|
|
ZJK vs. Wang Hao WTTC 2013 LGL commenting |
Post Reply | Page <12 |
Author | ||||||
snerdly
Super Member Joined: 03/05/2004 Status: Offline Points: 158 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
Taken out of context; the problem and punishment for failing to seize opportunity is failure to obtain the prize, i.e., the WTTC singles title. Ma Lin wasted his chances for that. |
||||||
Sponsored Links | ||||||
bros
Super Member Joined: 08/12/2004 Location: Japan Status: Offline Points: 197 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
+1 . I think Ma Long better back with TBS , his shot is under Whao( not feel heavy ) compare with Whao shot. |
||||||
xzws
Member Joined: 05/25/2011 Status: Offline Points: 45 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
Please read between the lines. The video never really talked about the true reason of kicking him out. You don't dismiss a player only because he is arrogant. There must have been a particular incident. Several journalists tried to ask ZJK and his family about the true story. They always evaded the question and only would say that ZJK wasn't mature enough and made some mistake(s). There are many rumors about it. All the versions I have seen have something to do with gambling. Edited by xzws - 05/22/2013 at 10:49am |
||||||
thethinker
Silver Member Joined: 11/17/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 776 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
Perhaps I should start a new topic with this question..., but at the risk of anger some penholders (I play ph myself), I will bring back the old question of the future of penhold. We remember that poor ML got beat up by WLQ and WH by ZJK in the finals constantly, plus ZJK went thru the two top penholders easily at this world. Can ph have a future and can there be a ph world champion? Sh players have weakness but ph players just seem unable to play against their weakness. For example, ZJK has a hard time against a quicker player like ML and YA, but WH, ML, XX don't paly fast enough to win against ZJK. They are all powerful players but too slower against ZJK. If they become faster their power go down and their forehand become weak, too weak to win. Can any ph or any player be fast and powerful?...Just some random thoughts and concern for my other playing style after seeing the world.
|
||||||
stiltt
Assistant Admin Joined: 07/15/2007 Location: Location Status: Offline Points: 1026 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
|
||||||
thethinker
Silver Member Joined: 11/17/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 776 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
I think the same would apply to both ph and sh. ML is quick (i.e. connecting one stroke to the next, and not necessary just topspin) but his power (quality of shot) is lower than ZJK. If he load up with power like ZJK he will be slower, right? I am just asking the question. It seems very hard, close to impossible to be quick and powerful unless you are way above the others. The answer so far tells me to choose power over quickness if you want to win, until ML wins of course!
|
||||||
ttTurkey
Silver Member Joined: 09/07/2010 Status: Offline Points: 516 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
Absolutely, if LGL says on camera that ZJK was sent back to his provincial team for being "arrogant, conceited and impetuous", I will read between the lines and conclude that he has a gambling problem and that he had an affair with another team member (as someone else posted). I've also been around long enough to know that everybody talks in coded messages and doesn't say what they mean. But in this case, as crazy as it sounds, I perhaps think that LGL may have been telling the truth to fool everyone. I know, I know... |
||||||
tianhai
Member Joined: 09/21/2004 Location: Singapore Status: Offline Points: 87 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
I think you misunderstood Liu. He said ZJK's shot is higher quality than malong's because the amount of spin zjk impart on the ball is much more than malong's shot, thus causing the ball not to bounce up when it touches the opponent's court. the ball bounce up a little, accelerate forward and then sink downwards immediately. this effect is caused by the amount of spin zjk imparts. therefore, it's difficult to defence against zjk's shot.
|
||||||
ejmaster
Platinum Member Joined: 08/09/2009 Location: madrid Status: Offline Points: 2609 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
The overall wttc impression is that whao played a new and better level than what he usually plays. And particullarly shined against MaL with a very well placed service better bh motion and more focused play.
Zjk prevailed with awsome solid bh play, service and receive consistency and playing rythm. Ma Long service receive was weak and faced a stronger whao at the wrong time. There were no mental issues but better technical aspects what mean a lot of work behind. Whao prepared a stronger technical play. I realized zjk also raised his bh play level even more. Edited by ejmaster - 05/23/2013 at 9:20am |
||||||
EJ Club.
MM T05(fh)/Srvfx(bh); InfVps,LSW,Viscaria,RwV,TBAlc,PG7,yextsc,yeo. EJmaster wood. |
||||||
BeaverMD
Gold Member Joined: 11/09/2007 Location: Maryland, USA Status: Offline Points: 1897 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
Now see, this is the kind of stuff we really should be covering much more in mytt. Here in the U.S., gambling organizations i.e. mafia, gangsters can have a basketball player or hockey player in their pockets. The player does not necessarily have to dump the match. He can play in such a way where his team wins by 5 points rather than destroying the opposing team (point shaving). When a sport gets big enough, point shaving even happens in youth soccer, little league baseball, etc. I wonder if TT has reached this level in China. I know it happens in lawn tennis.
|
||||||
suds79
Silver Member Joined: 08/20/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 878 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
I agree with this. You know leading into the tournament, I've always been impressed with Ma Long's & ZJK's backhand counterdrives. They're compact, quick & fast. However, in WH's matches, seemed as though Ma Long couldn't handle his backhand and ZJK excelled in this area against WH. Perhaps ZJK has the best backhand of all of them? His run-around backhand banana flick on service return is amazing. It got me to thinking, would you say that at this top, elite level the difference, stroke wise, (obviously psychology and ability to perform in the clutch is huge) the player with the strongest backhand has the best chance to prevail? Seems to me at this level, all players have amazing forehands and they frequently get into backhand counterdriving rallies to avoid the opponent's forehand. Thus, it's hit more often and the player with the better backhand has the best chance to win. Just a theory. Anybody feel free to poke holes in it. ;) Edited by suds79 - 05/23/2013 at 9:22am |
||||||
NextLevel
Forum Moderator Joined: 12/15/2011 Location: Somewhere Good Status: Offline Points: 14847 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
When most people are impressed with Ma Long's forehand, it has much more to do with Ma Long's counterlooping ability, not the actual stroke quality. None of us have blocked Ma Long's forehand so none of us can tell how much spin he generates. But he is the best counterlooper in the world. Sometimes, ZJK and Xu Xin get there but that is Ma Long's world. What his CNT opponents can do better is that knowing his game, they can play to his weaknesses better than others can. He often cannot keep the ball short more than once in a rally, especially on his forehand. Yan An exploited this. Wang Hao exploited a weakness with reverse service receive (at least for that one match).
