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Getting the most out of a robot

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    Posted: 03/03/2012 at 12:54am
Hi all,

I have an Oukei S9 robot which I have used to practice individual strokes but so far this practice has not translated into any real game improvement. I am losing to styles of play that are not easily replicable with a robot (e.g. chopping). I was wondering if anyone has any tips on how to get the most out of a robot. Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GoldenDragoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/03/2012 at 8:18am
Originally posted by clickclack clickclack wrote:

Hi all,I have an Oukei S9 robot which I have used to practice individual strokes but so far this practice has not translated into any real game improvement. I am losing to styles of play that are not easily replicable with a robot (e.g. chopping). I was wondering if anyone has any tips on how to get the most out of a robot. Thanks!<span style="font-weight: bold;"></span><span itemscope="" item="http://schema.org/Product"></span>


If you want to practice against chop, move the robat back away from the table so you can shot long slow underspin.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rich215 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/03/2012 at 10:12am
Originally posted by GoldenDragoon GoldenDragoon wrote:



If you want to practice against chop, move the robat back away from the table so you can shot long slow underspin.


excellent advise especially for that type of shot by creating a more realistic timing and loft/pace of the ball coming at you.     

Also do this with loop practice as well.  Hopefully you have the room to move the robot well back off the table. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tonycl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/03/2012 at 3:00pm
Yes, you can move the robot back to have a better underspin practice session.
Robot is a good form of training if your body action is correct, and ofcourse is bad for you if you have incorrect actions. The saying pratice makes perfect only is valid if you not practising incorrectly, otherwise it is called habbits
 
Body actions:
foot work, weight transfer, recovery, waist movement, upper body position, head position and your FH or BH action.
 
If you can, receord your training session and post the video.
We can all help advise on any technical issues.
 
During match games, you would need to get use to the pace of the ball, amount of spin and adjust your positions accordling, ie going forward to the ball, or let the ball come to you.
If you can, get your body actions perfect with robot, and do drills with a practice partner and work on your weakness (than oppose to playing matches).
You can also practice multi balls drills (if you have enough balls, and recovery net it would be easier)
 
Table tennis is a very technical sport, and I know it is near impossible for non professionals to have everything perfect, but if you can improve from techincal advances bit by bit, it will be great.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dingyibvs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/03/2012 at 3:47pm
A couple of other pointers:

1)Let's say you're doing BH practices, it's easy to develop a motion where even before the ball comes out, your body and arm are already in position for a BH loop.  That's obviously useless during games because you don't know if the ball is coming to your BH.  What you need to do is to set the frequency of the robot to such that it allows you to take a mini step to the right, execute a FH swing, and then the next ball shoots out toward your BH.  Your FH swing will be just swinging against air, so it won't really practice your FH shot, but it'll let you practice executing a BH shot IMMEDIATELY after a FH shot, i.e. good FH/BH connections.

2)If your robot can oscillate, set it to a lower frequency and ball speed and let it oscillate to random spots onto the table.  After you hit every shot, return to ready position and CLOSE YOUR EYES.  Don't open them until you hear the next ball being spit out, and quickly return it with a bit more power than you can consistently land(no point in keep practicing shots you can already make consistently).  One of the weaknesses with robots, no matter how good they are, is that you always know which direction it's heading, but in a real game you often can't anticipate nearly as well.  This helps to alleviate that problem quite a bit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote APW46 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/03/2012 at 4:12pm
Turn it off. Practice your serves. I'm not trying to be clever, If you practice your serves you will gain more benefit than playing a robot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote clickclack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/03/2012 at 9:14pm
Thanks for the suggestions everyone. I will definitely try positioning the robot far from the table. Just for the record I do get coaching. I purchased a robot for daily practice after I get home from work and can't make it to a club to play.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GoldenDragoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/03/2012 at 11:29pm
Originally posted by APW46 APW46 wrote:


Turn it off. Practice your serves. I'm not trying to be clever, If you practice your serves you will gain more benefit than playing a robot.


Its a very good point, but you need to have a complete game, not just good serves. Also good players return good serves so there can be a limit to their effectiveness. A good shot however will always be a good shot.

To me the best benefit I get from a robot is chasing balls down when they osillate. My mates have a y&t S27 that I practice on every now and then. We set it up so it serves short underspin to my backhand then a couple of fast topspins to random landing positions for a total of 10 balls. Then they hit start again and off we go. To make it better they keep playing with the number of slow underspins and landing areas of the topspins every 2-3 sets. Apart from a crazy workout I get alot out of this both defending the balls that are hard to reach and hammering the ones I get into position for. The goal being get every ball back so the opponent gets a chance to miss.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Old-Man-Southpaw Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/21/2012 at 11:32am
I just have a cheap Newgy 1050, but I'm using it to practice any shots that I need to hit harder or place better, or with more consistency.  I use the random oscillation (width of the table) and random speed (length of my side for landing point) and random wait to help me learn to adjust to the different balls I'll be getting, and I start with 100 balls each time and try to count how many I miss.  I plan to reduce the wait times as I get better.  I also wrote a program that "exercises" some of my setup and attack shot sequences.

