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TTNPP has Kailin Oil now |
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schen
Gold Member Joined: 03/26/2013 Location: San Diego, CA Status: Offline Points: 1244 |
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Posted: 07/10/2015 at 4:17pm |
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http://ttnpp.com/store/booster/839-kailin-oil-booster--34.html
I get a lot of messages asking me about Kailin Oil since it is not a very well known booster, but the good news is that TTNPP has started to carry it! Previously you could only get it from China, but the catch is that you cannot export liquids from China directly to the US. I got mine earlier from a taobao agent in Singapore who was willing to take the customs risk of shipping it to the US, but it was a very unreliable and unresponsive agent. Kailin Oil is what a handful of the higher level players in the US use (Liang Jishan, Zhang Kai, among others), and is known/popular among Chinese provincial players who don't have access to Haifu Oil (not seamoon). In comparison to the other popular Chinese boosters Dianchi and Seamoon, Kailin is somewhere in the middle. It can be applied over glue or directly to the sponge. It softens the rubber more than Seamoon and gives a LOT more power than Dianchi. It also does well on Tenergy/porous type rubbers which is what I currently use it for (I no longer use it on my FH because I like the firmness of chinese rubbers that Seamoon preserves). Its effect also lasts longer than both Dianchi and Seamoon (which is about 3-4 weeks for me). In comparison to the other booster I've used, Falco Tempo Long, Kailin softens the sponge slightly more and gives a much clearer/crisper feel to the rubber. FTL lasts longer but does not quite give the same amount of liveliness as Kailin. When using Kailin on Hurricane/Skyline, I usually apply 4-6 layers. On Tenergy, 2-3 layers is enough. If anyone else has any other questions about the Booster, please feel free to ask! Edited by schen - 07/10/2015 at 4:17pm |
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Roger Stillabower
Silver Member Joined: 02/17/2011 Location: usa Status: Offline Points: 803 |
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schen, is the Kalin oil thick like Seamoon and FTL ? I ordered The Kalin oil this morning, I hope I like it as much or more than Seamoon or FTL.
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Shifter
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42andbackpains
Silver Member Joined: 10/05/2014 Location: NYC Status: Offline Points: 623 |
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Schen....sssssshhhhhhhh!!!....Dam it..Now everbody is going to buy it...Get em while its hot...
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Mind is willing, but the back goes out too often :P
OSP Ultimate II 88 grams FH Dianchi D w/ Secret Sauce BH Butterfly T05 Red USATT rating keeps going down |
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the_theologian
Premier Member Joined: 01/11/2009 Location: U.S. Status: Offline Points: 3895 |
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and reasonably priced too!
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Appelgren Allplay ST / Vega Europe max
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schen
Gold Member Joined: 03/26/2013 Location: San Diego, CA Status: Offline Points: 1244 |
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It's thicker than dianchi, thinner than FTL and a lot thinner than seamoon.
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Argothman
Silver Member Joined: 12/20/2013 Location: The stars Status: Offline Points: 551 |
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Schen, I read a post somewhere about how Kailin would make forehand rubbers to thick, and how provincial players would use Dianchi on the H3 and Kailin on the backhand (tenergy). Is there any truth to this?
Also, our very own MLFan gave me some great information about boosters. He said that the Shanghai team uses Kailin oil only, while the Beijing team uses Dianchi because it allows them to 'eat' the ball more because it's softer. Other than that I'm incredibly excited to try it, it seems like the godsend of boosters - dries fast, good effect, etc. Have you switched back to Seamoon on the forehand? From personal experience I can attest that it maintains much of the firmness, but how does the speed compare? I haven't used any other high-end boosters. You should make a table with speed/spin/hardness ratings for each of the three main boosters (Dianchi, Seamoon, Kailin) to clear up confusion! Edited by Argothman - 07/10/2015 at 10:26pm |
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Argothman
Silver Member Joined: 12/20/2013 Location: The stars Status: Offline Points: 551 |
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I suspect that most of the boosters are fundamentally the same, and additives/concentrations are what determine the effect. For example, Dianchi being the thinnest and Seamoon being the thickest makes sense - Seamoon retains the most hardness of the rubber, while Dianchi retains the least.
