment and its one of the things that keeps us interested in the game, there is always something new to try just for kicks. 

Understood.  You are a family man at a different stage in life so your perspective is a little different from a single man like myself.  Some people say I should not play with my arthritis at all, at least competitively.  It all comes down to priorities and probably ignoring what one knows will inevitably result, but my point on this issue is always the same - I am against people discussing equipment on forums without hinting at their level close to their statements.  It is good to know that you keep your equipment stable.  I have met a few people who would consider you 2200+ based on your forum comments and are surprised when I tell them that you play at their level or in some cases lower.  Maybe if you stated your level and goals next to your statements more often, such misconceptions would not occur as often?

As for Nexy Karis, where would you class Calibra and Airoc in your scheme?  Group 1?

I'm waiting until next week to comment on Karis in any depth (only 2 hours so far), but the rubber it's closest to from my back catalog is Airoc.  I haven't tried some of the more recent rubbers from the same factory though (ITC, Regalis) - they may be closer again.  But it's closer to Airoc than any ESN, or Butterfly, or pre-glue-ban classic, or chinese rubber.

However, the comparison with Airoc is mostly centred around the sponge and lack of catapult (i.e. linearity).  Good qualities to share.  Karis' topsheet is much, much better in almost every way than Airoc IMO.  It's more like the rubber I hoped Airoc would be when yogi mentioned that it was going to use the Calibra topsheet.  Again - it isn't the Calibra topsheet either, but it fixes so many problems I had with Airoc's topsheet that it becomes something else.

I don't think it's revolutionary or the second coming, but it's a really honest, sensible evolution of something like an Airoc, pushed more towards the middle of the market where amateur players want a bit of everything without rough edges or extreme behaviour.  If you've tried Airoc and liked it, but found the topsheet lacking in grip in comparison with other rubbers, Karis is definitely worth a look.

AndySmith,

But while it is not revolutionary or the second coming to you since you always ducked Tenergy for more controllable stuff even when it wasn't as spinny, it might be to people who may not even realize how much they are struggling with the non-linear behavior of other rubbers because they want to keep the spin.  The traditional solution for some people is to go Chinese or traditional - I prefer this, because the level of spin is competitive with what I am used to.

I will take a picture of Nittaku Narucross GS Soft for you sometime.  The pip structure is different, but the thin topsheet is similar.

My experience with Airoc Astro S was that it had great catapult and acted similar to FX-P 

in regards to the sponge.  Can I safely conclude that Airoc and Airoc Astro are completely 

opposites in regards to their sponge (Airoc being linear and Airoc Astro being more like Tenergy)?  

Also, how would you compare Karis to Tibhar Hybrid K1?  Hybrid K1 is also has a very linear sponge 

with a more elastic feel and non-tacky top sheet compared to typical Chinese rubber.

Thanks for your valuable opinions.

About Astro - possibly.  I've only used Astro S in a bonkers 2.3mm sponge version and really didn't like it at the time, but I don't think my time with that one is worth the comparison from me.  

When I say it isn't revolutionary, I mean it isn't some enormous leap forward in the industry, or a brand new paradigm of wonderfulness.  What it seems to me to be (so far, anyway) is a very cleverly designed package which moves into a space in the market where there hasn't been a lot of activity or focus in recent years.  It isn't quite in a class of its own, but it isn't far off.  There have been a lot of "mild" ESN rubbers recently with more on the way, but I still feel that karis is more stable than the ones I've tried in that group (although it's also more expensive also).

If all you've used is extreme rubbers at the far end of one spectrum or another (spin for tenergy, speed for take-your-pick, etc) then Karis will feel...different for sure.  I'd be cautious about a blanket recommendation to tenergy/mx-p users because so many players seem to rely on the easy spin or large catapult the market leaders offer, and aren't prepared to sacrifice them for almost anything.  Even if they would play better with it, objectively.

onehander wrote: Andy,  so in your opinion Karis is closest to Airoc.  And the sponges are both very linear.  My experience with Airoc Astro S was that it had great catapult and acted similar to FX-P  in regards to the sponge.  Can I safely conclude that Airoc and Airoc Astro are completely  opposites in regards to their sponge (Airoc being linear and Airoc Astro being more like Tenergy)?

Well, no.  As above, I've only used a super-thick Astro S for a very short period of time so I can't compare reliably.  And I haven't heard many people compare Astro to Tenergy...

Karis M is similar in terms of linearity to Airoc M.  The Airoc S versions were a lot softer and that brings all the usual soft sponge caveats, including more catapulty behaviour.  I'm glad there isn't a Karis S at this point.  Best to focus on the medium sponge versions for the purpose of this comparison.

