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Serve variety

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pimpmyracket View Drop Down
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    Posted: 07/05/2006 at 10:40pm
I practice a lot of different types of serves, at least 15-20 distinct serves, and I've always wondered, in a match would it be wise to switch serves continously, like never even do two forehand serves in a row, in order to keep the opponent guessing and never let him get used to your serves?

So vary between FH, BH, and different spins and such, never doing two of the same serve in a row.

It seems that the pros stick to the same few serves, maybe 3-4 different forehand serves and keep doing it, maybe switching to backhand when they're in a jam. Is this better?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcuba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/05/2006 at 10:46pm

d pros way is better. so u can plan whats next... d main purpose of service is to get d next expected ball to start attacking.. not to get ur opponent error. it that happen its a bonus.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pimpmyracket Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/05/2006 at 11:09pm
My purpose for varying serves wouldn't be to cause error, but just to never let the opponent get used to my serves and get comfortable enough to attack.

Because often, near the end of the match, both players have gotten used to the other's serves, and can start attacking them more confidently, so I just want to prevent that.

What's the benefit of sticking to only 3-4 serves?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcuba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/05/2006 at 11:16pm
so u can expect what ball to come...the hardest part of tt is to read oncoming spin so u marginal that factor by sticking to altenate 5(4 shorts n 1 really long) spinny(accept 1 no spin) )major serves the rest u can use after 8 points onwards depending on situation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcuba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/05/2006 at 11:19pm

oh ya forgot to mention.

as much as possible make the motion look alike.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote President JFJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/06/2006 at 12:12am
Well, Schlager is one of the pros, and he uses an incredible variety of serves. Not all pros use the same 5 serves. I think Schlager is one of the best servers out there. I switch in between an arsenal of many serves, going back to the serves my opponent has trouble with most often.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wfwfitz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/06/2006 at 1:02am
If I find out that my opponent is having trouble with a serve I save it for when i really need a point.  Generally I try to serve so that I wont be attcked if I get a loose reply or an error that is a bonus.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Me40_Pyx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/06/2006 at 1:11am
Originally posted by pimpmyracket pimpmyracket wrote:

My purpose for varying serves wouldn't be to cause error, but just to never let the opponent get used to my serves and get comfortable enough to attack.

Because often, near the end of the match, both players have gotten used to the other's serves, and can start attacking them more confidently, so I just want to prevent that.

What's the benefit of sticking to only 3-4 serves?

Actually, the best way to prevent your opponent from attacking upon receiving your serve is to make sure your serves are low and short.A good player would always be able to attack a long and high serve ,even if you haven't used up to that point in the match.
What's more , pros DO have an amazing variety of serves - it's just that you don't notice it.Samsonov for example has at least 10 diff serves , depending on spin,placement ,speed etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TT_Freak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/06/2006 at 6:55am
Correct, the the pros disguise their serves very well. Players like Shlager, Liu Guoliang and Waldner like to serve the same spins with different motions. Whilst players like Wang Liqin, Kong Linghui and Samsonov like to serve different spins with the same motions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote joubtt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/06/2006 at 4:53pm
Kalinic was just here and I got to feel them again.  He did used all 3 tactics, same motion different spin,  same spin to different locations, and service direction change if your opponent moved while you were serving.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ozzietimo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/06/2006 at 9:42pm

Waldner has an opinion that once you find an opponent's weakness you should pick it until it bleeds.

In an 11 point game if you have serves your opponent doesn't like you can have won 3-0 before he settles against you.

The best part about good serves is your opponent knowing what you are going to serve but him knowing there is nothing he can do about it! That is when you own him and it is a beautiful thing!!!!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote haggisv Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/06/2006 at 10:54pm
Originally posted by ozzietimo ozzietimo wrote:

Waldner has an opinion that once you find an opponent's weakness you should pick it until it bleeds.

In an 11 point game if you have serves your opponent doesn't like you can have won 3-0 before he settles against you.

The best part about good serves is your opponent knowing what you are going to serve but him knowing there is nothing he can do about it! That is when you own him and it is a beautiful thing!!!!

I like that! So True!!!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcuba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/06/2006 at 11:17pm

Originally posted by TT_Freak TT_Freak wrote:

Correct, the the pros disguise their serves very well. Players like Shlager, Liu Guoliang and Waldner like to serve the same spins with different motions. Whilst players like Wang Liqin, Kong Linghui and Samsonov like to serve different spins with the same motions.

how do u c that?or rather where do u c that? liu guoliang hide his serves with big motion and change surface..waldner serves follow through action is as if tops spin but he varies spinny short serves  with long serves occationally when his opponent off guard.....lol

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TT_Freak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/07/2006 at 5:41am
Liu Guoliang almost always used the same type of serves, just with varying levels of spin. He opted between sidespin serves and corkscrew serves and disguised them with the aftermotion. However he would serve the same spins with or without a fake aftermotion, different chopping motions and different tosses. In fact his last serving innovations (reverse side serves disguised as pendulum corksrews and the fast short toss serves with lots of body movement) were very similar to his original sidespins.

Waldner would do the same corkscrew/no-spin/backspin serves with short toss, high toss and different bat motions as well. It was only in the last years of his career after the "all to see" serving change that he started to actively use his same motion different spins serves (which he previously used almost exclusively in doubles).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote holoclothes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/07/2006 at 7:29am
there are benefits to what you are doing if you can remember what game plan goes with each serve and in that case the incredible variety can help.

However if an opponent has trouble with a particular serve it would be good to keep serving that until they finally get it or until a crucial point in which you go to something totally different.

Also at a higher level no matter what you serve they'll be able to return it so you should learn simply to disguise serves so it is harder to read rather than going for a kajillion different serves
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pimpmyracket Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/07/2006 at 9:15am
What's a corkscrew?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TT_Freak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/08/2006 at 8:58am
Its where the ball spins on the axis that its travelling on. Its used mainly to hide the topspin or backspin that the opponent put on it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcuba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/10/2006 at 9:28pm
obviously ur comparing those day technichs against present(still puzzle.how would one c liu's serve( d main reason y d rule change)...... sooo take the present one of coz.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/10/2006 at 10:11pm
iu always see waldner use 5-6 serves mostly on forehand...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TT_Freak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/11/2006 at 12:26am
Its the affect of the serve, he'll have maybe 10 motions for one type of spin. Whilst Wang Liqin has 2 motions for all the spins in his repetoire.
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