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Giant Dragon Superspin G3 Hard review

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    Posted: 12/31/2010 at 4:23pm
Extra! extra! first seen here and only here at MyTT!! Big smile

This is a very new rubber which is not yet sold at the stores. But, thanks to our friends at ZTableTennis, we can get a sneak preview.

Photos first:














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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/31/2010 at 4:24pm
Once again, big Thank You goes to conradsong from ZTableTennis - they are the only (right?) authorized Giant Dragon dealer in the USA.

Some data:

brand: Giant Dragon
rubber: Superspin G3 (SSG3)
sponge: Hard version (there are two other versions Soft and S-2 (very soft??)
thickness: 2.2 (MAX). 1.8 and 2.0 are also available (more precisely, will be available) soon
weight: 68 uncut, 47.6 cut to YinHe W-1
hardness: topsheet 36, sponge 40 degrees (all approximate)
tackiness: completely non-tacky, surface is matte not glossy
type: offensive

As you can see from the pics, the rubber comes in a vacuum-sealed plastic envelope, and also it seems to be pre-tensioned or tuned - look at photo #4 with the domed rubber.

"Finger-press test" tells me that this rubber is about same hardness as PME - but let's wait for the formal results from my friend's durometer.

The bounce test produced some very weird results. Namely, when I bounced the ball on SSG3 side of my W-1, the height of the first bounce was about 3 (three!) times less than on the PME side. Also, it produces a very "speedgluey" crackling sound even when you hit the dead center of the blade.

The simplest spin test (throw the ball up, then when it falls and touches the racket, execute standard side-jerk motion, then watch the bounce of the ball off the non-moving racket when it falls again) produced almost horizontal second bounce, much better than for PME side. Perhaps this truly is a Super-Spin rubber??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/31/2010 at 4:24pm
Second part
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/01/2011 at 11:11am
Holy smokes.
I have never seen a factory tune produce that kind of dome!
I wonder how long that effect was designed to last?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/01/2011 at 11:47am
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

Holy smokes.
I have never seen a factory tune produce that kind of dome!
I wonder how long that effect was designed to last?


I have no idea. I suspect that GD doesn't have that data just yet... even if they do, we will find out what's what only after some real-world tests.

Also, "finger-press test" tells me that this rubber is about same hardness as PME - but let's wait for the formal results from my friend's durometer.

Now the bounce test produced some very weird results. Namely, when I bounced the ball on SSG3 side of my W-1, the height of the first bounce was about 3 (three!) times less than on the PME side. Also, it produces a very "speedgluey" crackling sound even when you hit the dead center of the blade.

The simplest spin test (throw the ball up, then when it falls and touches the racket, execute standard side-jerk motion, then watch the bounce of the ball off the non-moving racket when it falls again) produced almost horizontal second bounce, much better than for PME side. Perhaps this truly is a Super-Spin rubber??

Updated first review with this data.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote viktorovich Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/02/2011 at 1:39pm
 @JimT
 The second bounce - includes sensitivity to rotation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chris.b40 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/02/2011 at 4:09pm
That company (Giant Dragon ) is bringing out new table tennis products often.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/02/2011 at 8:17pm
Originally posted by viktorovich viktorovich wrote:

 @JimT
 The second bounce - includes sensitivity to rotation.


Of course. But what do you want me to do - spin the ball and then with my left hand put another blade underneath the falling ball? or let the ball drop to the naked floor and see it bounce...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/02/2011 at 8:18pm
Originally posted by chris.b40 chris.b40 wrote:

That company (Giant Dragon ) is bringing out new table tennis products often.


Yes, but they didn't have many rubbers to begin with - so they are playing catch-up. Now they only have about 8-10 inverted rubbers (at most) in their line-up. Compare that to any major manufacturers...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/02/2011 at 8:20pm
Unfortunately, could not go to a practice tonight. Hopefully tomorrow... and not for certain...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kolev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/02/2011 at 8:28pm
this top sheet looks really transparent soft and elastic.is it so or it's reflection from the flash? btw,can you please give some more info about the hardness , cause I'm not familiar with the sponge of PME
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/02/2011 at 9:36pm
what was on the sponge exactly? was it a glue layer? tacky?

and I still can't get over that dome. that topsheet will be under serious tension once it's mounted to a blade.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mmerkel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/02/2011 at 9:44pm
I haven't seen a dome like that on any factory rubber. I've seen reverse domes that were similar, but not a regular dome....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/03/2011 at 11:22am
Originally posted by Kolev Kolev wrote:

this top sheet looks really transparent soft and elastic.is it so or it's reflection from the flash? btw,can you please give some more info about the hardness , cause I'm not familiar with the sponge of PME


No it's not the flash - that's how it really looks.