Again, worth saying that the Karis topsheet is very different to Airoc's, and that's great.  I find Karis to be closest to Airoc when considering esn or butterfly as alternative comparisons, but the topsheet on karis moves it away from Airoc so much that you shouldn't expect it to be a slight variation on the Airoc theme.  It's makes a big difference.  I'd have Karis over Airoc any day of the week, and I'm not an Airoc basher in particular.

onehander wrote: Also, how would you compare Karis to Tibhar Hybrid K1?  Hybrid K1 is also has a very linear sponge  with a more elastic feel and non-tacky top sheet compared to typical Chinese rubber.

K1's topsheet is semi-tacky - definitely not non-tacky.  Just less tacky than typical chinese, sure.

Honestly, I don't want to get too dragged in to loads of comparisons at this stage.  I really want to try Karis on a wider range of blades and to give it more time.  But!  K1 is actually an interesting one to ask about because it sits in the same general zone as karis, but arrives there by different means.  The overall speeds are pretty similar, but K1's tack keeps the low-end speed a bit lower.  K1 brush loops better (as you'd expect), and maybe it has the edge on spin on hard loops too.  Karis is better almost everywhere else though, and is easier to use.  Karis is also more linear overall and just by being non-tacky brings big advantages for smashing, driving, countering.  

Honestly, the ease at which you can totally dominate other players who give you spinny, but high, balls with Karis makes you want to laugh.  I can't think of another rubber where you can just put those balls away without fear, without making noticeable sacrifices in other areas (the topsheet grip mainly).  Take Calibra Tour for example - you barely feel incoming spin with that, so hitting through spinny, high loops is a lot easier than super-reactive tenergy types.  But then you come to loop yourself and it's like anti in some respects - it demands a lot of your timing, positioning.  Karis hits a sweet spot where hitting through spin is far easier than it should be based on how spinny it is when you're putting your own on.

NextLevel's early comparison with the original Rhyzm is a good one.  Not so much in terms of feel, or overall speed, or catapult, but in how you use it, and the balance it can bring to your game.

AndySmith,

I hesitated to recommend it to Tenergy users for exactly the reason you gave despite being a Tenergy user myself just before switching to it.  Baal's review did pleasantly surprise me though.  I am not so much concerned with whether anyone likes it or not - I am more concerned with whether they get the same feeling of linear control that people coming to it from Tenergy experience, especially if they were not Tenergy users before coming to Karis.

not the new ones the original bluefire

It was I who brought the comparison to lightly glued Mark V, even though (as I disclosed) it's been very long time since I used Mark V and my recollections are vague.  I also realize, that comparisons like this are quite subjective, so perhaps others might feel differently.

However, I will still stand by that comparison because when I played with a glued Mark V it was the last time I used a rubber that was that versatile, linear, controllable (in short game and away from the table), predictable, spinny enough,  and fast enough for me ... which resulted in a feeling that I knew exactly what was going on with almost every shot I hit or mishit.   Oh, another rubber that comes to mind when I had somewhat similar feeling of control was glued Stiga Mendo MP, though MP was meaningfully faster than Mark V, if I recall correctly.

It is very likely that Karis has a totally different sponge, pip structure, topsheet material, etc.  I don't know much about this kind of stuff - I rely mostly how the rubber feels to me and how it behaves when play with it.   

My opinions are based on playing with M+ on FH and M on BH for about a month, or between 45 and 50 hours of total play on the same blade - Nexy Calix II.  I'm an experienced, aging (LOL) but still a decent level player, who doesn't believe that equipment meaningfully affects my level of play, though it definitely has a meaningful impact on my level of enjoyment ... and I enjoy Karis quite a bit.

 

Baal wrote: I agree with nearly everytbing Andy said  except one thing.  i actually think Karis is a paradigm shift because of the structure and behavior of the topsheet, primarily the pips.   Of course what to me seems important could seem less so to other people.  I attach great importance to it, more than Andy, and personally think is is every bit as innovative as Tenergy sponge was in 2008.

Yeah, I agree with NL's analysis but not 100% his conclusion because "worse" means different things to different people of course.  I love OVA and always struggle to find something that works better on my FH wing.  I had very low expectations that karis would be an option on my FH simply because I'm so used to OVA and what it does, and it might pan out that way in the end.

OVA's topsheet is one of the grippiest on the market and it supports a heavy brush loop.  As NL says, this makes it very spin sensitive as well, and this is a trade-off I can accept because OVA's hard sponge takes the edge off in most circumstances.  If OVA had a bouncier sponge, or more catapult, it would be too much for me to handle and I would have dropped it ages ago.

