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The Hype around the Hype around National H3

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zeio View Drop Down
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    Posted: 08/01/2017 at 2:59pm
Ever since the recent discussion on knockoff National H3, in which yours truly was regarded as deranged, which in all honesty was an understatement, I've felt a strong urge to start this thread.

Who here feels National H3 is all hype?
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocketman222 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 3:03pm
I do not doubt the existence of this mythical rubber, I only doubt how easy it is to get one without getting ripped off, also price is more than tenergy, so not sure.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 3:07pm
Having tried several rubbers on my FH, my personal experience tells me it is not hype. I know anecdotal evidence is NOT data, but I'm not trying to establish a universal truth here. I only found a piece of equipment that Im happy with.
However, it will not be a fit for everyone. It is a demanding sheet. It demands good technique.

FdT
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HuLimei Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 3:30pm
Originally posted by MyTT MyTT wrote:

H3 'ent nuthin but a dead slow piece of shyt and Good Fuutwurk is all hype. Anything and everything Bty is wherre it's @. Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DreiZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 3:44pm
Having tried provincial h3 neo, which has considerable differences from the commercial in terms of quality, i dont doubt national h3 exists...

... but at the prices ive seen it being sold at... its a total rip off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hozuki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 4:16pm
First of all, there is no such thing as the one and only national H3. National implies that it is made specifically for CNT members. So you have to expect that they get custom sponge hardness and top quality top sheets and sponges. NH3 exists as official items for sale though, without a doubt. I even saw them on sale during WTTC Düsseldorf in the DHS/Nittaku Shop. But obviously for regular customers, it is mainly a marketing ploy to make money based on hype. It is very characteristic for China though, that the same strategy is copied by other chinese sellers to advertise 'national' tenergy LOL.

So you need to differentiate a bit here, it's somewhat in between an authentic product and a hype based cash grab.

And btw: If you don't act deranged, there is a good chance you won't be called as such.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 4:36pm
We seem to always fall into pedantic arguments about semantics.

Without knowing how you define "hype" I would argue it is the knock off H3 that is used to take advantage of the so called "hype".

The ones I have bought and used, were better  than all the other rubbers I did try on my FH. Since I tried for myself I know its not hype. BTW, the sheets last me more than a year.

FdT.


Edited by Fulanodetal - 08/01/2017 at 4:37pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 5:27pm
Originally posted by Fulanodetal Fulanodetal wrote:

We seem to always fall into pedantic arguments about semantics.

Without knowing how you define "hype" I would argue it is the knock off H3 that is used to take advantage of the so called "hype".

The ones I have bought and used, were better  than all the other rubbers I did try on my FH. Since I tried for myself I know its not hype. BTW, the sheets last me more than a year.

FdT.

How much better would the nationals that you tried than provincial (specify if B/S)?  It would help if you assign a rating out of 100 on each of the characteristics you would care to compare
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 5:52pm
Tom:

If you have tried H3 provincial B/S version, then the national is marginally better, given the difference in cost. I'm not a pro, so perhaps a pro would say there is a big difference between provincial and a national.
You will have to try for yourself since I don't do reviews the way some other users do, I'm just not good at it. Compared to the commercial orange sponge ones, it is vastly better!! I have tried the commercial version and had given up on Hurricane 3. Until a friend who was a pro gave me a H3 National to try!! He insisted on me trying it since I had such a bad opinion of the commercial H3. He uses it as well of course.

Sorry I can't make a full review. I believe you can find reviews elsewhere. But nothing beats experimenting yourself.

FdT
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 6:09pm
Originally posted by Fulanodetal Fulanodetal wrote:

Tom:

If you have tried H3 provincial B/S version, then the national is marginally better, given the difference in cost. I'm not a pro, so perhaps a pro would say there is a big difference between provincial and a national.
You will have to try for yourself since I don't do reviews the way some other users do, I'm just not good at it. Compared to the commercial orange sponge ones, it is vastly better!! I have tried the commercial version and had given up on Hurricane 3. Until a friend who was a pro gave me a H3 National to try!! He insisted on me trying it since I had such a bad opinion of the commercial H3. He uses it as well of course.

Sorry I can't make a full review. I believe you can find reviews elsewhere. But nothing beats experimenting yourself.