Hardness of PME is around 39-40 on DHS scale. SSG3 feels about the same - but that is a very subjective "measurement"...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/03/2011 at 11:23am
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

what was on the sponge exactly? was it a glue layer? tacky?

and I still can't get over that dome. that topsheet will be under serious tension once it's mounted to a blade.


Nothing on the sponge. I used regular rubber glue and 30 minutes under press and the rubber was attached pretty securely, with no problems.

Apparently I misled you with the photo of the domed rubber - this is not what the rubber does by itself when out of the package. I mean you can lay it out quite flatly as it is shown in the other photos. But if you let it hang loosely you can then put it on the surface domed like on the photo #4. Again - that doesn't mean that the rubber curls itself like that, it's mostly just a position I put it in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rich215 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/03/2011 at 11:38am
Originally posted by JimT JimT wrote:

Originally posted by Kolev Kolev wrote:

this top sheet looks really transparent soft and elastic.is it so or it's reflection from the flash? btw,can you please give some more info about the hardness , cause I'm not familiar with the sponge of PME


No it's not the flash - that's how it really looks.

Hardness of PME is around 39-40 on DHS scale. SSG3 feels about the same - but that is a very subjective "measurement"...


Just a quick note.....

Don't forget there are 2 different sponges on Palio Macro Era, 42.5 and 47.5 hardness choices......so when you reference PME....note which one your comparing to so people understand your comparison clearly. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/03/2011 at 11:38am
Oh. That photo is false advertising then Wink

What caused the glare on the sponge though? It looks like rubber cement?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/03/2011 at 11:59am
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

Oh. That photo is false advertising then Wink

What caused the glare on the sponge though? It looks like rubber cement?


Not exactly false - I did not start with the idea to create a "false" dome, the rubber kinda went that way on its own, and I wanted tp make a good picture from the side.

Glare? That's my flash and/or the lights over the sofa Big smile

No kidding - you are right! the sponge was already covered with small amount of some adhesive. There was actually a plastic protector sheet which I pulled off of the sponge side.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/03/2011 at 12:01pm
Originally posted by Rich215 Rich215 wrote:

Originally posted by JimT JimT wrote:

Originally posted by Kolev Kolev wrote:

this top sheet looks really transparent soft and elastic.is it so or it's reflection from the flash? btw,can you please give some more info about the hardness , cause I'm not familiar with the sponge of PME


No it's not the flash - that's how it really looks.

Hardness of PME is around 39-40 on DHS scale. SSG3 feels about the same - but that is a very subjective "measurement"...


Just a quick note.....

Don't forget there are 2 different sponges on Palio Macro Era, 42.5 and 47.5 hardness choices......so when you reference PME....note which one your comparing to so people understand your comparison clearly. 


You are right, of course. I never played with PME 42.5 so I tend to forget about it. It's 47.5 deg of Palio hardness which is about 39-40 on DHS scale.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/03/2011 at 6:45pm
Well, I have played with it on FH for about 20-30 minutes. So far I am not impressed. It seems like there is a lot of spin, but then it turns out your opponent doesn't feel it... in medium power shots it can as easily net the ball as push it over... although quite decent grip and decent flat game.

I will give it another shot on Wednesday. Where I played today I could not step away from the table and try counterlooping, fishing/lobbing, chopping etc.
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Thanks Jim T,I look forward to your continued review.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote conradsong Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/03/2011 at 9:34pm
The Hard and Soft versions are factory tuned hard and soft sponges.  The S2 is an untuned version.  By definition of Hard and Soft, even the Hard is quite soft by chinese standards -- would be considered soft on most chinese rubbers...  the Soft is even softer.
 
