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Robot training issues

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    Posted: 07/12/2020 at 7:26pm
I never did much of any robot training before and did some 3 hrs of hitting at a friend's place who had a robot setup with a ball recycler. 

It was really addictive as you could really drill your strokes in, you can set it to oscillate so that it gives you balls in random locations etc... you could also set backspin or topspin feeds...

The problem i have is that it gives me a lot of balls in a short time (especially with a recycler!), whereas if I were hitting with a partner there's always the ball picking time which helps to rest the muscles a bit. 

So now I end up with massive muscle aches, and cracking joints the next morning after the hard BH looping sessions :((( 

I think I won't be doing robot training ever again for loops ugh... Much more fun to hit with an actual person and probably healthier for my joints too...I don't think it's that realistic too, the balls were just too easy to adjust to, whereas in real matches you have to read the spin coming off the opponent's racket very carefully and make the appropriate adjustments to your swing which is the really hard part.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mickd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/13/2020 at 3:21am
I actually like the feeling from a good robot session. The reason is because I can't get muscle pain from playing regularly. It's just not intense enough. I think multiball would probably give you the same workout, though. So if the robot is doing it too harshly, you could always set it to say 40 seconds, then rest. Or turn down the frequency a little.

I had an opportunity to do some training with a robot during the initial shutdowns from the covid19. It was only a few weeks but I felt like I gained a lot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/13/2020 at 3:44am
Originally posted by mickd mickd wrote:

I actually like the feeling from a good robot session. The reason is because I can't get muscle pain from playing regularly. It's just not intense enough. I think multiball would probably give you the same workout, though. So if the robot is doing it too harshly, you could always set it to say 40 seconds, then rest. Or turn down the frequency a little.

I had an opportunity to do some training with a robot during the initial shutdowns from the covid19. It was only a few weeks but I felt like I gained a lot.

I'm not sure if muscle pain from TT is what you should be aiming for haha... I feel like having a relaxing session is so much better :) 

I am a little unconvinced with robot training though especially for looping, but will see if my BH improves! I think the robot is super good for training up new strokes, but if they're reasonably well drilled already there's probably no point because the key to success rates is reading incoming spin correctly...

But I had some fun in training some experimental BH strokes that I didn't have very good feeling on like the BH fade counter and BH chopblocking...which may become a lot more useful later on
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/13/2020 at 8:40am
Instead of thinking so much about improving  your strokes, consider focusing on footwork exercises. Nothing like simple step arounds and a robot can feed them well.  I like to set it for short backspin and practice stepping in and out as well



Edited by cole_ely - 07/13/2020 at 8:43am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mickd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/13/2020 at 9:50am
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

I'm not sure if muscle pain from TT is what you should be aiming for haha... I feel like having a relaxing session is so much better :) 

I am a little unconvinced with robot training though especially for looping, but will see if my BH improves! I think the robot is super good for training up new strokes, but if they're reasonably well drilled already there's probably no point because the key to success rates is reading incoming spin correctly...

But I had some fun in training some experimental BH strokes that I didn't have very good feeling on like the BH fade counter and BH chopblocking...which may become a lot more useful later on

I like the feeling of muscle pain, I guess. It feels like I actually put in effort. That said, when I say muscle pain I don't mean sharp pains, I mean the pain that'll turn into nice DOMs a day or two later. The tiredness in the muscles. If you're getting sharp pains or something, you should definitely tone it down.

And footwork is super fun. But I guess it's only as good as how you use it. A lot of people don't like it too. I would just do multiball, but I don't have anyone to feed it, so I guess it's a compromise that works for me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/13/2020 at 7:43pm
Originally posted by cole_ely cole_ely wrote:

Instead of thinking so much about improving  your strokes, consider focusing on footwork exercises. Nothing like simple step arounds and a robot can feed them well.  I like to set it for short backspin and practice stepping in and out as well




Yeah good idea! maybe I can use it to work on my crappy FH flick too haha...


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/13/2020 at 8:03pm
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

Originally posted by cole_ely cole_ely wrote:

Instead of thinking so much about improving  your strokes, consider focusing on footwork exercises. Nothing like simple step arounds and a robot can feed them well.  I like to set it for short backspin and practice stepping in and out as well




Yeah good idea! maybe I can use it to work on my crappy FH flick too haha...



