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If TTX succeedes what then

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Topic: If TTX succeedes what then
Posted By: 1dennistt
Subject: If TTX succeedes what then
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 11:11am
I'm just curious what you do with these "players" generated from TTX events when they come to the club an want to use their "colorful plastic non-spin ITTF approved" rackets?  If you haven't checked out their website (which only half the links on the ITTF page worked for me) here they are. The 

http://www.ttx.world/" rel="nofollow - https://www.ttx.world/

http://www.ittf.com/ttx/" rel="nofollow - https://www.ittf.com/ttx/

It seems to be the case where you would need separate nights/times/locations for play for each sub-culture.  The equipment used for one is not acceptable to be used in the other.  So if I show up at a TTX event I can't use my TT racket, and if they show up they can't use their racket where/when I normally play. Neither are legal for use at the other event (much like sandpaper isn't legal, but at least they use and to some extent understand what spin is and does).  Both will be ITTF approved equipment, but for different sports.

Sames applies for the rules. 
Serves - Very Different, anything goes vs tightly controlled
Time Limits - Different In Concept and use
Scoring - Two Points with a Wildcard or Winner - or 4 Points with a Wildcard X Winner

If this works and becomes popular, even semi-popular (like us), we need to plan a little ahead.

How is this going to be different than the current basement players we get?  Well for one thing they may have been playing for some time learning TTX and TTX rules, with TTX equipment and perhaps for quite a while before we see them.  They may actually be quite accomplished in their sport.  To them what they have been playing and learning and competing in is TT.  It won't be as simple as teaching them to toss the ball and scores go to 11 not 21 points. This thing is going to become a whole and distinct sub-culture, separate and apart from TT.

Hopefully the ITTF has a real plan for this.  ITTF? Anyone else want to take a stab at it? This is going to be something to think about going forward if TTX takes off.  


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Donic Waldner World Champion 1989 ZLC, Donic Bluefire JP01 Turbo (Red) 2.0, Spinlord Keiler (Black) 1.5 mm, (Testing Victas 101 (Black) 1.6 mm)
Wt. 165 gm total weight



Replies:
Posted By: 1dennistt
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 11:19am
I missed this one...all you tin foil hat/conspiracy people need to stop reading here...TTX balls will be bigger and heavier.

And then there is this one, grab at TT Table or if you don’t have one, then any flat surface will do. Approx. dimensions if you need them are 2.74m long x 1.525m wide. Or just feel free to improvise.

And just a little flavor of the Wild Wild West on serving:  Unlike conventional table tennis, there are no set rules for how to serve in a game of TTX, so you can freestyle it, and serve it your way! You don’t have to toss the ball if you don’t want to, there is no specific toss height, and you are able to hide service behind arms, legs or other body parts. The start of serve can be from anywhere. For a serve to count, the ball must bounce once on the serving player’s side of the table first, followed by bouncing on the opponents side once. As long as the serve is made before the buzzer, the point will be considered. Keep vigilant because your opponent can serve when you are not ready!


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Donic Waldner World Champion 1989 ZLC, Donic Bluefire JP01 Turbo (Red) 2.0, Spinlord Keiler (Black) 1.5 mm, (Testing Victas 101 (Black) 1.6 mm)
Wt. 165 gm total weight


Posted By: pongfugrasshopper
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 1:01pm
I think the rules were devised by a committee when they were all drunk.  I think they are trying to see if they can replicate the pickleball success.  But if you look at pickleball, there are very clear and concise rules; and the game isn't too far from tennis.  TTX sounds like house rules ping pong..  

One aspect of TTX which hasn't been discussed is that ITTF wants TTX to become a revenue generator, and I suspect that is the main purpose.  From the ITTF Strategic Plan:

"Build the TTX brand to create a
commercially self-sufficient product,
generating a new revenue source for
the ITTF and its partners."

ITTF hopes "TTX to become self-funding and generating income by 2022."

So does any revenue generated go towards TT, or is it just let's make more money for the ITTF and it's partners and to build up TTX?  Does this take time/focus/money away from TT itself?