FdT
Thanks.  Would you be able to give a simple overall numeric rating for the national and the orange sponge provincial?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 6:14pm
well:

spin : in my estimation commercial (os) H3 would score 4. provincial (bs) would score an 8 and National (bs) would score a 9 out of 10. 
speed:  commercial (os) would be at 4, prov (bs) would be at 8 and Nat (bs) would be at 8 out of 10.


I have not tried the orange sponge provincial. I have not seen them actually. Only Blue Sponge Provincial.


FdT.


Edited by Fulanodetal - 08/01/2017 at 6:19pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 7:44pm
Originally posted by Hozuki Hozuki wrote:

...So you need to differentiate a bit here, it's somewhat in between an authentic product and a hype based cash grab.

And btw: If you don't act deranged, there is a good chance you won't be called as such.

Very good point.

In the same way Frank Schreiner doesn't understand the Chinese market because he is too far away from China, it follows that yours truly doesn't understand the European market for the same reason.

Yet, the notion that the name National H3 indicates the set of characteristics the manufacturer intended to achieve in a knockoff is what yours truly can't get his head around, leading to his less-than-graceful demeanor.

The very reason behind that was made clear early on:

Quote The National Hurricane 3 used by the CNT is made at the DHS Research Institute.

The ones in the white package are catered to the enthusiasts and EJs and is said to be made at the Institute also.

The rest you see in the market are made by some licensed OEMs. It's said there're 3 places where they are made.


The National H3 custom-made for CNT is off-limits to the public.

The National H3 circulated in limited volume through official channels is likely close, but not the same thing. Same story for the Provincial H3.

The mass-market H3 is a different animal.

What does this all mean? It means the knockoff National H3 is hardly comparable to the real deal other than looks, which is the only aspect that "the manufacturer" intended to achieve.

But I digress. The true intention behind this thread is to prove the hype of the hype of the mythical existence and some more.

Are you ready?

Edited by zeio - 08/01/2017 at 7:46pm
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote onehander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 7:56pm
This is in regards to the Hurricane 3 National (non-Neo).  

The quality of this rubber is very likely the highest of all rubber out there, 
not just compared to other Hurricane/Skyline rubber.  

I can see similarities of the topsheet quality between commercial and provincial, with 
small imperfections on the topsheet.  Provincial typically feels more elastic.  

National is a completely different quality.  It's perfect with no defects, and all the make,
model, number fonts are sharp, distinct, and precise.  It is made to be boosted, 
and it is very easy to boost.  Once boosted, it's power is linear and as powerful 
as T05, with a better touch and short game. 

There is no foul smell like commercial H3.  

The National team uses the same quality level H3 rubber, but individualized to the players' 
specific needs like hardness and thickness and tuning level.  

You can get this white package H3 National for ~$50 - $60, which is less than T05.  
I have not used the National H3Neo, but I find no reason to with H3 National being 
so good already.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote danieldangz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 8:08pm
Originally posted by onehander onehander wrote:

This is in regards to the Hurricane 3 National (non-Neo).  

The quality of this rubber is very likely the highest of all rubber out there, 
not just compared to other Hurricane/Skyline rubber.  

I can see similarities of the topsheet quality between commercial and provincial, with 
small imperfections on the topsheet.  Provincial typically feels more elastic.  

National is a completely different quality.  It's perfect with no defects, and all the make,
model, number fonts are sharp, distinct, and precise.  It is made to be boosted, 
and it is very easy to boost.  Once boosted, it's power is linear and as powerful 
as T05, with a better touch and short game. 

There is no foul smell like commercial H3.  

The National team uses the same quality level H3 rubber, but individualized to the players' 
specific needs like hardness and thickness and tuning level.  

You can get this white package H3 National for ~$50 - $60, which is less than T05.  
I have not used the National H3Neo, but I find no reason to with H3 National being 
so good already.  

Is it Orange sponge or Blue Sponge?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote young dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 9:15pm
Originally posted by Fulanodetal Fulanodetal wrote:

We seem to always fall into pedantic arguments about semantics.

Without knowing how you define "hype" I would argue it is the knock off H3 that is used to take advantage of the so called "hype".

The ones I have bought and used, were better  than all the other rubbers I did try on my FH. Since I tried for myself I know its not hype. BTW, the sheets last me more than a year.

FdT.

When you say they last a year, is that with monthly boosting too?  And how many hours / week do you play?  Thank you.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 9:22pm
The following pictures were first posted on Feb 2, 2017 by th16888, a well-known collector in China.