Anyway, its only been a few weeks, but its helping.  I'm surprising better players lately.  Still have ups and downs, but beating anyone in a match that's over 2000 is a big thing for me, all things considered. 

--- Push/Chop or Attack ---

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/20/2012 at 3:09pm
Another that you can do is, don't let the robot shoot from the center of the table.
Move the robot so the angle is different.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GoldenDragoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2012 at 1:21am
Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:



Another that you can do is, don't let the robot shoot from the center of the table.
Move the robot so the angle is different.
 


This us 50% of the reason why I just purchased a newstar 2080 over the y&t 989h. The ability to have a complete program of shots ready to with the robot in different positions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2012 at 6:05am
Originally posted by GoldenDragoon GoldenDragoon wrote:

Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:



Another that you can do is, don't let the robot shoot from the center of the table.
Move the robot so the angle is different.
 


This us 50% of the reason why I just purchased a newstar 2080 over the y&t 989h. The ability to have a complete program of shots ready to with the robot in different positions.
 
Makes sense, I am also keeping an eye on the newstar 2080. Due to certain reason, I can only purchase a robot about 1 years time. and that one is on my number 1 list.
 
Besides robot, a multi ball feeder is actually better, but we are waiting for Tommyzai to organise
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GoldenDragoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/22/2012 at 6:46am
If you want something to feed you balls, look at one of the i-pongs. Cheap as for a robot (and simple to match). However...... The i-pong pro is a duel wheel robot, and with a simple modification with some three way switches, you can produce dead balls to heavy spin with oscillation. All of 30 seconds to set up. The i-pong topspin hits only topspin, but is battery powered so you can take it anywhere.


Edited by GoldenDragoon - 04/22/2012 at 7:04am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dingyibvs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/24/2012 at 11:42pm
I have the iPong topspin robot and it's actually pretty useful.  As a cheap robot, the balls it generates are not very consistent, which is actually pretty useful because you have to watch the ball and make slight adjustments for each shot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/25/2012 at 3:33am
Dingyibvs
How far back can you put the iPong?
Ie can I put it 1 meter behind the table (on a seperate stand)?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Imago Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/26/2012 at 2:56am
How back away from the table you can put an Oukei S9 without removing the collecting net. And also, can you put it to one side?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/26/2012 at 3:01am
Never ever set the robot to place the ball with the exact same location.... I found it out the hard way, it makes you lazy and flatfooted which translate to poor footwork. Even when you're just practising FH/BH, make the robot at least oscillate about a quarter to half of the table width... I always practice multiball with the robot shooting balls all over the place... It has made my rallying capabilities very much stronger...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/26/2012 at 3:09am
if something is wrong, don't blame the robot but blame it on your technique, find reasons why your technique isn't working out for you. A robot works both ways, it cements good technique, and it also cements bad technique into your mind...

With backspin from choppers, pushing off your feet is a really effective source of energy to overcome the backspin, you just modify the amount of "pushing off" to deal with different degrees of backspin... watch this for a demonstration .

Also if you do not have strong legs then you have 2 other options:

1) pushing back with great feeling, keeping the ball low and with great placement

2) you can use funky blade angle changes to overcome or hit through backspin can't really explain this properly...watch short pip players to get an idea how to do it...inverted can do this as well but i really don't recommend it...


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/26/2012 at 5:15am
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:

Never ever set the robot to place the ball with the exact same location.... I found it out the hard way, it makes you lazy and flatfooted which translate to poor footwork. Even when you're just practising FH/BH, make the robot at least oscillate about a quarter to half of the table width... I always practice multiball with the robot shooting balls all over the place... It has made my rallying capabilities very much stronger...


I think this is really based on how focus you are with your footwork.
IE a FH to FH cross court can also be "footwork less", but a player can also use full footworks to hit and get back into position.

But yes, it is also very important to play "random" placements, but with this, I prefer multi ball feeder more than robot (where the feeder stand at the opponent end and not by the net)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote power7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/26/2012 at 10:47pm
One simple footwork drill if the ball is going to same place on FH is to hop when hitting FH.  Start in normal FH position, then hop to be parallel to table edge when hitting the ball.  Then hop back to ready position for the next ball.  Repeat for a minute.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blahness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/28/2012 at 10:01am
Originally posted by ZApenholder ZApenholder wrote:

 
But yes, it is also very important to play "random" placements, but with this, I prefer multi ball feeder more than robot (where the feeder stand at the opponent end and not by the net)

Haha when there is no multiball feeder then the robot will have to suffice...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Old-Man-Southpaw Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/28/2012 at 10:49am
For trying to learn new things, its much better to use a robot than asking a person to hit balls to you when you don't have things working, yet
--- Push/Chop or Attack ---

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ZApenholder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/28/2012 at 12:10pm
Well, if you trying to learn new things and you don't have things working yet, robot could be a good or bad thing for you.
Bad in terms of practicing bad habits and incorrect techniques.

Imo, robots, multi ball feeder, (decent) practice partner can all be good if done correctly.

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