The one good thing a robot did for me was my bh flip
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joo Se Kev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/15/2020 at 7:14am
A robot is a tool like any other. It can be used properly or improperly.

You're absolutely right though: if you're not used to robo-training or multiball, it's easy to overdo it!

Just build up more next time. Start with only 5-10 minutes and let your body adjust. Slowly add more training volume over time and you'll adapt!

Personally, I've been using a robot to help with the following:

1) Timing: reprogramming my pushes to hit the ball with an earlier timing before the peak of the bounce.

2) Footwork: Side-to-side and in-and-out

3) Confidence: getting lots of reps in on a step-around FH loop on the BH side.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smackman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/19/2020 at 9:16pm
Using a robot for 3 hours is not the best idea
it is better to do sets of say 150-200 balls ,
 stop have a clean up,
 do some serves
have a rest
try different serve returns
work on footwork
have a friend doing backhands and you doing forehands at the same time
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mickd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/19/2020 at 9:49pm
When I was trying to improve my strokes, I did 1-3 sets of ~40 seconds, recorded on my phone. I'd then review it and repeat as much as it took to get it to look like what I was after. I found this really helpful.

Edited by mickd - 07/19/2020 at 9:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/20/2020 at 6:21am
Originally posted by smackman smackman wrote:

Using a robot for 3 hours is not the best idea
it is better to do sets of say 150-200 balls ,
 stop have a clean up,
 do some serves
have a rest
try different serve returns
work on footwork
have a friend doing backhands and you doing forehands at the same time

Yeah it was a terrible idea, my joints are still hurting :( well at least with the lockdown I'm forced to rest a couple of weeks now....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tabl10s Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/20/2020 at 4:19pm
Are you soft? Man Up and train. I hope you never plan on playing at a high level!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mickd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/20/2020 at 7:14pm
Your reply seems a little strong, tabl10s. I suspect most people here wouldn't be able to 'man up' and take 3 hours of non-stop robot multiball :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tabl10s Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2020 at 3:24am
Multi-ball is more stressful than Robot training. With the robot, you can train at your own pace. Does he go full strength on every shot during open play? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mickd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2020 at 6:55am
No idea. But I think it's easy to go overboard if you don't usually use a robot. The first time I used one I was sore for a few days because it was so much fun. The first time I did actual multiball too, I was sore for nearly a week. The robot can definitely go harder and faster than multiball... But like you said, since you control it yourself, you can stop any time and take it down to a speed you're comfortable with.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tabl10s Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2020 at 12:25pm
Exactly. I haven't trained with one in 17 years because I broke the machine when I tried to modify for the 40mm(before the "+").

Moderation is key! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2020 at 6:13pm
I was looping powerfully for maybe half the time while I was training on it, the other half was more speciality shots like the BH fade and chopblock

Still I felt a not so nice feeling in the elbow after that session tbh, probably have overdone BH practice a bit....

Robot with a recycler is terrible since the balls get recycled and it pretty much never ends till you stop it, too easy to overdo it imo....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2020 at 6:24pm
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

I was looping powerfully for maybe half the time while I was training on it, the other half was more speciality shots like the BH fade and chopblock

Still I felt a not so nice feeling in the elbow after that session tbh, probably have overdone BH practice a bit....

Robot with a recycler is terrible since the balls get recycled and it pretty much never ends till you stop it, too easy to overdo it imo....

And I find myself and others I observe getting sloppy quickly. I don't mind the switch to a bucket and shorter sets 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tabl10s Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/21/2020 at 7:01pm
I don't understand your reply. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joo Se Kev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/22/2020 at 7:14am
I think he's saying if you let the drill drag on for too long, your form starts to slip and you are no longer practicing the stroke with integrity.

My solution to this is to set a timer and figure out a work/rest ratio that is appropriate.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/22/2020 at 9:08am
better to do only as many as you can do in perfect form. Don't let your steparounds  turn into leanarounds :). 

Keep it crisp and do  more,  smaller sets in better form

We've  all done and seen it. 
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