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schen
Gold Member Joined: 03/26/2013 Location: San Diego, CA Status: Offline Points: 1244 |
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I've read that thread on the 1oak forum from leatherback's account of training in China. Every booster has the potential for making the rubber too thick - it is simply a matter of how many layers you use. 4 layers works well enough for me, and I have the same tools used by USATT/ITTF for testing thickness/flatness. If I have any problems, it is usually from accidentally using too much glue or using a blade that is not flat (yes this happens) which will skew the thickness measurements. And yes I have switched back to Seamoon for the FH while keeping Kailin for my BH. If I were to rank the effects of the boosters I've used, it would be: Softening Effect: Dianchi > Kailin > FTL > Seamoon Speed Effect: Seamoon = Kailin > FTL > Dianchi Spin Increase (low gear): Kailin = Dianchi > FTL > Seamoon Spin Increase (high gear): Seamoon > Kailin = FTL > Dianchi Drying Time (fastest to slowest): Kailin --> Dianchi --> Seamoon --> FTL Longevity: FTL > Kailin > Seamoon > Dianchi Feel (personal preference): Dianchi = Kailin > Seamoon > FTL edit: I'd also like to add (although it might be in my head): Arc Height on Loops: Seamoon > Dianchi > FTL > Kailin I noticed that Kailin makes it incredibly easy to loop-drive the ball in a very low arc. Noticeably lower than the other boosters.
Edited by schen - 07/10/2015 at 10:55pm |
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NextLevel
Forum Moderator Joined: 12/15/2011 Location: Somewhere Good Status: Offline Points: 14845 |
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Let it go! No one is going to beat you largely because they boost... Now where's my credit card... |
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I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
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the_theologian
Premier Member Joined: 01/11/2009 Location: U.S. Status: Offline Points: 3895 |
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lol. I don't have any heartache with people using it. These products just seem over the top in the price they command. But have at it!
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Appelgren Allplay ST / Vega Europe max
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cmetsbeltran15
Platinum Member Joined: 01/16/2006 Location: (ง ͠ ͠° ل͜ °)ง Status: Offline Points: 2427 |
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lmfao. know numerous beijing players and first heard about them using kai ling back in 2012
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chop4ever
Silver Member Joined: 08/10/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 812 |
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Hi SChen, how many sheets of H3 do you kill for a month honestly?
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There is no real "pro", "prov" or "NT" H3 in the market.
Falco is not a booster |
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beeray1
Premier Member Joined: 07/03/2008 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 5169 |
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I wouldn't call them over the top for price. Considering how many uses you get out of them, a bottle lasts so long it's ridiculous.
I've had the same bottle of seamoon for two years now, and I've still got a good amount left. I'm more worried about it being old than I am about running out. I might try some kailin, might not. Idk. Seamoon is the best bang for buck. Thing is, you can be camp kailin, camp dianchi etc.. but all three kinds are used by very high level players for H3, and they all three work extremely well. So if you're into boosting, you really can't go wrong with any of them. It's whatever you like best, or whatever you buy first.
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slevin
Premier Member Joined: 03/15/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 3602 |
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schen:
how do you manage the downtime (when rubber is off the blade for boosting)? Do you have 2 rubbers (so you boost 1 and put the other on the blade during that time)? How much is that downtime with kailin? With FTL it can be as much as 7 days.
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http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=50787 |
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Machine_Head
Super Member Joined: 07/24/2014 Location: Philippines Status: Offline Points: 266 |
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How does kailin compare to PO?
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schen
Gold Member Joined: 03/26/2013 Location: San Diego, CA Status: Offline Points: 1244 |
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Usually I go through about 1 sheet every month with one boost at the beginning, and one half way through the month. It depends how often you play though.
For downtime - Kailin dries very quickly. When I reboost, it only takes about 2 layers to get going again, and both layers can be done the same day. Usually once after I get back from practice/playing, and once the same evening before I go to bed. The oil dries quickly enough and it is ready to glue in the morning! Kailin, Seamoon, Dianchi, and FTL are in a completely different higher league than PO. There is no comparison really.
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chop4ever
Silver Member Joined: 08/10/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 812 |
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Hi SChen. Could you compare Kailin, Seamoon, Dianchi, and FTL in term of rubber life span? You have only one time re-boost it and is there no way to recover it at all? |
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There is no real "pro", "prov" or "NT" H3 in the market.
Falco is not a booster |
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Argothman
Silver Member Joined: 12/20/2013 Location: The stars Status: Offline Points: 551 |
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If you're not boosting too heavily you don't have to worry that much. I reboosted a ~1.5 year old H3 and it played just fine. Hurricane is an incredbily durable rubber so long as you don't push it too far. You can reboost it many times. |
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chop4ever
Silver Member Joined: 08/10/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 812 |
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Hi. You couldn't say "just fine" when you throw your self in an important match and suddenly your consistent FH topspin drop to the net without any reason. I can give away my old unusable H3 to friends and they still use it for a month after, but I've never trust that rubber. A month for a NT H3 is a way to burn money. Edited by chop4ever - 07/13/2015 at 12:06am |
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There is no real "pro", "prov" or "NT" H3 in the market.
Falco is not a booster |
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schen
Gold Member Joined: 03/26/2013 Location: San Diego, CA Status: Offline Points: 1244 |
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that's why I don't use national H3. I get a good price for h3 prov and it works well enough for me.
