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short, medium & long pips ? What does it mean ?

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Topic: short, medium & long pips ? What does it mean ?
Posted By: alford
Subject: short, medium & long pips ? What does it mean ?
Date Posted: 05/17/2022 at 12:22pm
I am not very familiar with all this but I hear about players talking about this a lot.

So I wondered what the differences are between these 3 types & if there is an official definition of each on some ITTF documents or is this some unoffical convention among tabletennis players 

Only other thing I know about pips is that they use different words to describe it in different countries such as pips, pimples, knobs, spikes etc. That is all I know 




Replies:
Posted By: GeneralSpecific
Date Posted: 05/17/2022 at 1:09pm
The ITTF does not have an official designation for medium pips and half-long pips. Medium pips are on the longer end of being short pips but are too short to be long pips. Half-long pips are on the shorter end of being long pips but are too long to be short pips. Since there is no official designation for medium and half-long pips, they are unofficially grouped by the table tennis community, vendors, and manufacturers.

Short pips and long pips have official designation but explaining the intricacies and differences of short, medium, half-long, and long pips is difficult and complicated even within the spectrum of each of the 4 categories on an individual basis.

There is plenty of information out there to read but if anyone wants to go into it in detail, I'll let them do the explaining.


-------------
Blade - Yasaka Sweden Extra FL
Forehand - Mizuno Q5 2.1mm
Backhand - Xiom Vega Europe DF 1.8mm


Posted By: alford
Date Posted: 05/17/2022 at 3:55pm
Originally posted by GeneralSpecific GeneralSpecific wrote:

 Since there is no official designation for medium and half-long pips, they are unofficially grouped by the table tennis community, vendors, and manufacturers.

Short pips and long pips have official designation 

Can you explain how the unofficial grouping & official designation is done ?

Are there some ITTF documents that define official designation ?  


Posted By: cole_ely
Date Posted: 05/17/2022 at 4:08pm
Originally posted by alford alford wrote:

Originally posted by GeneralSpecific GeneralSpecific wrote:

 Since there is no official designation for medium and half-long pips, they are unofficially grouped by the table tennis community, vendors, and manufacturers.

Short pips and long pips have official designation 

Can you explain how the unofficial grouping & official designation is done ?

Are there some ITTF documents that define official designation ?  

I don't believe the ittf even makes a designation.  Just maximum and minimum specs of height, width,  ratios thereof,  and friction minimum for all pips


-------------
W1 St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b

Please let me know if I can be of assistance.


Posted By: TT newbie
Date Posted: 05/17/2022 at 5:38pm
It means this pips stuff is a mess and everyone should adopt inverted rubbers...


Posted By: DonnOlsen
Date Posted: 05/17/2022 at 9:37pm
Hi,

I'm not sure, I may be wrong, it may not be correct, it may be just nonsense, but I think all medium pips are classified by the ITTF as short pips.  How, then, do you know a pips rubber is medium pips? by a knowledgeable soul on a table tennis forum telling you so, or by a manufacturer claiming so.

Feel not bad about being confused.  The range of playing characteristic among the pips rubbers is even wider than the categories, for variables such as with sponge/without sponge, the stiffness of the pips, the size of the pip face, and the distances between the pips, and more all alter the playing characteristics of the rubbers.  

This is all not to diminish the biggest variable factor which is how the individual player plays with the specific rubber.

I hope I've answered all your questions.  I pride myself in my clarity, accuracy, and precision in my writing (as so advocated at the Writers' Workshop).

Thanks.

[By the way, I attended the University of Iowa.]


-------------
"I only said I was the greatest, not the smartest." Muhammad Ali


Posted By: Baal
Date Posted: 05/18/2022 at 9:18am
So did I


Posted By: ZApenholder
Date Posted: 05/18/2022 at 9:24am
quick google search (ittf long pimple guideline) shows this:

https://documentstore.ittf.com/documents/equipments_site_docs/T4_Racket_Coverings_forBOD2017-without-deletings.pdf" rel="nofollow - https://documentstore.ittf.com/documents/equipments_site_docs/T4_Racket_Coverings_forBOD2017-without-deletings.pdf

go to page 4.
2. Pimple dimensions

and yes, ITTF only has Long and Out (short)


