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looping side-spin ball

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kindof99 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 08/03/2019 at 11:07pm
Technically, one can loop any incoming balls with side-spin if his top spin loop is strong enough. But in many case, side spin will give a lot of troubles for looping especially for amateur players.

So what would you adjust for looping for these several situations:
1), forehands:
  • backspin with clockwise side spin
  • backspin with anti-clockwise side spin
  • top or no spin with clockwise side spin
  • top or no spin with anti-clockwise side spin
2), backhands:
  • backspin with clockwise side spin
  • backspin with anti-clockwise side spin
  • top or no spin with clockwise side spin
  • top or no spin with anti-clockwise side spin
What do you need to adjust, like paddle angle and swing angle to reduce the impact of sides pin?

Any input?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Simon_plays Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2019 at 4:48am
I think the main point is to not let the sidespin bother you too much and keep your stroke the same, swing through the ball with good racket head speed and the effect of the sidespin should be negated. 

Any issues with how placement is affected will be solved automatically as feeling improves over time. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2019 at 5:03am
The trick is to make slight changes to where you contact the ball but the core stroke remains the same...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vik2000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2019 at 10:53am
What exactly is bothering you? Do you struggle with reading the trajectory of the ball and how it bounces? Getting your footwork ready to loop the ball is your first step. 

If you have no issue with that, then work on your stroke. Your blade angle should be more closed. If you loop a sidespin ball like you loop an underspin, your ball will fly over the table. Keep your angle closed, and you shouldn't need to loop hard to negate the spin and put the ball over the net. Once you get this feeling correct, then work on looping harder. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2019 at 11:02am
Originally posted by kindof99 kindof99 wrote:

Technically, one can loop any incoming balls with side-spin if his top spin loop is strong enough. But in many case, side spin will give a lot of troubles for looping especially for amateur players.

So what would you adjust for looping for these several situations:
1), forehands:
  • backspin with clockwise side spin
  • backspin with anti-clockwise side spin
  • top or no spin with clockwise side spin
  • top or no spin with anti-clockwise side spin
2), backhands:
  • backspin with clockwise side spin
  • backspin with anti-clockwise side spin
  • top or no spin with clockwise side spin
  • top or no spin with anti-clockwise side spin
What do you need to adjust, like paddle angle and swing angle to reduce the impact of sides pin?

Any input?

If a ball has heavy spin, it is going to react with your paddle in a certain way.  The key is how to make contact with the ball in a way that negated the effect while allowing you to play the shot you need to play.  While in theory you can topspin every shot, if the spin is sufficiently heavy,  topspin may not be your best option if you want the ball to land on the table.  Sometimes you may just want to wipe the ball and give them the spin back.

All that said,  when you look at the spin think about the contact point on which side of the ball that it is easier to stop the spin.  Clockwise usually means you hit the right side of the ball.  Counterclockwise  usually means you hit the left side of the ball.    So it is usually easier to control clockwise with your forehand and counterclockwise with your backhand on basic strokes.

Topspin just means you play over the ball with a more forward component.     So if I get clockwise sidespin to my forehand, I can use a stroke that is almost like my regular forehand and the ball will land.  When I get a reverse, things get dodgier because the reverse or counterclockwise sidespin is going to pull the ball wider.  . So I have to try to hit the ball more towards the back or at least give enough height so that it comes over.

No spin with sidespin makes little sense unless you mean pure sidespin.   No spin you don't really care what is on the ball with modern rubbers, just play your stroke as long as you create friction with the ball pick it up.  The thing about no spin is that it goes where your racket brush aims so if you make thick contact before imparting spin, the ball will go long.  But heavy sidespin is different,  as that will react violently if you touch the side but your natural forehand will work for clockwise, natural backhand for anti clockwise.

I can't really map it all out but practice is the key as well as looking at how your contact point and stroke t r ajectory responds to the ball.  We don't always do what we think we do so video is helpful too.  Hope the general thoughts help.
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kindof99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2019 at 12:10pm
Thanks, Nextlevel.
I guess I just have to experience it.

It is good to find a practice partner and try all the returns. It is no way to just adjust returns during matches.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2019 at 5:37pm
I found it easier to fade loop a bit when encountering anticlockwise sidespin with the FH and clockwise sidespin with the BH, and hook a bit for the opposite sidespin.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2019 at 6:33pm
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

I found it easier to fade loop a bit when encountering anticlockwise sidespin with the FH and clockwise sidespin with the BH, and hook a bit for the opposite sidespin.

If a lefty serves you wide,  the fade shot is difficult to pull off with the ball moving away and wide  to the forehand.  But it definitely is an option.  I try to hook around the net but it is not easy.
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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FH: Fastarc C-1 2.0 B
BH: Fastarc C-1 2.0 R
Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2019 at 8:23pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

I found it easier to fade loop a bit when encountering anticlockwise sidespin with the FH and clockwise sidespin with the BH, and hook a bit for the opposite sidespin.

If a lefty serves you wide,  the fade shot is difficult to pull off with the ball moving away and wide  to the forehand.  But it definitely is an option.  I try to hook around the net but it is not easy.

Yes it's hard if it is from a lefty, I was thinking of more BH or reverse pendulum/hook serves from a righty. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote BH-Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/08/2019 at 1:14pm
Although this vid (Next Level likes the creators) shows how to attack long side spin serves coming to FH... a lot of same concepts show in the vid apply.

Surprisingly, the Korean YouTube coaching duo makes vids from my former club north of Seoul !!



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