Karis M+ gets close to the sponge hardness of OVA, but the topsheet has less grip.  This makes it easier to use in lots of situations, but far less dangerous for the opponent on a brush loop.  The personal question for me is similar to that faced by many other eurojap users when thinking about karis - can I sacrifice the big thing I use and rely on in my current rubber, and trade it off against real-world performance and reduced errors?  I don't know.

Everyone has their personal preferences but for brush looping, OVA is not that much better than Karis M (not M+).   M+ is too fast. 

Thanks, Next Level and Andy.  I bought OVA last year partially based on the reviews that both of you gave it.  I enjoyed the topsheet grip and the blocking and control on a lot of shots. But I used it for close to 5 months and could never completely feel comfortable with the hard sponge--Maybe because of what Next Level said about it requiring so much effort on hard strokes.

When it's time for me to purchase new rubbers, I will definitely consider Karis M.

Which of the Frienship rubbers were you using when we played today?  Did you use them to wrap your injured knee?  

thats y i use tenergy

just for the knee even tho 729 does wonders for the knee

Karis M - Red - 2.0mm

Karis M+ - Black - 2.2mm

I don't think that there isn't much point covering the same ground as above for M+, but if anyone wants more detail here then please ask.  Essentially it's the same topsheet on a harder sponge of course, but the hardness is a fair whack more.  I found the spin on brush loops to be higher but the throw overall to be lower.  Speed is higher in general (and seems to be much higher on faster blades, whereas regular M didn't seem to give the same jump in speed), and although the character remains very linear the middle gears are less "flexible" - what I'm trying to convey is that M+ doesn't have the same degree of usability in middle effort shots because the arc stays lower for the same effort.  M+ retains the Karis standout of easy play and stability, especially on counters (really easy to hit through spin, given enough height to work with), and performs better for punches, but the extra speed and hardness is gained at the loss of some of the magic middle gear fluidity (I can't think of a better description for it).  Whereas it's hard to think of direct comparisons with M, I feel that M+ has more in common with other highly linear, hard-sponged, direct-playing rubbers like Acuda Blue P1 Turbo.

All that said, at this stage I had a slight preference for M+ on my FH wing over M simply because I'm used to harder sponges on that wing and everything that comes with them.

Note - following the review section above is a record of the initial sessions I had with Karis and my stream-of-consciousness thoughts about the rubber as time went on.  Hopefully it will add background and detail to the summery review above, but if you aren't interested in how things unfolded then please stop now and do not read on - I do not want to waste your precious time.

Out of the packet there is a slight dome, no obvious tuning smell but a moderately sharp rubbery/chemical smell, and the quality is very high (only odd thing is that the M+ is quite a bit smaller than the M when uncut).  Karis shares the dome and smell with other rubbers I've used from the same factory - Airoc, Samba 27.  They're both slightly lighter than ESN or Butterfly equivalents in the same class, but they're not featherweights by any means.

Although there are some similarities with stablemates like Airoc (the sponge being the main thing), the topsheets are totally unlike anything I've seen from this factory before (I haven't tried some recent releases though).  They don't have the shiny finish of the Airocs and have good grip right from the start of a finger rub.  The red sheet looks a bit dull in colour in comparison with ESN/Butterfly, but top quality regardless.

They're easy to cut but I find the slight dome makes fixing to the blade slightly more awkward than, say. recent ESN rubbers which lay totally flat.  It reminds me a little of the slight dome you get with older-gen ESN like Aurus or Rakza 7, which I also found needed a touch of care when slicking down.

A quick bounce test is interesting - the difference between M and M+ is large with M+ being quite a lot harder overall than M.  Spin test is very, very promising with both sheets showing excellent grip and high rotation on wristy brushes.  The black M+ seems a bit spinnier to me (and more reactive to the spin of the dropping ball), but that could just be the sponge hardness helping out in a simple test like this.

I decided to go with the blade I've been using most recently - the Zoom Balance.  It's a fairly stiff 6.2mm thick allround+ blade, medium/soft feel, limba outers, 92g, solid.  Regular rubbers are 402 Limber on BH and Omega V Asia on FH.

During warm up it becomes obvious that both M and M+ aren't the fastest rubbers out there.  This is fine for me - my regular setup isn't massively fast, and these compare well enough for me.  But as someone who has already taken a step away from catapult monsters like MX-P, and from jumpy, highly-reactive spin freaks like T05, I already know which side my bread is buttered.  Karis falls right in my target zone for controlled attack in terms of speed, but people who are used to the fastest rubbers out there should know that this is a small step down in raw speed.  Karis has a lot of excellent properties itself though, so if speed is the only issue then a blade change could be an option.  If you're already using MX-P on a Schlager Carbon and can't abide the thought of going any slower then stay away from Karis (and from most other rubbers, and from me you nutter).