Hopefully, some of the people who always talk about trying to loop like Ma Long will note that his pace is not the only way to win the point. |
||||||
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
||||||
xzws
Member Joined: 05/25/2011 Status: Offline Points: 45 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
Did I ask you to find the gambling problem from the video alone? Stop trying to be funny and please speak straightforward in a logical way, because you are not funny at all. Ask youself this: Do you see an enough reason to dismiss a world champion material from the national team and to almost end his career? Did the video clearly explain that? If you just want to accept whatever LGL says in the video and don't like to get additional info, it's your choice and I don't blame you. I was providing an alternative view based on what I have read elsewhere. I clearly said it was a rumor, but at least to me it answers some natural questions surrounding the mysterious dismissal of ZJK. |
||||||
xzws
Member Joined: 05/25/2011 Status: Offline Points: 45 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
The rumors I heard about ZJK was NOT about match fixing. And I wouldn't believe he had gambled on TT. Never heard of gambling on TT in China. On the other hand, the underground gambling on local and international soccer games is quite popular in China. DISCLAIMER: I am not saying ZJK gambled on any sports. |
||||||
skip3119
Premier Member Joined: 02/24/2006 Location: somewhere Status: Offline Points: 8257 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
Off topic.
Ratings Central has not updated the match results between Jike Zhang & Wang Hao.
It has been quite a few days now. Edited by skip3119 - 05/23/2013 at 5:01pm |
||||||
skip3119
|
||||||
ZApenholder
Premier Member Joined: 03/04/2012 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 4806 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
I've been listening to a lot of coaches comment and even LGL on the WTTC
So many words are use about the Mentalality state of the players. "心态" or Hsin Tai. So for the ones that think there is no problem with the players, LGL and co thinks otherwise |
||||||
ZApenholder
Premier Member Joined: 03/04/2012 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 4806 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
ZJK gambled away around RMB 200 000 once.
And that was the big one for LGL to ban him from CNT. source - CNT coach |
||||||
anguye9
Beginner Joined: 05/21/2013 Status: Offline Points: 12 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
I have read all comments on this forum and decide to post for the first time. I think I understand what exactly happened to ml failure because I experienced it. I have play table tennis on and off for over 15 years. My style include block and attack from both wings. My forehand is way stronger than than my backhand but my natural shots, shots that I started out to learn table tennis is my backhand. It is the shot I can rely on anyday. However, when I got nervous during tournament, I can become stiff and can't use my forehand to loop. It the case to ml. Over the years I watched him play, when he lost bad to players that he normally would beat them, he got too nervous and didn't play his normal level. Ones can see throughout this world tournament he had avoided using backhand or missing many of the back hand against all of his opponents. They all know it but wh is the one that make him felt awkward and completely break down. It was a sad truth and ml knew it. He become more nervous because he faced opponents that he had lost to before. From niiwa to tb to wh especially wh who beat him twice at the same stage. Wh definitely played well. Maybe the best since 09. Wh game is always stable and balance. Once ml got nervous and be himself, he might as well lost the match before it was start. I think ml can only able to play 60 percent and wh played at 100 percent. Zy played the game just like wh balance and well control but better wh in blocking aspect. In a long run, zy will beat wh more. It all come down personality. Ml is introvert. He want to win badly so he become nervous when facing challenge matchs. His game is pure power. Sometime he got nervous he can't relax thus he messed up his backhand. He have been practice bh more lately but his forehand is a natural shot just like wl. So in conclusion, ml lost to wh because of mental issue. He is a professional player and played thousand matchs but still get nervous because he is a human. I'm sure we all get nervous and perform lower out level during our Tt match. Please understand and felt sympathy toward ma long instead criticized about him. After all he might be the best talent Tt player out here.
|
||||||
mwechsler
Member Joined: 08/19/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 22 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
I agree with this evaluation. I also think Ma Long is more fun to watch and has a more complete game than the others.
|
||||||
Marius
|
||||||
stiltt
Assistant Admin Joined: 07/15/2007 Location: Location Status: Offline Points: 1026 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
welcome to the forum; I agree with all you wrote too. I still want to give credit to WH for being able to squeeze ML, make him groggy and not give him a chance to play his real game; it takes talent, experience and strong willpower to do that to (one of) the very best players out there and WH made it happen.
|
||||||
JimT
Premier Member Joined: 10/26/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 14602 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|||||
That is exactly why I think that having a coach by his side who could "wake him up" or give him a moral boost during the match would help Ma Long tremendously. I really do not see why CNt continues this old tradition of not coaching Chinese players when they play vs each other during international competitions. Nowadays it just seems silly and counterproductive. But I could be wrong... I've been before.
|
||||||
Single Ply Hinoki Club, Founding Member
Say "no!" to expensive table tennis equipment. Please... |
||||||
Post Reply | Page <12 |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |
Forum Home | Go to the Forums | Forum Help | Disclaimer
MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd. |