Posted By: pgpg
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 1:02pm
I've yet to see a single TTX game/table/paddle/ball. Or even run into someone who did.

So, I'd say it as very big IF, at least in the US. 

Pickleball and axe throwing Smile have more visibility... As in "I met people who did one or another, saw it on TV, it came up in conversation, I know a place locally where I can do it, etc." 


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USATT: ~1710
Dr. Neubauer Barricade Def - AK47 Red - Dornenglanz OX


Posted By: skip3119
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 3:26pm
It seems that ITTF forces National Associations to promote TTX, whether they like it or not.
Also I agree with some posters here that ITTF just wants to generate revenue from a new source, TTX. (Don't think TTX can cause an increase in the number of TT players)
==========
Off topic:
MyTT site seems to be going through:  "on again, off again" (back and forth).



Posted By: ndotson
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 4:05pm
If TTX succeeds then....I would be surprised, but I wouldn't really care.

Here's my cynical take on it, which echoes what pongfugrasshopper and skip have already said:

It seems like someone watched a webinar made in 2008 on "How To Market to the "Millennial" Generation", and then decided to apply it to table tennis carte blanche. Essentially, that's what TTX is...a brand. The game/rules are almost arbitrary. The goal is to create a product with a focus on the experience economy to find it's market share. The primary goal is not grow the "sport" of table tennis, but rather to exploit the existing global popularity of table tennis by creating a brand that generates revenue. Any net benefits to the sport of table tennis are nice, but that's a secondary concern.

So, those of us interested in the growth of table tennis will have very little use for TTX or any shared interest in its success.

I would have been more interested if the ITTF came up with something like what "speed chess" is to chess. Something truly intended to get more players acquainted with the game, and also perhaps something current players and hobbyists might be interested in trying as well. Something with only very minor rule tweaks and a timer...and without the branding money-grab and alternative equipment.
- Speed Pong anyone? Hmmm...that sounds interesting.
- TTX anyone? What the f*** are you talking about?



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Korbel
H3 / Curl P1


Posted By: Simon_plays
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 4:40pm


Posted By: passifid
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 5:29pm
i'd be on board and give it a go if it wasnt for that stupid 10 minute max games (2 min limit is rediculous if you ever play in a place where if you miss you have to fetch a ball 5 mins per set is much much better) time limited is bad in general as it encourages time wasting and therefore arguments over time wasting.
and that wild card and serve nonsense.
TT with no rubbers and therefore no serve rules as no spin to worry for might be fun and more accessable for a beginner who isnt interested in anything but casual might be fun. In fact i think the entire game might be more fun if the ITTF only allowed max 1.5mm rubbers in pips out. It would bring defending back a bit hopefully and stop people freaking out about pushers when they first start becuase pips make it so much easier to return push.
or i can keep my MXP and blast away...



Posted By: heavyspin
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 7:43pm
Originally posted by passifid passifid wrote:

2 min limit is rediculous if you ever play in a place where if you miss you have to fetch a ball
I just came up with some strategy for the game. If you're up by 2 with less than a minute in a game (and "wildcard" is not called), hit the ball as wildly as possible so the time limit will expire before your opponent can retrieve the ball.


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Trying to develop a fast short serve.


Posted By: BRS
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 8:34pm
I wouldn't lose too much sleep over the consequences of TTX taking off in America. It isn't happening.


Posted By: ericd937
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 9:39pm
Honestly, it looks dumb. I'd rather play pickleball. 

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Current Setup: Trying to learn H3
Official USATT Rating 1815
Current estimated level:
Starting to get the hang of H3


Posted By: liulin04
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 10:00pm
F-ing dumb

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http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=35056&PN=14&title=feedback-liulin04" rel="nofollow - My Feedbacks


Posted By: pongfugrasshopper
Date Posted: 01/10/2019 at 10:19pm
Well, at least Gordon has the world veterans tour.  Pretty much can't miss with that one.


Posted By: 1dennistt
Date Posted: 01/11/2019 at 8:17am
Originally posted by ericd937 ericd937 wrote:

Honestly, it looks dumb. I'd rather play pickleball. 


