Yoshida Kaii - New Douchebag

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3dMyRwUeE4

Nothing new, he's been king of the table douchebags for a long time now. Why this is allowed in TT is beyond me. 

Eric Fountain wrote: Nothing new, he's been king of the table douchebags for a long time now. Why this is allowed in TT is beyond me.

Coaches are encouraging players to choose and fining them for not doing so. Without ITTF intervention, this is an escalating epidemic.

NextLevel wrote: Coaches are encouraging players to choose and fining them for not doing so. Without ITTF intervention, this is an escalating epidemic.

I've wondered what was driving this. 

Of course the ITTF fined ZJK for kicking a barrier after the tournament was officially over, so they can certainly do something about this.

Baal wrote: We can have rating system.  King of Douchebags.  Prince of Douchebags.  The Baron of Douchiness.  The Marquis de Sac-de-Douche.  Etc. etc.

Edited by heavyspin - 01/25/2017 at 11:58am

berndt_mann wrote: P.S:  Larry, you do a Donald Trump impression as well as or better than Alec Baldwin.  When may we expect a Bavly/Trump explanation of table tennis and alternative facts?

paladin wrote: NextLevel wrote: Coaches are encouraging players to choose and fining them for not doing so. Without ITTF intervention, this is an escalating epidemic. If I understand you correctly, you claim that coaches are encouraging players to cho and imposing monetary penalty if they refuse? What is your source?

And what benefit does this give to the player other than distracting and pissing your opponent so they make mistakes.

unstopabl3 wrote: paladin wrote: NextLevel wrote: Coaches are encouraging players to choose and fining them for not doing so. Without ITTF intervention, this is an escalating epidemic. If I understand you correctly, you claim that coaches are encouraging players to cho and imposing monetary penalty if they refuse? What is your source? And what benefit does this give to the player other than distracting and pissing your opponent so they make mistakes.

Well ok then.

Of course, the fact that those players (Fukuhara, Feng Tianwei) have never won anything really significant should be taken into account. 

And they should be juxtaposed to people like Zhang Yining, Waldner, WLQ, KLH, Persson, Ma Long etc. etc. etc. --- actual singles world champions--- all of whom occasionally would celebrate their winning of a really important or tense point, but who for the most part made every point they won seem like something they do every day and every time.  ZJK too, until the match is over anyway.

And you can extend that to related sports with towering players like Borg and Sampras and Federer, all of whom had careers superior to, for example, Connors (and you can read Brad Gilbert's book Winning Ugly for a more informed analysis  of why that stuff is done, and it has a lot more to do with unnerving the opponent than pumping yourself up). 

So I understand the theory but my own noobish opinion is that there is absolutely no reason to believe that it works.  Instead it just turns you into a douchebag.

Baal wrote: And you can extend that to related sports with towering players like Borg and Sampras and Federer, all of whom had careers superior to, for example, Connors (and you can read Brad Gilbert's book Winning Ugly for a more informed analysis  of why that stuff is done, and it has a lot more to do with unnerving the opponent than pumping yourself up).

I wouldn't say Jimmy's career is inferior to Borg's or Sampras - even if it is, the difference is not much visible to us from the bottom of the mountain. There is also John McEnroe, enfant terrible of that generation.

People like that sometimes are great players as well. Thankfully, not very often.

TTFrenzy wrote: unstopabl3 wrote: paladin wrote: NextLevel wrote: Coaches are encouraging players to choose and fining them for not doing so. Without ITTF intervention, this is an escalating epidemic. If I understand you correctly, you claim that coaches are encouraging players to cho and imposing monetary penalty if they refuse? What is your source? And what benefit does this give to the player other than distracting and pissing your opponent so they make mistakes. really dude? im always surprised by the noob levelish questions in mytt pumping urself up, self affirmation etc etc. JESUS NOOBS its plain logic. If u want sources like its a f00king (irish connor mc gregor accent) academic issue, fukuhara's and tianweis coach actually force them to be positive with cho at every point. not gonna waste my time searching for the youtube interview that I saw 4 years ago just to reply to your stupid comment. Noobs do your self a favor and stop playing TT, its too complicated for your peanut brain to process

Theres choing, and then there is over the top choing.

NL actually by Connors time the Australian was already considered a Slam even, although it is true that some players would skip it because of the travel time. Sampras won the Australian twice. Connors won it once.  Slams matter and the Australian Open is not the reason for the large difference in the number of slam events each won.  Sampras in his career was the more dominant player.  Both were great.   

But THAT WAS NOT THE MAIN POINT.

Connors douchebaggery made him a bit of an outlier like McEnroe and Nastase and Tiriac and to some extent Clark Graebner. But none of those guys choed like a rooster on every point they won!

But if you'd like, just see the table tennis examples I used from modern era.

And to make it clear, even some choing I can understand and don't mind.  It's an emotional sport and players aren't robots.  I never really noticed that ZJK would cho in an over the top way, for example.  And going back to tennis, some of the super stoic players like Borg and Lendl were less popular because of it.

But to use it as such an overtly hostile act to try to get under your opponent's skin, like these new TT players are doing (and are being coached to do), that is something recent.  ITTF needs to put their foot down.  Like I said before, if they can take away ZJK's price money for kicking a barrier AFTER HE WON A MATCH IN THE FINALS (!!!) they can certainly start to make this a point of emphasis. 

berndt_mann wrote: Here's how a truly sophisticated table tennis douchebag should make the most of cognitive dissonance so as to confuse and infuriate his opponent.  Cho! on every point you win.  Cho! on every point you lose.  Cho! on every point your opponent wins.  And of course Cho! on every point your opponent loses.