The EB NCT V shown is one of the two blades LXX used to achieve her Grand Slam. FH rubber is DHS National H3 Custom-made. BH rubber is BTY T64 Custom-made, AKA "SP". LXX prepares two EB NCT V(known as Mark 1 and Mark 2) before a match and picks the one that feels better. The Mark 2 was kept at LXX's parents home in her hometown Anshan. LXX gave it to the OP as a gift after learning of his hobby, on the condition that it not be sold, to serve as a testimony of table tennis history.















LXX also gave the OP a set of N68, National H3 and T64. When someone asked about the Carbonado 145 that LXX "used" at Rio, OP replied saying LXX told him that the handle and blade are separate. Stiga gives her 150 blades each time, from which she picks out not more than 5, must be 95g and above.

On the T64, though hard to make out due to the compression artifacts, what looks to be the characters "非賣品"(meaning not for sale) with the Butterfly logo and some text below can be seen in the top center. Near the bottom, two lines that look to be "MDSP-トクアツ-2。1mm"(トクアツ => tokuatsu, extra thick) and "----KJ----".

On the H3, other than the usual alphanumeric, "李晓霞"(LXX) is laser-printed, followed by the word "Rio". "国 2.10/40"(National) is where they're supposed to be. A cursive "李"(Li) can be seen on the top left corner. It comes with a layer of primer, AKA "打底层".



















Edited by zeio - 08/01/2017 at 11:50pm
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/01/2017 at 10:33pm
to young dude:

I initially do not boost.

after about 10 months of use, IF I feel the rubber starting to lose performance I may add a single layer of booster, and glue the rubber to a secondary blade. I use new a virgin sheet on my main blade. Sometimes I can use the rubber more than a year without boosting. I was practising 5 times a week, now I can only do about 4 times a week. I get training with a coach once a week. I use my secondary blade twice a week, my main blade also twice a week, and especially when training with my coach. 

Both blades are Butterfly Viscaria. In fact I have 5 plus a TBS, but mostly use two of them.

I decided to stop boosting because a couple of the sheets developed bubbles. Also boosting shortens the lifespan of your rubbers. Most sheets never developed any bubbles.

FdT



Edited by Fulanodetal - 08/01/2017 at 10:42pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote al_111 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/02/2017 at 6:23am
The National H3 out-of-package clearly has better playing characteristics than commercial, so it's not ALL hype. The matter questioned by those speaking about hype is the proportion in which (1) initially different composition of the topsheet/sponge and (2) factory tuning contribute to that fact, and, in case the latter being of significance, how much Nat H3 is better than properly boosted commercial.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BeaverMD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/02/2017 at 3:24pm
Originally posted by zeio zeio wrote:

Ever since the recent discussion on knockoff National H3, in which yours truly was regarded as deranged, which in all honesty was an understatement, I've felt a strong urge to start this thread.

Who here feels National H3 is all hype?

First, I wish to say that I appreciate zeio's contribution in this forum, especially the stuff that needs translation/interpretation from non-English media.  I wouldn't characterize him as deranged.

As for the question: Who here feels National H3 is all hype? Short answer from me is I do feel it is MOSTLY hype but not ALL hype.

Disclaimer: I'm not a Chinese rubber user/expert.  Every now and then, one would get my attention and I will buy it and I have done this for years with Friendship, LKT, Haifu, Palio, Globe, of course DHS, and several others.  I also have several clubmates who use Chinese rubbers and I have tried their rackets.  So for the most part, I can be considered an "outsider" for this question so take my response with a grain of salt.  Actually, I've never even tried a National H3 so what do I know (We're talking about non-Neo, right? The one with the white package with red Chinese characters?).  But here are my reasons for thinking it's MOSTLY hype:

1.  This is only a generalization but users of Chinese rubbers seem to follow what the CNT is using.  In the Ma Wenge/Wang Tao era, people wanted to use Avalox and TSP.  During KLH/LGL it was Globe 999 and Stiga.  And of course, with Ma Lin and WLQ, it was still Globe 999 with speed glue and I guess it transitioned to DHS post-glue ban? I would love to know the story of how DHS scored this gig actually.  How much guanxi did DHS have to provide to Cai Zhenhua? :) My guess is if Ma long switched to Brand X, we will then be discussing the National, Provincial, Commercial, Regular, Extra Crispy, Honey Mustard version etc. of that rubber.