Factory tuned, means this is not a "tensor" rubber, it is a speedglue equivalent tuning similar to other chinese products.  In other words, slow is slow and fast is fast -- unlike a tensor where slow is fast, and fast is even faster.
 
There is indeed a glue layer on the sponge, so you are only supposed to put VOC free glue on the blade.  In fact putting anything other than VOC free glue can react badly with the sponge glue layer (we've seen it).
 
Unlike the TopENERGY rubber, SuperSpin G3 relies completely on mechanical grip, there is almost no surface grip on the rubber until you get a little bit of penetration.  Compared with TopENERGY which is very Chinese, I consider SuperSpin G3 very Euro.  There is considerably more speed with SuperSpin due to the softer topsheet, taller pip design, and softer sponge which allows the factory tuning in the sponge to contribute much earlier, than with TopENERGY.  With TopENERGY, really need to stroke forward to push into the sponge to also get forward speed.
 
Since this is JimT's thread, I'll hold the rest of my comments.
 
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Originally posted by JimT JimT wrote:

Once again, big Thank You goes to conradsong from ZTableTennis - they are the only (right?) authorized Giant Dragon dealer in the USA.

Some data:
brand: Giant Dragon
rubber: Superspin G3 (SSG3)
sponge: Hard version (there are two other versions Soft and S-2 (very soft??)
thickness: 2.2 (MAX). 1.8 and 2.0 are also available (more precisely, will be available) soon
weight: 68 uncut, 47.6 cut to YinHe W-1
tackiness: completely non-tacky, surface is matte not glossy
type: offensive

As you can see from the pics, the rubber comes in a vacuum-sealed plastic envelope, and also it seems to be pre-tensioned or tuned - look at photo #4 with the domed rubber.

"Finger-press test" tells me that this rubber is about same hardness as PME - but let's wait for the formal results from my friend's durometer.

The bounce test produced some very weird results. Namely, when I bounced the ball on SSG3 side of my W-1, the height of the first bounce was about 3 (three!) times less than on the PME side. Also, it produces a very "speedgluey" crackling sound even when you hit the dead center of the blade.

The simplest spin test (throw the ball up, then when it falls and touches the racket, execute standard side-jerk motion, then watch the bounce of the ball off the non-moving racket when it falls again) produced almost horizontal second bounce, much better than for PME side. Perhaps this truly is a Super-Spin rubber??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote conradsong Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/04/2011 at 8:51pm
We have a SuperSpin G3 Soft that can ship to someone if they want to review it... as these are factory tuned, pretty sure it would not survive multiple reviewers (ie. off the blade for a long time), so it'll probably be just one person... and done, thethinker pinged first, please don't PM me.

Edited by conradsong - 01/04/2011 at 9:40pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/04/2011 at 9:34pm
Originally posted by conradsong conradsong wrote:

We have a SuperSpin G3 Soft that can ship to someone if they want to review it... as these are factory tuned, pretty sure it would not survive multiple reviewers (ie. off the blade for a long time), so it'll probably be just one person... and done, please don't PM me.


Great! So there will be a review on SSG3 Soft as well. Nice.

I intend to play with SSG3 Hard myself tomorrow and then I will let another guy to play with my setup - he is also a very good player and he will give me his opinion on it as well.
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Thanks JimT. Looking forward your review
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/06/2011 at 4:49pm
Played a bit more - 15 minutes or so. Again, mixed impression. I gave it then to a clubmate who played with it another 15 minutes and returned it to me saying that this rubber is not for his style. He plays with fast and heavily tacky rubbers and with SSG3 he could not loop or flick at all, since all his strokes are not suited for non-tacky Euro-style rubbers.

I played against SSG3 and felt again a very curious loss of spin when receiving the ball - my opponent did a good job of putting serious spin on the ball and he told me that it felt very spinny. However, when I returned his shots I didn't really encounter more than a rather medium strength spin. Speed is quite good now - no complaints there.