Commerical tg2 is even cheaper, and I can go through 4 sheets of that in 4 months and still have it be cheaper than a single sheet of tenergy.
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slevin
Premier Member Joined: 03/15/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 3602 |
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Curious, what are they and where do you get them? Do I have to mortgage / sell my house, cars, boat & vacation homes to be able to afford them?
Edited by slevin - 07/13/2015 at 4:28pm |
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Trade feedback:
http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=50787 |
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jimmyso
Member Joined: 12/04/2004 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 79 |
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Hi Schen, how can your boosted H3 Prov (non neo) last one month without some pimples of the topsheet detaching from the sponge in the sweetspot? Especially when doing hard/fast topspin practice against block or topspin (at and off the table) I'll notice some pimples detaching after some training sessions (4-5) The H3neos are even worse, they detach without boosting...I tried 4 or 5 H3N and 3 H3prov. I'm now using H3 nat white package (+ 2 layers FTL on 2 layers of glue) and the glue bond is much stronger between topsheet and sponge than H3 neo and H3 prov, it' ll last up to 10-15 sessions without bubbleing. So, the limiting factor for durability is NOT the topsheet wear, it's the resilience of the bond between the topsheet and sponge. Has anybody similiar problems? |
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chop4ever
Silver Member Joined: 08/10/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 812 |
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Yes I have. And my solution is similar to SChen: using commercial DHS and control the booster. You will not make bubbles on the top-sheet if you use the harder DHS rubber, such as D41 or D42 without boosting. It's seem ridiculous but you could definitely find the middle way to balance between speed and consistency. |
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There is no real "pro", "prov" or "NT" H3 in the market.
Falco is not a booster |
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MLfan
Super Member Joined: 04/23/2015 Location: China Status: Offline Points: 486 |
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You should definitely not use 41/42 degree H3s lol... Provincial players use 39 and CNT mainly use 40. Main players use 41. The higher the degree, the better the player you have to be to hit through such a hard songs and maintain accuracy.
Prov rubbers rarely bubble for me, and they shouldn't even bubble that often if you get proper provincial H3s. The provincial players change a sheet once a week, but obviously nobody here trains that much. Maybe you can look into the source of your H3s :) |
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ashishsharmaait
Silver Member Joined: 02/27/2013 Location: India Status: Offline Points: 914 |
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You have got to be kidding me! Pros play 1 entire Pro Tour tournament without changing sheets and you can bubble a H3 Nat in 14-15 sessions? The common reason for bubbling is the booster being absorbed in the sponge too quickly and the solution is to add a thin layer of glue between boosts (which you can remove after boosting). |
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chop4ever
Silver Member Joined: 08/10/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 812 |
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You said DHS has never released provincial or National version or H3, so why do you and many people here still could buy them? |
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There is no real "pro", "prov" or "NT" H3 in the market.
Falco is not a booster |
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jimmyso
Member Joined: 12/04/2004 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 79 |
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First, I apply 2 layers of glue and then I start to boost 2 layers of FTL. 3 days between the layers. I let it sit until the rubber is almost flat again...takes about 2-3 weeks. And the glue to blade. I doubt that they play one tournament without changing. In daily training they wear down a sheet in one week (euro+jap rubbers). And for pros it doesn't matter if a rubber bubbles, because the have almost unlimited supply of good rubbers. Somewhere I read that the good chinese guys have supply for one rubber per day in average. Actually, you don't get the high quality rubbers in a shop. I use the H3 non-neo "nat=best commercial quality" (white package) 39, because the consistency in sponge and topsheet ist very good and quality of the bond is sufficient. I bubbled almost every rubber commercially available in shops except for Tenergy. The only pro rubbers available for me are from ESN...but the performance for me is not so good as good selected commercial Tenergy. And durability for Tenergy is better.(10-15 sessions for Tenergy 05) Probably i should try Spinart...butterfly's glue bond between topsheet and sponge was always better that the other companies. Edited by jimmyso - 07/15/2015 at 9:07am |
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NextLevel
Forum Moderator Joined: 12/15/2011 Location: Somewhere Good Status: Offline Points: 14845 |
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Jimmyso is on CNT...
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I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
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chop4ever
Silver Member Joined: 08/10/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 812 |
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you throw money to the window... The problem is FTL. Change the booster, choose harder rubber. |
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There is no real "pro", "prov" or "NT" H3 in the market.
Falco is not a booster |
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nittakuball
Platinum Member Joined: 03/17/2008 Location: SingaporeCanada Status: Offline Points: 2564 |
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wow,$60 for 250ML is $$$$
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DHS 032
Butterfly Bryce Highspeed Singapore & Canada |
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