2.  DHS does not seem to care about all the confusion in the market.  Maybe they have official announcements in Chinese media but I'm really disappointed in all of these confusing versions and packagings.  To me, they seem to enjoy it when recreational players are discussing these mythical versions.  And why not? It's working.  But it would be nice if they said "ok, here's what Ma Long uses.  It's a special topsheet and the sponge Super Formula DHS 42 degree blue sponge.  We will manufacture a limited amount for $100 a sheet.  You can only get it from authorized dealers online and physical stores on this list."  Or they can say "It is not available to the public because Ma Long uses a super hard sponge and it is not suited for everyone.  We have manufactured a version that is softer and easy to use for purchase."  Sure, there would still be counterfeits but they are doing something to minimize it.  I suppose players tolerate DHS more because it's somewhat cheaper?

3.  To me, Chinese rubbers are not optimal without speed glue or tuning.  In the speed glue days, I liked 729 Faster (white package with airplane), all LKTs, and Cream MRS.  The only rubbers I was able to play without speed glue/tuning were TG3 Neo, 729-2 Sensor, and BW2 (already factory tuned) on a OFF+ blade.  So if you need to tune H3 National, what's the point? Or even all the other versions of H3 Neo and non-Neo for that matter, if you will tune it anyway, what's the point? Why not save money and buy 729-5 or LKT Rapid Speed or SST Pro Team or Air Scirocco and tune it? See number 1.

So for these reasons, I think DHS promotes the marketing hype.  Again, I wish to emphasize that I am not a Chinese rubber user/expert.  Let the flaming begin LOL!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote berndt_mann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/02/2017 at 7:44pm
I would not characterize zeio as deranged.  A bit eccentric, perhaps, but isn't everybody who plays table tennis competitively?

Besides, his command of Chinese, English and Japanese is pretty damn good, from the standpoint of one whose English isn't bad, whose Mandarin is deteriorating, and whose Japanese is limited to konichi wa, komban wa, and hakko no naka ni nani aramas ka (I would not bet that I got that last phrase right).

Disclaimer:  I don't know squat about National H3, having been a British Leyland hard rubber man from 1997 to 2005.  I don't think that there was a National H3 back then.


Edited by berndt_mann - 08/02/2017 at 7:45pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fulanodetal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/03/2017 at 7:16am
"Disclaimer:  I don't know squat about National H3, having been a British Leyland hard rubber man from 1997 to 2005.  I don't think that there was a National H3 back then."

Just last night I was watching the final between Wang Liqin and Ma Lin back in Shanghai 2005. Still an amazing game!! Yes I believe Wang was in fact using a Hurricane III on his FH. Sponge was a dark blue one. But I cannot confirm.

FdT
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote berndt_mann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/03/2017 at 7:46am
(Fulanodetal)  Just last night I was watching the final between Wang Liqin and Ma Lin back in Shanghai 2005. Still an amazing game!! Yes I believe Wang was in fact using a Hurricane III on his FH. Sponge was a dark blue one. But I cannot confirm.

FdT

Well whup me upside the head and call me Kong Linghui.  This could be true.  As anyone who knows his table tennis from a hole in the ground can affirm, the only way to become a champ at this sport, recent past or present, is by using some version of Hurricane.  

And yes, FdT, I am aware of Poe's Law.  That's why I generally don't use emoticons.  Also, other than the good old ad hominem, I frequently resort to the ad antiquitatem in my posts.  In most cases this argument is considered to be a logical fallacy, but not when referring to what's happened to table tennis.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/03/2017 at 4:27pm


Well, I actually don't mind being called deranged, and thought it had a nice ring to it to kickstart the thread.

Here is to address some of BeaverMD's questions.

DHS came back into the limelight in the late 90s, after Friendship 729 had a run-in.

According to DHS:
H2 was designed for Wang Liqin and Yan Sen, for the 40mm ball.
H3 was designed for Liu Guozheng.
TG 2 was designed for Ma Lin.
TG 3 was designed for Wang Hao.

The G888 is said to be the predecessor of the Hurricane series. The first-ever model to be sold as "套胶"(a combo rubber in which topsheet and sponge are glued already) in China in 1998.



