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Double hit is legal!
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Tassie52 View Drop Down
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Points: 1318 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tassie52 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/03/2015 at 11:00pm
Originally posted by jumpulse jumpulse wrote:

Double-hit is hard to see, but when the racket can move faster than the ball, it becomes a definitive prove of the possibility of prolonged contact.
The reason it's hard to see is because it's not happening.  Watching the interminable loop of a tennis backhand, there is no double hit.  There is not even any "prolonged contact".

If you are a genuine scientist - as you claim to be - why not simply get a high speed camera and provide us with proof?  Until then, you have nothing to say.
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Happened to me at the LA Open. I did a double hit and scored the point. Opponent pointed out that I did a double hit (finger, then racket) and I confirmed that indeed, it was a double hit. Opponent thought that it was his point but I informed him that the rules changed and brought a umpire to the table to explain the changed rule to my opponent..
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Originally posted by Pushblocker Pushblocker wrote:

Happened to me at the LA Open. I did a double hit and scored the point. Opponent pointed out that I did a double hit (finger, then racket) and I confirmed that indeed, it was a double hit. Opponent thought that it was his point but I informed him that the rules changed and brought a umpire to the table to explain the changed rule to my opponent..


Happened at least twice to me during club league matches and once at a USATT tournament. Two out of three cases my opponents stopped and thought they won the point.
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Points: 20 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fall_river Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/04/2015 at 8:12am
deliberately double hits serve?
https://youtu.be/UiEcqpDBiFc

Also prolonged contact might be the key to consistency and power.
We need to keep our mind open.
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Tassie52 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by fall_river fall_river wrote:

deliberately double hits serve?

If you'd like to identify which of these serves he "deliberately double hits", I'd be most interested.  As far as I can see, there are no double hits; just great serves.
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wturber View Drop Down
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Originally posted by fall_river fall_river wrote:

deliberately double hits serve?
https://youtu.be/UiEcqpDBiFc

Also prolonged contact might be the key to consistency and power.
We need to keep our mind open.

Those of us who have looked into dwell times and have viewed high speed photos and videos have little reason to have an "open mind" mind about this.  The actual dwell time is so short that the idea that a human bean could somehow modulated their stroke so as to extend our somehow double up this contact seem absurd.  I'm with Tassie on this.  My mind is at "show me" on this topic.
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Originally posted by wturber wturber wrote:

Originally posted by fall_river fall_river wrote:

deliberately double hits serve?
https://youtu.be/UiEcqpDBiFc

Also prolonged contact might be the key to consistency and power.
We need to keep our mind open.

Those of us who have looked into dwell times and have viewed high speed photos and videos have little reason to have an "open mind" mind about this.  The actual dwell time is so short that the idea that a human bean could somehow modulated their stroke so as to extend our somehow double up this contact seem absurd.  I'm with Tassie on this.  My mind is at "show me" on this topic.
How about the idea of racquet acceleration causing multiple hits or increased dwell time?
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Baal View Drop Down
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No.
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wturber View Drop Down
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Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Originally posted by wturber wturber wrote:

Originally posted by fall_river fall_river wrote:

deliberately double hits serve?
https://youtu.be/UiEcqpDBiFc

Also prolonged contact might be the key to consistency and power.
We need to keep our mind open.

Those of us who have looked into dwell times and have viewed high speed photos and videos have little reason to have an "open mind" mind about this.  The actual dwell time is so short that the idea that a human bean could somehow modulated their stroke so as to extend our somehow double up this contact seem absurd.  I'm with Tassie on this.  My mind is at "show me" on this topic.
How about the idea of racquet acceleration causing multiple hits or increased dwell time?

Given the differences in mass, no.  To clarify where I am on this, theorize away.  I just don't think it is worth paying attention to anything short of direct physical evidence.
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smackman View Drop Down
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Points: 3264 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smackman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/04/2015 at 5:00pm
A accidental double hit is just play on, but could we learn to do it on purpose?
 when we were kids my brother could somehow do this double hit sliding serve anytime he wanted
I still never knew how (even 40+ years later)
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jrscatman View Drop Down
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Points: 4585 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrscatman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/04/2015 at 11:31pm
Originally posted by jumpulse jumpulse wrote:

Dear jrscatman,

Thank you for raising a good and subtle question: “I watched the Del Potro backhand video on youtube - why do you say that was a double hit? It looked like clean hit, with the racquet accelerating on contact.

I am missing the concept, links are very confusing.”

Double-hit is hard to see, but when the racket can move faster than the ball, it becomes a definitive prove of the possibility of prolonged contact. When the racket is accelerating during a prolonged contact, the acceleration has to slow down sometime and the ball might microscopically oscillate in and out of the ball. You can try double hit by 1. Moving your racket slowly to a standing ball (zero velocity), 2. Upon contact, swing your racket with as much acceleration as possible (you are applying a jumpulse, a sudden change of force), 3. End the swing with an extreme follow through (this is the real reason for follow through). Please report back to me, if you are successful. Thanks. Hugh

jumpulse - I tried the experiment you suggested. I feel it was successful - but need to test it more. I decide to start another thread on the subject. This thread is about legality of double hits - jumpulse topic is different. Here is the link to the new thread:
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hungry cow View Drop Down
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Points: 297 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hungry cow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 12:44pm
Could it be Sid messing with people again?
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the_theologian View Drop Down
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Points: 3895 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote the_theologian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 12:45pm
Originally posted by hungry cow hungry cow wrote:

Could it be Sid messing with people again?

that was one of my guesses for the culprit
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