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varying spin on opening loops

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    Posted: 01/25/2020 at 7:19pm
I noticed you can either hook it upwards contacting the bottom of the ball  or brute force loop it with the blade perpendicular to the ball. First one produces a lot of sidespin, second produces heavy topspin. 

The idea is that if the opponent starts to get used to one of them you can change it up and then they would start missing if they're not paying careful attention to how you contact the ball (it's difficult if you wait a bit for opening loops - sometimes the table obscures the view). 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/28/2020 at 1:04am
At no point should your loop ever contact the bottom of the ball.

If you are lobbing, maybe...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/28/2020 at 1:22am
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

At no point should your loop ever contact the bottom of the ball.

If you are lobbing, maybe...

It's more like a sidespin contact which requires a bit more lift hence contacting at the bottom of the ball. 

I found that if I do this after looping normally for some time most opponents don't read it correctly and just dump it into the net (the "loop" actually doesn't have a lot of topspin in it). 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wturber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/28/2020 at 11:04am
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

At no point should your loop ever contact the bottom of the ball.

If you are lobbing, maybe...

It's more like a sidespin contact which requires a bit more lift hence contacting at the bottom of the ball. 

I found that if I do this after looping normally for some time most opponents don't read it correctly and just dump it into the net (the "loop" actually doesn't have a lot of topspin in it). 

Shoot a video.  You may be surprised about where the contact point actually is.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/28/2020 at 7:07pm
The larger point is valid though.  One of the best players in Houston was/is incredibly difficult because it has always been really hard to know exactly how much spin (or speed) was on his loops (from either side), and when he was able to move better he was insanely steady with them.  I am sure it was something he did on purpose.  He also varied the amount of sidespin and could hit really extreme angles.  Left handed too.  Right close to 2600 in his prime.  Even other players at that level told me that this was something that made him tough to play. 


Edited by Baal - 01/28/2020 at 7:09pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wturber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/29/2020 at 12:08pm
I see no debate that varying spin is desirable.  But that pretty much applies to all of the shots, not just opening loops.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/29/2020 at 4:15pm
Originally posted by wturber wturber wrote:

Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

At no point should your loop ever contact the bottom of the ball.

If you are lobbing, maybe...

It's more like a sidespin contact which requires a bit more lift hence contacting at the bottom of the ball. 

I found that if I do this after looping normally for some time most opponents don't read it correctly and just dump it into the net (the "loop" actually doesn't have a lot of topspin in it). 

Shoot a video.  You may be surprised about where the contact point actually is.  

Maybe it's another case of what you feel is not what it actually looks like haha.... But yeah hooking the ball up is definitely a way to do an opening loop without much topspin which I thought was quite useful...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/30/2020 at 3:00am
Adding sidespin against a very heavy chop actually makes it easier to loop. Waldner has used a variety of loops both sidespin andtopspin depending on the situation. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ghostzen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/30/2020 at 7:49am
Variation and disguise are great ideas to break rhythm. The dead loop with little spin on can be a good weapon. Agreed Waldner and Timo were and are great advocates of it at the top end of the game. 

It's good at lower levels as Blahness I think mentioned. Most players can't judge spin that well so the differences, lack of or more cause problems.


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