There is no doubt DHS is riding on the confusion to drive sales. Confusion creates discussion. Discussion creates buzz. So long as DHS knows and makes it clear Hurricane 3 is the industry-leading model in tacky rubbers, people will keep forking over their money. It won't benefit them to let people know what the CNT play with is different and off-limits to the general public. Butterfly denies the existence of Tenergy SP. This is true of all brands and manufacturers. They want to make you believe you're getting the same thing.

DHS does make an effort in curbing counterfeits. A report was posted by an official staff on Tieba in early 2017. On the DHS official site, there is a list of official brick-and-mortar resellers, some of which also host an online store. It's a never-ending battle.

Knockoffs in the making


On the issue of tuning National H3, it is believed National H3 takes booster better than the lower tiers. If people feel the need of getting National H3, they are likely much more serious than most about quality and performance. The very reason behind tuning is for better performance, right? In much the same way, if people are serious enough that they need to use Tenergy, it wouldn't make sense for them to use Tear Mender to stick it on, right?

8/15: Fixed image.

Edited by zeio - 08/15/2017 at 3:19pm
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndiHL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/15/2017 at 2:13am
Don't want to create a new thread although I have a question concerning the provincial version:
Are there real differences towards the commercial versions?
Or in other words: If an unboosted NEO H3 has the following points
control: 10
speed: 10
spin: 10

What would be the points for untuned NEO H3 provincial?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ThePongProfessor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/15/2017 at 2:41am
I will be testing a H3 Neo National from Tabletennis11.com shortly and I am very excited.
Website: www.thepongprofessor.com

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zeio View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/15/2017 at 3:28pm
Originally posted by AndiHL AndiHL wrote:

Don't want to create a new thread although I have a question concerning the provincial version:
Are there real differences towards the commercial versions?
Or in other words: If an unboosted NEO H3 has the following points
control: 10
speed: 10
spin: 10

What would be the points for untuned NEO H3 provincial?

10+ for all, if you insist.

Meant to write something on this, but got held up by something else.

Here is a picture comparison of the sponge at 540x by magazine Ping Pang:

Click to enlarge


There is also difference in the topsheet.

Edited by zeio - 08/15/2017 at 3:48pm
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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jk92 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jk92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/15/2017 at 6:16pm
Originally posted by zeio zeio wrote:

Originally posted by AndiHL AndiHL wrote:

Don't want to create a new thread although I have a question concerning the provincial version:
Are there real differences towards the commercial versions?
Or in other words: If an unboosted NEO H3 has the following points
control: 10
speed: 10
spin: 10

What would be the points for untuned NEO H3 provincial?

10+ for all, if you insist.

Meant to write something on this, but got held up by something else.

Here is a picture comparison of the sponge at 540x by magazine Ping Pang:

Click to enlarge


There is also difference in the topsheet.

What are the findings, in summary? Im not sure what to make of the magnified sponge photos
Timo Boll CAF Penhold
Donic Bluegrip R1
Andro Hexer Grip SFX
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zeio View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zeio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/15/2017 at 7:17pm
They look at impurities and foaming(pore size) in the sponge. National and Provincial have way less and are much more even than Commercial.

National is said to go through 8 rolls during rubber mixing.
Provincial is said to be 4 rolls.
Viscaria FL - 91g
+ Neo H3 2.15 Blk - 44.5g(55.3g uncut bare)
+ Hexer HD 2.1 Red - 49.3g(68.5g 〃 〃)
= 184.8g
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cole_ely View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/15/2017 at 7:26pm
Here are some questions nobody's been able to answer:

1.  If dhs has this magical formula that's much better, why don't they push it to every tom/dick/harry like tenergy does?  Why would you limit it to odd Asian distributors and such but not to an authorized distributor like Zeropong? Tom has told me many times they claim they make no such thing.

2.  Surely they do make rubber for the national team...would regular players like it?  Would real NT rubber come tuned or would each member have his own tuning preferences? If the rubber was really for the NT, why would it  come in individual commercial packages?

yes they're fake, and yes they're better (to the common player) than the dhs stuff
W1 St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b

Please let me know if I can be of assistance.
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penholderxxx View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote penholderxxx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/15/2017 at 9:07pm
I do not know if they are fakes ( and that the retailers are aware of it if they are fakes ) but the dhs h3 
( neo and non neo ) national and provincial; in blue and 'yellow' are readily available in malaysia.
Price can be about 5.5 times the ' commercial ' variety.
Even more expensive than your top range tenergy !

penholderxxx
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