Posted By: igorponger
Date Posted: 05/18/2022 at 3:58pm
RUSSIAN RUBBER ENGINEER GLADLY ANSWERS YOUR EVERY QUESTION, MY FRIENDS.
heh, Knowledge is power, money, pleasure, happy living, ... and vice versa. ;)
For a true answer look into ITTF LARC, the Annotation on the opening page.
--------------
   TO BE REMEMBERED.
Alignment of pimples by height (as generally adopted with manufacturers for rubber specifications).
Short 1 --1.2 mm
Medium 1.3 - 1.6 mm
Long 1.7 - 1.8.mm


Posted By: GeneralSpecific
Date Posted: 05/18/2022 at 5:54pm
Originally posted by cole_ely cole_ely wrote:

Originally posted by alford alford wrote:

Originally posted by GeneralSpecific GeneralSpecific wrote:

 Since there is no official designation for medium and half-long pips, they are unofficially grouped by the table tennis community, vendors, and manufacturers.

Short pips and long pips have official designation 

Can you explain how the unofficial grouping & official designation is done ?

Are there some ITTF documents that define official designation ?  

I don't believe the ittf even makes a designation.  Just maximum and minimum specs of height, width,  ratios thereof,  and friction minimum for all pips


When the ittf releases their LARCs and lists rubbers as Long (long pips) or Out (short pips), those are official designations.


-------------
Blade - Yasaka Sweden Extra FL
Forehand - Mizuno Q5 2.1mm
Backhand - Xiom Vega Europe DF 1.8mm


Posted By: cmugica
Date Posted: 05/19/2022 at 9:25am
Originally posted by GeneralSpecific GeneralSpecific wrote:

Originally posted by cole_ely cole_ely wrote:

Originally posted by alford alford wrote:

Originally posted by GeneralSpecific GeneralSpecific wrote:

 Since there is no official designation for medium and half-long pips, they are unofficially grouped by the table tennis community, vendors, and manufacturers.

Short pips and long pips have official designation 

Can you explain how the unofficial grouping & official designation is done ?

Are there some ITTF documents that define official designation ?  

I don't believe the ittf even makes a designation.  Just maximum and minimum specs of height, width,  ratios thereof,  and friction minimum for all pips


When the ittf releases their LARCs and lists rubbers as Long (long pips) or Out (short pips), those are official designations.

Out, not short.


-------------
SDC custom st
FH G-1 max
BH Evolution FX-S 1.9


Posted By: mykonos96
Date Posted: 05/19/2022 at 3:25pm
Originally posted by cmugica cmugica wrote:

Originally posted by GeneralSpecific GeneralSpecific wrote:

Originally posted by cole_ely cole_ely wrote:

Originally posted by alford alford wrote:

Originally posted by GeneralSpecific GeneralSpecific wrote:

 Since there is no official designation for medium and half-long pips, they are unofficially grouped by the table tennis community, vendors, and manufacturers.

Short pips and long pips have official designation 

Can you explain how the unofficial grouping & official designation is done ?

Are there some ITTF documents that define official designation ?  

I don't believe the ittf even makes a designation.  Just maximum and minimum specs of height, width,  ratios thereof,  and friction minimum for all pips


When the ittf releases their LARCs and lists rubbers as Long (long pips) or Out (short pips), those are official designations.

Out, not short.

There s a height width ratio that  pips must comply to be called SP


Posted By: igorponger
Date Posted: 05/19/2022 at 3:39pm
ITTF LARC and MATERIAL CATALOGUE. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE   

Regarding the size of rubber pimples, the LARC only indicates that the pimples fall under LONG or OUT types. The calibration of pimples by size or shape is not shown in the LARC.    
Calibrating pimples by height within the range of 1- 1.8 mm is now adopted with most of rubber manufacturers as the best convenient way to inform players about the actual performance of the rubber, -- for the Short, Medium and Long pimples will play far differently, you must know.   



NOTE: all the "OUT" pimples in the LARC are either Short Height or Medium Height. (exact calibre of the pimples-out may be found on the factory pack directly.)


Posted By: ZApenholder
Date Posted: 05/20/2022 at 9:34am
Igor, did you check your date there, 2009?
LARC doesnt look like that nowadays, its a website.

I already shared the ruling from ITTF

here is another current document from ITTF which has the same data of which I shared 2 days ago.
https://documentstore.ittf.com/documents/M4%20%20RC%20MANUAL%20%2012.01.2022.pdf" rel="nofollow - https://documentstore.ittf.com/documents/M4%20%20RC%20MANUAL%20%2012.01.2022.pdf




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