I think this is more a BH rubber than FH - at least currently it seems to me like that. I am still not entirely convinced in my opinions, and will give it another shot soon.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/11/2011 at 10:57am
Got the results of hardness measurement. Approximately, topsheet is around 36 degrees, sponge - around 40, same as TopENERGY.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AcudaDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/11/2011 at 12:25pm
I received Superspin G3 soft and hard sheets from Conrad in 2.2mm both red and black.  My son currently plays with TopEnergy 2.0 on his FH, and now is playing with the Superspin G3 soft in red 2.2mm on his BH.  I'm used to playing with soft rubber on my BH like Donic Desto F3 in max thickness.  The first thing I noticed about this rubber is that it's lighter than most Chinese rubbers, and it's also faster.  I agree with Jim about the spin.  It feels like you're able to generate good amounts of spin, however when blocking it doesn't seem as if it has that much spin.  I also agree that the soft will work well on the BH side, and you might like to give the G3 hard a try on the FH.  I put the G3 hard on my FH last night and hit some with the robot and it felt pretty good.  I definitely think this is a good quality rubber and that many people will enjoy playing with it.  It's kind of like a turbo-charged Sriver or Mark V.  Decent spin, not great, but good control and plenty of speed.  If you like European rubbers you will like the soft version, and if you like Chinese rubbers you will probably like the Hard rubber.  I especially like the lighter weight as the TopEnergy rubber is a heavy rubber. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/11/2011 at 12:37pm
Originally posted by AcudaDave AcudaDave wrote:

I received Superspin G3 soft and hard sheets from Conrad in 2.2mm both red and black.  My son currently plays with TopEnergy 2.0 on his FH, and now is playing with the Superspin G3 soft in red 2.2mm on his BH.  I'm used to playing with soft rubber on my BH like Donic Desto F3 in max thickness.  The first thing I noticed about this rubber is that it's lighter than most Chinese rubbers, and it's also faster.  I agree with Jim about the spin.  It feels like you're able to generate good amounts of spin, however when blocking it doesn't seem as if it has that much spin.  I also agree that the soft will work well on the BH side, and you might like to give the G3 hard a try on the FH.  I put the G3 hard on my FH last night and hit some with the robot and it felt pretty good.  I definitely think this is a good quality rubber and that many people will enjoy playing with it.  It's kind of like a turbo-charged Sriver or Mark V.  Decent spin, not great, but good control and plenty of speed.  If you like European rubbers you will like the soft version, and if you like Chinese rubbers you will probably like the Hard rubber.  I especially like the lighter weight as the TopEnergy rubber is a heavy rubber. 


It is indeed lighter which is a good thing... and not tacky like TopENERGY which also will be an attraction for some players.

However I cannot get past this strange issue with spin. I tried it again and again - and it just doesn't do spin very well. However, for players with mostly flat game it works quite good. The problem is that when playing against spinners you expect a non-spinny rubber to be more or less insensitive to the incoming spin. After all, if you cannot generate a lot of spin, then at least you want to not care about the spin coming from the other guy. It doesn't seem to work this way with this rubber which is probably due to the softer topsheet and therefore the deeper penetration of the incoming ball into SSG3. However that should lead to getting a better spin when you hit the ball - I just cannot find a logical explanation to this phenomenon. Also my serves were just harmless in the spin department, way worse than with Thors or even with PME.

I will try to play a bit with it again - maybe it just needed some time to break in, who knows?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thethinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/12/2011 at 6:49pm
So I got a black MAX Giant Dragon Superspin G3 soft (ssg3s) from ztabletennis this week. I put it on a NEXY Lissom that I am currently testing. Needly to say it wasn't a good idea. I
experienced few of the things other testers have noticed.

First, SSG3S comes in a nice big package, with the rubber glued, ready to play. The color of the sponge is red like Tenery (but more). The topsheet is grippy, light and somewhat soft compare to other Chinese.
After putting it on the Lissom it bounced like a Vega on the Korbel. The rubber is of good quality, light by Chnese standard as some mentioned. Even a 2.2mm (MAX) with a large cut didn't seem heavier
than usual.

I played with it just 10 minutes and couldn't deal with the curious lost of spin that the others noticed. I can't produce any power shots with this combo. I put in a lot of efforts but my opponent didn't feel it. It can be OK for blocking but hitting would be musy for this combo. That appalied to flips as well. I can't seem to have the feel to produce any spinny shot, even heavy pushes or serves. It is fast--I give it that. I think it's as fast or faster than Tenergy, definitely faster than Vega.

I will try to play this rubber on other blades and find one that works.
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