This is where I'm at also, I can't fathom how this could be good for the sport of TT.  How would you even transition from TTX to TT?  The only thing they have in common is the ITTF and the pursuit of $$$.  Why not just draw a table on the ground, put up a net and hit it back and forth.  OH, wait, someone already does that.  It makes pickleball look more attractive.  Maybe the ITTF could figure out how to co-op that sport for their use.Confused

Just another ITTF money grab?




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Donic Waldner World Champion 1989 ZLC, Donic Bluefire JP01 Turbo (Red) 2.0, Spinlord Keiler (Black) 1.5 mm, (Testing Victas 101 (Black) 1.6 mm)
Wt. 165 gm total weight


Posted By: Simon_plays
Date Posted: 01/11/2019 at 8:28am
https://imgflip.com/i/2qw02o" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: heavyspin
Date Posted: 01/11/2019 at 9:38am
Is the 2 min game a running clock? What prevents a player on serve with the lead to hold the ball and run out the clock?

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Trying to develop a fast short serve.


Posted By: 1dennistt
Date Posted: 01/11/2019 at 10:37am
Sportsmanship?  Maybe what they need is a chess timer, where you have to click when you serve to start the point and click when the point ends.  That way only the server could start the timer when he was ready to serve, and either player could stop the timer when the point ends to stop his time from ticking away.

I'm thinking about this non-existent sport way too much.  Honestly does anyone see this working, anywhere other than on a cruise ship or at a beach?

By the way you need to start practicing your finger spin serves! And you know the ones out of your hand.  Also notice hidden serves are legal in this.  *

*If you can get any spin from these spinless wonder paddles that might mean something.


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Donic Waldner World Champion 1989 ZLC, Donic Bluefire JP01 Turbo (Red) 2.0, Spinlord Keiler (Black) 1.5 mm, (Testing Victas 101 (Black) 1.6 mm)
Wt. 165 gm total weight


Posted By: pongfugrasshopper
Date Posted: 01/11/2019 at 11:07am
Originally posted by 1dennistt 1dennistt wrote:

...
By the way you need to start practicing your finger spin serves! And you know the ones out of your hand.  Also notice hidden serves are legal in this.  *
...
No need.  Simply run to the side of the table and do a quick no spin side to side serve.  If your opponent happens to also run to the side, then simply do a quick no spin down the line serve.  Server wins and keeps to serve until the set is over!  From the TTX "rules" book:

To begin your match, decide who gets to go first, by either tossing a coin, or
playing a game of rock, paper, scissors against your opponent.

So whoever wins the coin toss or rock, paper, scissors match to decide who gets to serve first wins!


Posted By: 1dennistt
Date Posted: 01/11/2019 at 11:10am
These rules read like what would have been played at recess when I was in grammar school.  Big smile


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Donic Waldner World Champion 1989 ZLC, Donic Bluefire JP01 Turbo (Red) 2.0, Spinlord Keiler (Black) 1.5 mm, (Testing Victas 101 (Black) 1.6 mm)
Wt. 165 gm total weight


Posted By: Ranger-man
Date Posted: 01/11/2019 at 1:33pm
If TTX succeeds, then TTX will succeed, not table tennis. Just like beach volleyball is a sport in its own right and has done little or nothing to promote volleyball TTX will create its own identify if it succeeds. It will have little to no impact on the real game. Personally the thing the ITTF is so big about in TTX is the one thing that puts me off. The lack of seriousness, the lack of strict rules and the lack of hardcore competitiveness in the way I see the people in the videos playing. 

I have played hardbat as well and also want to try out liha, but only because table tennis in all its versions is a serious sport. I enjoy the game, and have tons of fun playing it. But I don't need to remove the rules for that to happen. 



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Darker Speed 90 10mm: Dawei IQUL
Ahinoki Lutz Spruce Jpen: 729 SuperFX

Member:
1-ply Hinoki Club
Violin/Acoustic Clan

The speed of a Rhino and the power of a Gazelle!



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