During a session of mixed training drills, the obvious headline that jumps out from the page is "intuitive, balanced, well-mannered".  It's really quiet hard to make this rubber do something unusual, surprising or extreme.  This also means that it isn't pushing into any areas of extreme performance either - no enormous catapult to help you from distance with your lazy half-stroke, no ludicrous grab to put massive spin on a ball you mis-hit because you were out of position.  But it certainly does enough, and offers more than enough performance for someone at my average level to get any job done.  

At this early stage, I'm very impressed with both M and M+.  They sit in an area of the market where there aren't many quality options IMO, and it's certainly the best of the bunch I can think of.  If you take the slower ESN crowd (Musa being the obvious example), Karis feels far less "capped" in terms of overall performance while still being just as easy to use in the short game.  Of course, Karis is more expensive too.

I didn't really want to use Rubicon with Karis so early because I didn't want to introduce a new blade to the equation as well.  But in between this second session and the first, I put my regular setup onto Rubicon and spent a few hours with it and established enough of a baseline to get comfortable in my mind.  For the purposes of the reader - Rubicon is lighter than the Zoom Balance but ever so slightly faster and a touch harder on initial impact.  I'll be doing a Rubicon review later on of course.

But anyway - I went to a small local-ish tournament this weekend and took Rubicon with Karis M on BH, but kept OVA on FH for the sake of safety.   It was an interesting event, and the official UK supplier of Nexy was there sponsoring it and running a stand ( http://www.ppong.co.uk/" rel="nofollow - http://www.ppong.co.uk/ ) , so it was interesting for several reasons.  The chap who runs it is a super nice guy, a pretty high level player, won the group 1 event and was using karis himself, so it was a regular karis love-in.  He sold a fair few sheets of it as well.

I was in the group below (2 of 5), and did much better than I had anticipated (5W 2L, joint second position overall).  What stood out to me about Karis in this situation was how it seemed to help me in unfamiliar surroundings against players I'd never seen before.  It has very few rough edges in how it plays - if any.  So when you're not 100% sure about the situation you get a lot of margin for error.  I feel that, in comparison with recent rubbers I've used, it helped a lot with service return (against unfamiliar opponents), tight play, and (most importantly on the day itself - a few good choppers were there) for opening up against backspin.  Karis's nature is such that when I don't get an opener quite right, instead of the ball going long or into the net, I get a sort-of high return that still lands on the table.  Sure, some of those got chewed up, but some didn't and overall my "idiot" error rate was much lower than usual.  At the same time, some of my openers were really good and I don't feel like I had to make any sacrifice to gain the error reduction.  Maybe, maybe, my blocking wasn't quite as good as usual, and I had to be a bit more active when taking an empty ball on from mid-table (lack of low-end catapult), but it was very minor.  Karis encourages you to be more active and progressive anyway - I found myself attacking serves more often and lifting "riskier" (in my mind) backspin simply because it was that bit harder to mess it up in comparison with my usual setup.

M and M+ on the Levi Basalt, which is my Viscaria-type equivalent (bit softer, bit slower, but much faster than the Zoom Balance or Rubicon).  3 hour session, drills followed by practice matches.

Nothing much to add about this experience over and above the earlier sessions apart from the basic speed of course.  What I found interesting here is that M was still excellent for me - still very manageable, lively in the middle gears in a nice way, good arc and spin for effort strokes, very easy to use in the short game, with "enough" speed (certainly enough for anyone I would say now it's on a faster blade).  The additional basic speed, plus M's easy-going low-gear nature, makes this setup amazingly good for opening against backspin with power, and the setup becomes very solid for loop-reloop from half distance too.

I was surprised by M+ here though - whereas M felt reasonable and balanced (pumped up by the blade in a sensible, understandable way), M+ felt much faster than on the previous blades.  With me coming from slower setups these days, playing closer in, and with an emphasis on controlled offense, M+ was obviously too much on the Levi for me.  M would do a great job on both wings for an aggressive two-winged looper on a fast-ish blade for sure, and in terms of how the overall setup played it compared very well to something like a Bluefire M2 - I'd say equal in spin, slightly lower throw, but far easier to use and more forgiving.  The rubbers are very different, but can be used for a similar game style of generic two-winged loop attack, if you catch my meaning.  Whereas M+ felt too hard and low catapult for that style of play, but too fast for my close-in play too on this blade.   It felt like it would suit more of a hard-hitting, counter-attacking style, although I did feel that it brush looped well in this session too.